New JT Gladiator Steering Issue TSB 08-074-20 (for "Improved Steering Feel")

[Backwoodsraider]

Yeah, different dealers are in different regions and get parts from different places.
Even in Iowa, the dealer I bought from is in a different region than the one that we're buying my wife's new Grand Cherokee through. I think one was Chicago or KC and the other is in the Denver region. Both dealers are in Iowa.
My JT itself was shipped and arrived in 2 days - I suspect it will be 2 weeks for my wife's new GC to get here once done.

Yeah, i understand that. I dont think from the time the tsb came out to the time i went in i would be that far down the list though. at least it will be getting done

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[Mouse]

All hope is not lost - my dealer returned my JTR back to me cleaner than it was when they got it. Its unfortunate that there are lazy/poor customer service at some dealerships, but some still take pride in a job well done.

 

[Lynn_F]

Has anyone had a good experience on this TSB in the DFW area? I scheduled a time for just the diagnosis with Forest Lane Jeep in Dallas. When I tried to drop it off this morning they told me they need 2-3 days to diagnose and have no loaners available. That seems a bit ridiculous...

I was told the same thing and threw a fit...it turns out your warranty will pay for a rental. If they don't have any at the dealer then you request that they get one from a rental company.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

For those who kept claiming "its' a Jeep thing" or "they are all that way" or "wander is normal" and that sort of BS many of us heard early on - does anyone think that the Grand Cherokee and other Jeeps with SOLID axles would have sold well and attracted family people, women and others, had THEY wandered and had loose steering?

The design under the Grand Cherokees such as the WJ, ZJ and so on are designed almost exactly like the JT is - solid axle, 4 control arms, drag link, track bar and so on. And people around here LIFT those, too, and don't have issues.

We've owned Grand Cherokees since they first came out, almost every single version or style going all the way back. Not a single one of them wandered or had loose steering.
My WJ handles decent, although I have to admit that with 127,000 miles on it, some of the bushings are aged a bit, the shocks may actually be original and it's not been aligned or the front end serviced in years (other than me greasing the upper ball joints, none of the other joints are greaseable) so it's no shock that it's not like a new sports car. But it drives and handles fine.
It's the SAME BASIC DESIGN as the JT.

If I had thought of that earlier I should have tossed that back against some of the naysayers.
Frankly, my JT now handles better than my WJ. And that's how it should be since they've learned and improved in the last decade or more.

 

[Tapped_Out]

For those who kept claiming "its' a Jeep thing" or "they are all that way" or "wander is normal" and that sort of BS many of us heard early on - does anyone think that the Grand Cherokee and other Jeeps with SOLID axles would have sold well and attracted family people, women and others, had THEY wandered and had loose steering?

The design under the Grand Cherokees such as the WJ, ZJ and so on are designed almost exactly like the JT is - solid axle, 4 control arms, drag link, track bar and so on. And people around here LIFT those, too, and don't have issues.

We've owned Grand Cherokees since they first came out, almost every single version or style going all the way back. Not a single one of them wandered or had loose steering.
My WJ handles decent, although I have to admit that with 127,000 miles on it, some of the bushings are aged a bit, the shocks may actually be original and it's not been aligned or the front end serviced in years (other than me greasing the upper ball joints, none of the other joints are greaseable) so it's no shock that it's not like a new sports car. But it drives and handles fine.
It's the SAME BASIC DESIGN as the JT.

If I had thought of that earlier I should have tossed that back against some of the naysayers.
Frankly, my JT now handles better than my WJ. And that's how it should be since they've learned and improved in the last decade or more.

I could apply a similar analogy to the military's Humvee. I've driven Hummers in the Army that had less steering wander than this new Gladiator.

 

[cecaa850]

For those who kept claiming "its' a Jeep thing" or "they are all that way" or "wander is normal" and that sort of BS many of us heard early on -

Prior to the updated part coming out it that statement was actually true. What else is the dealership going to tell you? Basically it would be "normal by comparison". The dealership can't re-engineer your vehicle and can only replace parts with parts that the manufacturer supplies them with.

