Bronco is fullsize - no comparison

[Rahkmalla]

if you eliminate the options that attract the pure true driver enthusiasts even if only a couple percent of the population then your product line is just vanilla wanna be and loses its credibility as those purists will migrate to whoever will offer these things and the vehicle reputation will follow.

Just like how all the diehard corvette enthusiasts abandoned the C8 right? C7 were sitting on dealer lots waiting for customers to show up. C8s coming on their 3rd model year and are still sold out.

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[hjdca]

When jeep stops putting manual transmissions in wranglers and gladiators they will no longer be jeeps. Lots of car guys are enthusiasts for driving. The market has plenty of options for all levels of engagement but if you eliminate the options that attract the pure true driver enthusiasts even if only a couple percent of the population then your product line is just vanilla wanna be and loses its credibility as those purists will migrate to whoever will offer these things and the vehicle reputation will follow. Win on Sunday sell on Monday sort of thing. Jeep understands this whole dynamic...ford doesn’t have a clue. If you’re going to take on jeep you need to outdo them at their own game. Building a bloated cartoon character version with more street happy guts won’t work. You don’t get in the game long owned by one by offering something close.

You have a great point. We have Willy's Jeeps on our windshield. It is there to remind us of the great Jeep heritage. If we eliminate the stick, eliminate the fold down windshield, etc...; then, maybe that heritage becomes only marketing --- just like the Defender.....

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Big difference between the transmission and the windshield..........

So far no one has listed big advantages (technical and practical advantages) of the manual over the auto. Preference, "it's what I demand", "only real men drive sticks", "I like it better" and so on - but other than personal preference - is there a place the manual is superior, especially in every day use or even on trails?
Just curious.
I've owned trucks of all types, and all transmission configurations, including 4 speeds with 2 speed differentials, 2, 3, 4, 6 and 8 speed automatics, 3, 4, 5 and 6 speed manual, light trucks, grain trucks, and more.
I've driven the boom trucks of the local power company, tractors, and more so I don't need explanations of how each works and what they do - just wondering what some see as real advantages where one is actually better - other than preference.

What situations exist where the manual is absolutely better or can do something the automatic can't do - and that more than 1% of the Jeep population may encounter.

 

[Jt-wrx]

Only a niche group, about 10 percent, of Wrangler buyers still buy the manual transmission V6 Wrangler.

Sales of manual-transmission cars dropped to just 1.1 percent of all new-vehicle sales in the U.S in 2019.

The Sam’s 4×4 study showed that, since the 2007 introduction of the Wrangler JK, automatic transmissions are increasing in popularity for both off-roaders and city drivers. A review of the 2017 JKU Wranglers listed on Cars.com and Autotrader, showed whopping 81 percent with automatic transmissions.

“An automatic is great if you’ve stopped on a slick rock and need to get moving again,” Guffey says. “Our experience is an automatic also keeps better momentum through snow, sand, and mud.”

Personal preference and opinion - that's all it is. People can gripe or complain or claim one is necessary and they won't buy anything without all they want - it's still personal opinion and choice and not a fact. Jeep will survive with automatics in the future. Even off-road enthusiasts are finding advantages with automatics.
The number of "purists" is dwindling. Attrition. Jeep must keep up and move forward or die.
Many can point out the advantages of an automatic in many situations, but few can point out the advantages of a stick in many situations. The advantages are limited and are typically "this is what I WANT" rather than "it's better because (of these facts)
Want is what's driving manual transmissions, not a whopping list of advantages.
The old idea that an automatic is for wimps and women and manuals are what real men drive is dead except in a few minds.

You miss the point, the majority of these fewer guys and gals buying the manuals do the things with these jeeps that give them cred...win On sunday sell on Monday. You don’t wanna lose those people it would be unwise to drop the manual for enthusiast vehicles. Lots of these are picked up by the hardcore used and manual is desired. So there’s an intangible dynamic that doesn’t factor into the sales and marketing and profit thing you’re talking about. It would be the end of jeep jeeps if they dropped the manual. As for ford they were smart to include one...as Toyota has done for awhile on not just the taco but the fj as well. Jeep still the best jeep of them all and ford took their shot and came up well short.

 

[Jt-wrx]

Just like how all the diehard corvette enthusiasts abandoned the C8 right? C7 were sitting on dealer lots waiting for customers to show up. C8s coming on their 3rd model year and are still sold out.

time will tell, as you’ll see in my previous comments there is an intangible dynamic that goes beyond the current marketing stats and profits etc. it will turn out to be a bad idea that corvette didn’t offer a stick in the c8, you may not see it right away but you will see it, they lost sales due to that, generational sales

and to the guy who said Ford should have checked with me before releasing the bronco...yes they should have, or someone else that has a solid grasp of the 40,000’ view of basic fundamentals of the goal at hand and not just 20/20 image of the weeds in the ditch

If you’re gonna do something do it right. They half assed it and they blew it.

nobody will be watching for these used broncos for builds, the jeep still the better platform for building the insane which lends to the credibility, aftermarket, and many continued indirect sales due to these intangibles

 

[sharpsicle]

nobody will be watching for these used broncos for builds, the jeep still the better platform for building the insane which lends to the credibility, aftermarket, and many continued indirect sales due to these intangibles

Uh, that's a crap statement. You have no idea what's going to happen, none of us do. Quit pretending like you have some insane knowledge that has been overlooked by industry experts. The Bronco is so new that your comments are like digging a grave for a newborn at this point.

You'd fit right in at a place like CarBuzz or Jalopnik. No knowledge, no substance, and tons of unfounded assumptions.

