Engine Oil Analysis: High Silicon

[Maximus Gladius]

I really wonder how I've gotten by all of these years - not a single engine loss (not even my own builds or builds for others over the years), oil samples look great.

You’ve gotten by all those years because you had your hand involved in it. You’d fit in with the top 1% of all things done right influenced by levels of OCD not seen by many. I’m actual surprised you did oil samples, you never understand why I do them and even had me explain why. You’re the only person I know that can tell if oil is good or not by smell and rubbing it between your fingers.

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[ShadowsPapa]

You’ve gotten by all those years because you had your hand involved in it. You’d fit in with the top 1% of all things done right influenced by levels of OCD not seen by many. I’m actual surprised you did oil samples, you never understand why I do them and even had me explain why. You’re the only person I know that can tell if oil is good or not by smell and rubbing it between your fingers.

I did the oil analysis out of curiosity. I guess to either prove to myself, or disprove my oils and changes strategy.
Can't really do much more with the results than that.

Back in the 1980s, I contract fed hogs for a local pig farmer. His buildings, feed lots and so on were maxed out. I had a big barn, nice concrete lot next to a water source. So he drew up a contract where he'd furnish me the feeder pigs, I'd feed then out, and he'd sell them when done. My pay be xx per pig, plus bonuses for efficiency, low death loss, and penalties for higher death loss, poor feed efficiency and so on.
After the 2nd batch, Tom came to me and said "Bill, you are killing me with these feed efficiency numbers and the low death losses". He wasn't making much, but I was.......

 

[Maximus Gladius]

I did the oil analysis out of curiosity. I guess to either prove to myself, or disprove my oils and changes strategy.

Yup^^^ that about sums it up.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

In all instances where someone wished they should have changed super early was when they saw an oil analysis report highlighting high silicon or in the case of my first engine, internal coolant leak. Lab told me, at that time, “don’t worry about this one, we often see the factory fill is dirty. Let’s see what the next one shows” and of course I had a manufacturer defect which allowed coolant in and FCA didn’t care.

Nobody who is made aware of dirty factory fill via analysis ever says, maybe I should have left it in there longer. So, changing early isn’t fear mongering, it’s just starting early with a clean slate you know, as a pose to leave it in longer based on trust of those that have no vested interest.

High silicon in oil without other indicators is a nothing burger.
It may be due to anti-foaming agents in the oil, engine sealants used during assembly.
It needs to be looked at in conjunction with other things - high wear metals, or a trend, maybe along with coolant loss........
but with modern materials and coatings used in engines, alone, you can almost ignore it.

Define "dirty factory fill"...........

BITOG has almost daily discussions on the topic and the consensus is - there is no consensus other than it's a "coveted" thing, you are one of the elite if you do the early dump as they call it while others are on 300,000 miles doing it by the book.

So, whatever makes you feel good is the right answer. There's no evidence supporting either method, no long-term studies, no data collected over time and even if there were such studies, it would be meaningless unless all were treated identically in a lab.
So do whatever makes you feel good.

 

[Rubicon6MT]

It's just the old school way of thinking dating back to when it was believed factories used "break-in oil" in the engines.

I actually did see a post on here that mentioned factory oil can have additives to assist with breaking in a new engine.

I didn’t investigate that claim any further, but I also hadn’t considered that break-in oil was even a possibility, and that possibility took away some of the urgency to get the first oil change done.

This is the first vehicle I’ve owned where oil change intervals are determined by the oil life monitor, so I decided to wait until there was 50% life remaining, which ended up being 4,000 miles.

The base number for my sample was 7.27, which I believe puts it at the low end range of fresh engine oil for gasoline engines (7-10 mg KOH/g).

I’m interested to see future test results, and how the oil life monitor percentage compares to lab results.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I’m interested to see future test results, and how the oil life monitor percentage compares to lab results.

It will, or should, follow very closely, as demonstrated by Lake. He did a number of tests showing just how accurate those OLMs really are.
My own lab results have shown this to be the case as well.

This is the first vehicle I’ve owned where oil change intervals are determined by the oil life monitor,

That system has been around in cars and Jeeps for many years! GM I believe came out with the first in American cars. It's not a new system and is well thought-out.

 

[Rubicon6MT]

That system has been around in cars and Jeeps for many years! GM I believe came out with the first in American cars. It's not a new system and is well thought-out.

I should have added… first vehicle I’ve owned with an oil life monitor and no mileage based oil change intervals in the owner’s manual.

 

[Deleted member 57233]

I should have added… first vehicle I’ve owned with an oil life monitor and no mileage based oil change intervals in the owner’s manual.

My manual says use the oil life monitor, but never exceed 10,000 miles or 12 months.

 

[Rubicon6MT]

If someone here could make a sound argument for leaving the first change for way longer, I’d at least consider it, but old good habits are hard to break and nothing bad ever came of it.

Could you make the argument that changing the oil too soon means the break-in hasn’t been completed, and additional contaminants will make their way into the fresh oil?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Could you make the argument that changing the oil too soon means the break-in hasn’t been completed, and additional contaminants will make their way into the fresh oil?

I believe it's Honda that says to not change it before a certain mileage.
there's a lot of back and forth on it on BITOG. Some have given quotes from their owners manual stating to leave the oil in for a minimum number of miles.

And another post lists 3 companies that have so little wear metals in the first oil there's nothing to gain by doing it early - new manufacturing techniques

 

[Hootbro]

I had 111 PPM silicone on my first oil analysis on my 2022 Rubicon JT at 3K miles. It will drop over time.

 

[Maximus Gladius]

Could you make the argument that changing the oil too soon means the break-in hasn’t been completed, and additional contaminants will make their way into the fresh oil?

It’s not one I’ve heard. I guess because break-in is already done at the factory, (from what I’ve read @ShadowsPapa state) my running it at least 1000kms (600 miles) or as soon after
that as possible is going to be ok.
At least one detail that tells me the rings have seated is no air blowing out the oil fill hole or dip stick when engine running so break-in was done nicely on this engine at 1567 kms.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

At least one detail that tells me the rings have seated is no air blowing out the oil fill hole or dip stick when engine running so break-in was done nicely on this engine at 1567 kms.

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHH - don't say that too loud!!

Just kidding - that's a good sign. Maybe something is going to go right for you for a change?

 

[ATL_Rubi]

Can confirm as others have, silicon was high on my first oil change at 5,040 miles, 123 and continually dropped thereafter.

 

[Maximus Gladius]

Had a look at my first silicon levels for both engines.
#1 90 + coolant detected
#2 47 (but had over double the oil) so maybe would have read 94 ? After all this time and 131k kms (80k miles) silicon reads 7
(and yes, I use a K&N filter, @ShadowsPapa favourite 🫣)

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