 

[Tapped_Out]

Prior to the updated part coming out it that statement was actually true. What else is the dealership going to tell you? Basically it would be "normal by comparison". The dealership can't re-engineer your vehicle and can only replace parts with parts that the manufacturer supplies them with.

The problem is owners are having various degrees of success. For example, I had an appointment yesterday for mine. An hour later I drove away with the new steering gear and accompanying parts on order. No hassle. No disagreements. Effortlessly, the dealer agreed to fix it. Excellent customer service.

In contrast, read the experiences of other owners, such as the DFW, TX crowd.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Prior to the updated part coming out it that statement was actually true. What else is the dealership going to tell you? Basically it would be "normal by comparison". The dealership can't re-engineer your vehicle and can only replace parts with parts that the manufacturer supplies them with.

No, not really. It's NOT a Jeep thing at all. Normal? No, not when we had some that drove fine by comparison. Mine was far better than many others.
Take a 2016 Wrangler - these were worse, so how could a dealership suggest "it's a Jeep thing" or "that's normal" - any tech worth their salt should instead say "it looks like a lot of the JTs have a steering issue". I go back to my WJ - SAME steering, SAME suspension design, SAME solid axle up front (well, an older version to be sure, and 3.55 ratio) it handled and drove and steered fine. So how could one that's worse be "a Jeep thing".
If I was working at a Jeep shop when these came out - I would have told people "these have a problem" and not "it's normal" or "it's a Jeep thing" because I would have driven enough other Jeeps to know it wasn't right. Again, some were not bad at all - mine wandered, not horribly like some JT owners here have said theirs did, mine didn't pull at all and there was no play in the wheel, so if I had driven a few I'd have known better than it being normal.
It's that today's techs just don't have the basic skills or ability to troubleshoot. It's all lost today.
Looking at my poll I put up months ago - it's obvious this was a different animal as many folks checked the spot that said "my other Jeeps don't do this", etc.

I'd be the guy working in the shop saying "these new trucks have a problem".
Granted, the dealership shop can't re-engineer things, but they were denying a problem even existed!
that's worse than admitting it and not being able to do anything about it yet.

 

[cecaa850]

The problem is owners are having various degrees of success. For example, I had an appointment yesterday for mine. An hour later I drove away with the new steering gear and accompanying parts on order. No hassle. No disagreements. Effortlessly, the dealer agreed to fix it. Excellent customer service.

In contrast, read the experiences of other owners, such as the DFW, TX crowd.

No question that some are getting the run around and that's definitely not right.

 

[cecaa850]

I'd be the guy working in the shop saying "these new trucks have a problem".
Granted, the dealership shop can't re-engineer things, but they were denying a problem even existed!
that's worse than admitting it and not being able to do anything about it yet.

You'd be the guy that would never talk to a customer then. Not unless you want to be involved in a law suit between the customer, manufacturer and dealer. "This level 3 certified Jeep tech says that there's a problem with my vehicle and you're refusing to fix it".

If the manufacturer says there's not a problem, there's not a problem as far as the dealership is concerned. You call engineering and they say it's "normal" and that replacing the gear won't fix anything. The dealership is stuck between a rock and a hard place. They want to fix your vehicle but have no way to do it.

 

[cecaa850]

It's that today's techs just don't have the basic skills or ability to troubleshoot. It's all lost today.

Couldn't disagree more. If you know there's a problem and there's not a part out to fix it what do you do? Why blame the tech? Techs are like Drs, teachers, lawyers, plumbers, etc. There's good ones and bad ones. They don't all suck because it's "today" and not the good 'ol days.

 

[Tapped_Out]

Couldn't disagree more. If you know there's a problem and there's not a part out to fix it what do you do? Why blame the tech? Techs are like Drs, teachers, lawyers, plumbers, etc. There's good ones and bad ones. They don't all suck because it's "today" and not the good 'ol days.