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

You miss the point, the majority of these fewer guys and gals buying the manuals do the things with these jeeps that give them cred...win On sunday sell on Monday. You don’t wanna lose those people it would be unwise to drop the manual for enthusiast vehicles. Lots of these are picked up by the hardcore used and manual is desired. So there’s an intangible dynamic that doesn’t factor into the sales and marketing and profit thing you’re talking about. It would be the end of jeep jeeps if they dropped the manual. As for ford they were smart to include one...as Toyota has done for awhile on not just the taco but the fj as well. Jeep still the best jeep of them all and ford took their shot and came up well short.

LOL, just about every competition rig is an auto.

 

[bleda2002]

Uh, that's a crap statement. You have no idea what's going to happen, none of us do. Quit pretending like you have some insane knowledge that has been overlooked by industry experts. The Bronco is so new that your comments are like digging a grave for a newborn at this point.

You'd fit right in at a place like CarBuzz or Jalopnik. No knowledge, no substance, and tons of unfounded assumptions.

OP caught another one:

Seriously though, of course the bronco will have its fans just like an FJ, 4 runner, tacoma, etc. Its not all about capabilities or else we'd all be driving the same 5-6 cars. Long term who knows what will happen, the bronco could reach jeep status, or it just might be a defender or an FJ. Both still popular but not the icon of offroad that is pictured when someone thinks of an off road vehicle (in the us at least).

I will say, the OP is a troll, but he's probably not wrong about the fact that the jeep platform is still the best starting platform for the insane builds like buggy chasis etc because of the solid axles and the ease of swapping them as well as the sheer aftermarket support for jeeps.

 

[Jt-wrx]

LOL, just about every competition rig is an auto.

right, that's who buys used eh? lol, swing and a miss

you're not gonna develop the aftermarket which develops the legends which develops the reputations which develops into the generational sales such is the monster which is jeep...with what ford just came out with, ford is staying in their lane lol - you had to come out with a solid front axle build worthy lean mean simple beast to come against jeep because that's what they are, ford just another swing and a miss, they will take more Toyota sales than anything, they just built a fat four runner fj cross, there will always be 100 jeeps to 1 of these on the trail, the truth will sting a few, always does

 

[sharpsicle]

 

[LostWoods]

Big difference between the transmission and the windshield..........

So far no one has listed big advantages (technical and practical advantages) of the manual over the auto. Preference, "it's what I demand", "only real men drive sticks", "I like it better" and so on - but other than personal preference - is there a place the manual is superior, especially in every day use or even on trails?
Just curious.
I've owned trucks of all types, and all transmission configurations, including 4 speeds with 2 speed differentials, 2, 3, 4, 6 and 8 speed automatics, 3, 4, 5 and 6 speed manual, light trucks, grain trucks, and more.
I've driven the boom trucks of the local power company, tractors, and more so I don't need explanations of how each works and what they do - just wondering what some see as real advantages where one is actually better - other than preference.

What situations exist where the manual is absolutely better or can do something the automatic can't do - and that more than 1% of the Jeep population may encounter.

1. Engine braking
2. ...

Only time I've missed my third petal in this truck is towing and long downhills.

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

1. Engine braking
2. ...

Only time I've missed my third petal in this truck is towing and long downhills.

2. They can take on water and not die.

3. Whatever OP said about winning Sunday and selling Monday, intangible dynamics, keeping Jeep afloat. That crap too.

 

[AKDrifter]

Big difference between the transmission and the windshield..........

So far no one has listed big advantages (technical and practical advantages) of the manual over the auto. Preference, "it's what I demand", "only real men drive sticks", "I like it better" and so on - but other than personal preference - is there a place the manual is superior, especially in every day use or even on trails?
Just curious.

There are 2 that I can say without doubt from the spec sheet. Highway MPG is 1mpg higher in the manual, and the crawl ratio on paper is lower in the manual vs the auto. There really is no difference between the manual and the auto in low as far as shifting goes. 3rd gear works from 0-15ish mph very little clutch input is required off road, it is as close to an automatic experience as a manual can get. I set it in 3rd and go until I really need to idle through something and then I use 1st. I don't use 5/6 almost at all offroad though I have tested them, 6th tops out max redline at about 35mph. I enjoy the offroad characteristics of this manual, more so than my JK or my Tacomas.

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

There are 2 that I can say without doubt from the spec sheet. Highway MPG is 1mpg higher in the manual, and the crawl ratio on paper in the Rubicon is lower in the manual vs the auto. There really is no difference between the manual and the auto in low as far as shifting goes. 3rd gear works from 0-15ish mph very little clutch input is required off road, it is as close to an automatic experience as a manual can get. I set it in 3rd and go until I really need to idle through something and then I use 1st. I don't use 5/6 almost at all offroad though I have tested them, 6th tops out max redline at about 35mph. I enjoy the offroad characteristics of this manual, more so than my JK or my Tacomas.

Crawl ratio will always be lower with an auto due to torque multiplication from the torque converter.

The 77:1 figure on paper for the auto is not adjusted for torque multiplication.

 

[AKDrifter]

Crawl ratio will always be lower with an auto due to torque multiplication from the torque converter.

The 77:1 figure on paper for the auto is not adjusted for torque multiplication.

That's why I say on paper, I really only bring it up because Jeep never advertises the 77:1, they only advertise the manuals on paper 84:1. Like I said, there's really not going to be much difference offroad. I either idle across a river in 1st or for almost everything else I use 3rd. There's not much shifting or clutching involved, just skinny pedal.

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