JT(4xE) vs Ford F-150 Lightning

[Undecided]

Alright so a JT 4xE doesn't exist and may not ever come and an F-150 is not a mid sizes truck, but I saw this and makes me think this is going to be hard to beat if they ever put 4xE into the JT.

The base model with 230 miles of range starts at $39,974, while the extended range version starts in the mid-$50,000s and can go about 300 miles.

https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/19/22442777/ford-f-150-lightning-electric-truck-specs-price

If the JT did take 4xE at that range, I would be very tempted.
Anyone know how towing and payload is looking on these?

Nvm, missed it in the article.

But because of the weight difference in the battery packs, the standard range Lightning wins out on payload capacity, as it can carry up to 2,000 pounds versus the extended range’s 1,800-pound max.

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[sharpsicle]

Something that I've discussed a lot lately on these electric trucks is the range while towing. Okay, sure it states 300 mile range, but that's just the truck in economical conditions. If I start towing my 23 foot center console with it, how badly is that going to impact the range? I'm willing to bet it's going to eat a bigger percentage than a standard gas-powered truck. They'll never tell you what that's going to look like either.

I wouldn't be surprised if the range while towing 5,000lbs drops by 50%. That's a tough pill to swallow. An F150 that needs to stop and recharge for an hour (more if it's not the 150kW station) every 150-175 miles while towing is just a waste of a full-size truck.

Heck, having to wait over an hour every 300 miles on a trip is just a kick in the balls as it is.

That's where I like the Jeep version that is hybrid. I can still get good range, fill-up on trips, and haul without fear of massive depletion and recharge times. And around town on daily commutes, I can go almost entirely electric. It's the best of both worlds until the charging networks get up to speed.

 

[OrangeTJ]

Something that I've discussed a lot lately on these electric trucks is the range while towing. Okay, sure it states 300 mile range, but that's just the truck in economical conditions. If I start towing my 23 foot center console with it, how badly is that going to impact the range? I'm willing to bet it's going to eat a bigger percentage than a standard gas-powered truck. They'll never tell you what that's going to look like either.

I wouldn't be surprised if the range while towing 5,000lbs drops by 50%. That's a tough pill to swallow. An F150 that needs to stop and recharge for an hour (more if it's not the 150kW station) every 150-175 miles while towing is just a waste of a full-size truck.

Heck, having to wait over an hour every 300 miles on a trip is just a kick in the balls as it is.

That's where I like the Jeep version that is hybrid. I can still get good range, fill-up on trips, and haul without fear of massive depletion and recharge times. And around town on daily commutes, I can go almost entirely electric. It's the best of both worlds until the charging networks get up to speed.

I suspect you are probably about right relative to the reduction in range. I've seen a pretty similar reduction in MPG when using gas tow vehicles as well. Maybe not quite a 50% reduction, but close enough. For example, our 2015 Land Cruiser got about 12 mpg in mixed normal use and about 7 mpg towing our boat that weighs about 6K on the trailer. Seems pretty straightforward that if you nearly double the mass you are trying to propel down the road, you also double the amount of energy it takes to propel that mass. We have (and love) a Tesla Model S, but that is an entirely different animal than a truck that has to be able to haul and tow substantial loads. No doubt the lightning will have plenty of power, though, and would probably be a very awesome local-use pickup and short-haul tow vehicle!

 

[RacerX00]

Ford may have just created the perfect electric truck for 2022, this is going to be a real tough act to follow. For sure if you're hauling/towing big over long distances, wait to see how that looks but if you're not that, man with the trunk in the front, it becomes the perfect family vehicle. Then you add in all that power you have to use for tools and even power your house during a blackout... they're doing all the right things.

I just don't know it's worth comparing to the Gladiator, it's a different class of truck and also clearly isn't as off-road oriented with decrease clearances over standard fueled models to say one thing. Also, your starting weight is over 6,000 lbs!

I'm not sure what I'd want out of an electric Gladiator, it may not be possible in today's EV world. I'd want it to be no less capable off-road than any comparable diesel or gasser... just seems unrealistic.

 

[Firestarter]

4xe has a clutch not a torque converter, thus I will never want one for hardcore off roading.

Alright so a JT 4xE doesn't exist and may not ever come and an F-150 is not a mid sizes truck, but I saw this and makes me think this is going to be hard to beat if they ever put 4xE into the JT.



https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/19/22442777/ford-f-150-lightning-electric-truck-specs-price

If the JT did take 4xE at that range, I would be very tempted.
Anyone know how towing and payload is looking on these?

Nvm, missed it in the article.

 

[TwelveGaugeSage]

4xe has a clutch not a torque converter, thus I will never want one for hardcore off roading.

Two clutches, right? I love the 4xe idea, but I would only go for it if they started offering it with a manual transmission. I just don't see that happening.

 

[Firestarter]

Two clutches, right? I love the 4xe idea, but I would only go for it if they started offering it with a manual transmission. I just don't see that happening.

I'm not sure of the clutch design. Could be a wet multi plate design or a clutch for the motor and engine. I'd rather them have integrated the electric motor onto the crank pulley so that it can be used with any transmission. I'm not sure. I just know that computer controlled clutches for technical slow speed maneuvering is jerky and not good. A standard manual clutch is far smoother with a skilled driver, but the reason why I ditched manual after 16 years of only owning stick is the fact that a torque converter multiplies torque (clutches only reduce torque) and can preload the driveline without risking damage to the transmission components.

 

[WXman]

Spot on about the range being only ideal conditions. Most people will never see 300 miles of range. And while towing I've seen estimates of 100 miles.

Can you imagine trying to go on vacation somewhere and you've got to stop every 100 miles to spend hours recharging? And that's if you can even find a charging station every 100 miles along your route.

These electric trucks are going to go over like a lead balloon. To me it's all gimmick to appease the EPA. It sure as heck doesn't do anything beneficial for the consumer. Cost per mile is the same, and "refilling" an EV is a pain and time consuming.

 

[Fcmalie]

Spot on about the range being only ideal conditions. Most people will never see 300 miles of range. And while towing I've seen estimates of 100 miles.

Can you imagine trying to go on vacation somewhere and you've got to stop every 100 miles to spend hours recharging? And that's if you can even find a charging station every 100 miles along your route.

These electric trucks are going to go over like a lead balloon. To me it's all gimmick to appease the EPA. It sure as heck doesn't do anything beneficial for the consumer. Cost per mile is the same, and "refilling" an EV is a pain and time consuming.

We will probably be looking at Graphine Aluminum Ion batteries before 2030 in a lot of vehicles, the numbers from them so far are extraordinary. Charging 60 times faster than lithium ion, more energy dense, and no cooling required, so less weight in battery packs.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michae...charges-60-times-faster-than-lithium-ion/amp/

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