My tech said JEEP is only giving each dealership one steering gear per week until the supply chain issues for this part get corrected.

 

[cecaa850]

My tech said JEEP is only giving each dealership one steering gear per week until the supply chain issues for this part get corrected.

That's correct from everything I've heard as well.

 

[Gatorized]

You'd be the guy that would never talk to a customer then. Not unless you want to be involved in a law suit between the customer, manufacturer and dealer. "This level 3 certified Jeep tech says that there's a problem with my vehicle and you're refusing to fix it".

If the manufacturer says there's not a problem, there's not a problem as far as the dealership is concerned. You call engineering and they say it's "normal" and that replacing the gear won't fix anything. The dealership is stuck between a rock and a hard place. They want to fix your vehicle but have no way to do it.

The difference is you don’t lie to the customer - “ there is something wrong, we are aware and have notified the manufacturer” would be much preferred over “it’s a Jeep thing - nothing we can do”. Clearly FCA did know or there wouldn’t be a TSB.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

You'd be the guy that would never talk to a customer then. Not unless you want to be involved in a law suit between the customer, manufacturer and dealer. "This level 3 certified Jeep tech says that there's a problem with my vehicle and you're refusing to fix it".

If the manufacturer says there's not a problem, there's not a problem as far as the dealership is concerned. You call engineering and they say it's "normal" and that replacing the gear won't fix anything. The dealership is stuck between a rock and a hard place. They want to fix your vehicle but have no way to do it.

Now that's really stretching things a bit - lawsuit? Have you worked in shops?

Refusing to fix it? How can it be fixed if engineering hasn't released a fix yet.
You're over-simplifying things- the timeline, etc.

Form what we KNOW for FACT, the manufacturer never said there was no problem.
You can BET that some shops saw it as a problem - likely that's why there was finally a fix from Jeep - a few shops realized there was something going on. That's usually what it takes - shops reporting back that they have seen troubles and asking Jeep for help. It's not the few dozen NHTSA complaints - it's dealer shops agreeing there's a problem combined with customer complaints. Takes more than a few.

AFAWK, there was never a word from Jeep to the dealers on telling the dealers to say "it's normal" - not that came out in the forum.
I'll bet it was the shops deciding to say that, not Jeep telling the shop to say that.
I'd like to see a post where a member said they went to the dealership and the dealership worked with FCA and got a quote from FCA saying "tell 'em it's normal" or Jeep telling the dealer "there is no problem" - the dealers never worked that hard.
As far as we know that never happened.
It's more like the dealership shops pushing back at the customer. I'd bet that almost none of them ever did anything further than tell the customer "you don't have a problem" - I'd bet they never contacted Jeep. Just because they didn't KNOW of any problem, they told the customer there IS no problem.
If I hadn't gotten Jeep directly involved with my tonneau cover and taken the TSB in, the dealers here would have never in a million years even bothered to ask Jeep if something was going on. They don't do that as a normal practice. They kept telling me that cover was normal. Two shops did that. Even the second time, they didn't want to call Jeep even though I gave them a name and number to call - no, there's no problem, we won't do that. Then another guy spoke up and said yeah, call them, I've heard of this.

This goes right back to the dealer shops NOT looking into it or not even trying to see if there really WAS something to it. If I hadn't taken the TSB to the dealer shop, they'd not have known - they were the sort that never contacted Jeep to see if they were aware of anything - so as far as WE know, Jeep never told the dealers it was normal - they likely never asked.

The techs these days don't get to talk to customers anyway - they are shielded that way.
You go through management or the service writers.
And you aren't refusing to fix it - you are not ABLE to yet.
I would never lie to a customer. I'll let the boss do that - and that's exactly what happened in one shop, and I walked out.

Really, honestly my biggest beef was with people HERE pushing back hard at complaining JT owners "get over it, it's just the way they are".
No it's not.

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