My dad wants a Renegade Trailhawk but I'm trying to get him into a Wrangler

[bleda2002]

Also, any regular car CAN be turned into a decent off road vehicle with nothing more than some suspension parts and tires. Especially if its got a short wheelbase and short front and rear overhangs.

It worked for Porsche.

This, so this. Off roading for most people is fire roads, gravel roads, and dirt roads with a few holes, dips, and some rocks. Realistically anything that won't get high centered and has decent ATs will get through that stuff pretty readily with nothing more than a rough ride and a slow pace. Unless you plan on going through lots of mud, over large climbs, or "deep" water (more than 10-12 inches) almost any of these awd or 4wd cuvs will work.

Subaru is a prime example, they really aren't anything special but they've convinced people that they some how are off road champions despite really being no better than pretty much any other semi tall cuv with the same tires.

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[WILDHOBO]

This, so this. Off roading for most people is fire roads, gravel roads, and dirt roads with a few holes, dips, and some rocks. Realistically anything that won't get high centered and has decent ATs will get through that stuff pretty readily with nothing more than a rough ride and a slow pace. Unless you plan on going through lots of mud, over large climbs, or "deep" water (more than 10-12 inches) almost any of these awd or 4wd cuvs will work.

Subaru is a prime example, they really aren't anything special but they've convinced people that they some how are off road champions despite really being no better than pretty much any other semi tall cuv with the same tires.

Google a dirt every day video of a renegade doing black bear pass. Most people consider that a real 4x4 trail.

 

[bleda2002]

Google a dirt every day video of a renegade doing black bear pass. Most people consider that a real 4x4 trail.

Good video, thanks for the recommendation. I think it honestly just reinforces what I was agreeing with. Black bear pass is definitely a real dangerous trail but realistically its just ass puckery (rightfully so) and a test of the driver/spotter. There isn't a lot technical there that's going to require big tires, extra high clearance or tons of flex.

The renegade is just as good as the Subarus and bronco sports which isn't a bad thing. I'm saying all those things are plenty adequate for the vast majority of uses. Realistically I think most awd cross overs could probably do similar things if you just fit the biggest bfg ko2 you can stuff on it as they're going to be limited by approach departure and break over which none of them have much to write home about.

 

[dcmdon]

And ford took a stock Bronco sport up that steep skinny rock thing out west (please excuse my ignorance on this place) that people video tape themselves doing in their built 4x4s.

The Subarus actually seem to be really bad. TFL tested several Subarus over the last couple of years and they all cut engine power on slow tricky stuff to preserve the CVT. This is something that a vehicle with a normal torque converter based automatic transmission doesn't need to do.

Edit - hells gate.

 

[Ar4130]

You can't let your Pops drive this vehicle. It's not a proper way for a grown man to get around.

Agreed. No grown ass man should be driving one of those.

 

[JRobes]

Agreed. No grown ass man should be driving one of those.

mopeds are fun, you just don't want to be seen by your friends on one... ?

 

[Yoshi]

Had a Renegade Trailhawk… traded it in for my Gladiator. The Renegade is fine… but… if he wants to modify It in any way he will have a harder time then if he gets a wrangler. For example I wanted the “factory” tow hitch on my Renegade. Since it was so new I had to buy a parts kit, pull the entire back end off to the tires, cut a hole into my plastic bumper, and bolt the tow hitch on myself. If I want a tow hitch on my Gladiator or a wrangler it’s hard to even choose one because there are so many and there are a ton of shops that will stick it on for you if you want. I like gadgets and things that work better. I scare/impress people at work with what I carry on me. The Gladiator fits me better because I want to put stuff in and on it. The resale value of the wrangler and gladiator are much better than the renegade. On the plus side he can probably get more deals to buy the renegade. My trade in value return for the renegade was not as good as an older Silverado comparatively because the dealerships can sell new Renegades with more discounts and such.

also

no one waves at a Renegade. I have had to start waving at wranglers and gladiators. I even got a “nice gladiator” from a random lady on the street less than a month in.

 

[Aonarch]

It's the same car. Literally the same car.

I have to give props to whatever mad FCA employee pitched it. Clearly it is working.

Board room: "How do we sell more FIATs in North America?"

Mad Lad: "We don't."

Board room: "...... I'm sorry?"

Mad Lad: "We sell more Jeeps instead."

Board room: "That doesn't solve for FIAT..."

Mad Lad: "No, no, we just badge the FIAT 500X as a Jeep."

Board room:" Ok...continue"

Mad Lad: "We bring in all of the emotional ties our customers have to Jeep, the 7 slot grille, the headlights, throw on some Trail Rated badges, red recovery hooks."

Loud applause.

FCA/ Stallantis can badge engineer the 500X all they want. The Renegade is still underneath a shitty FIAT that was a total flop here. The platform is crap, the reliability is crap, the drivetrain is crap. It is produced in Italy on the 500X line by a bunch of apathetic workers.

FCA is pandering to the Jeep crowd to sell FIATs in NA, and some of you are clearly falling for it.

 

[JRobes]

I have to give props to whatever mad FCA employee pitched it. Clearly it is working.

Board room: "How do we sell more FIATs in North America?"

Mad Lad: "We don't."

Board room: "...... I'm sorry?"

Mad Lad: "We sell more Jeeps instead."

Board room: "That doesn't solve for FIAT..."

Mad Lad: "No, no, we just badge the FIAT 500X as a Jeep."

Board room:" Ok...continue"

Mad Lad: "We bring in all of the emotional ties our customers have to Jeep, the 7 slot grille, the headlights, throw on some Trail Rated badges, red recovery hooks."

Loud applause.

FCA/ Stallantis can badge engineer the 500X all they want. The Renegade is still underneath a shitty FIAT that was a total flop here. The platform is crap, the reliability is crap, the drivetrain is crap. It is produced in Italy on the 500X line by a bunch of apathetic workers.

FCA is pandering to the Jeep crowd to sell FIATs in NA, and some of you are clearly falling for it.

J Jonah Jameson, is that you?
You realize in no way does your rant here help the conversation? Provide some stats about all the points you're trying to make, otherwise it's just a personal (angry?) opinion. I think we all agree here it's more of an econo-car and not as robust compared to the JL/JT, but the price also reflects that.

 

[Aonarch]

J Jonah Jameson, is that you?
You realize in no way does your rant here help the conversation? Provide some stats about all the points you're trying to make, otherwise it's just a personal (angry?) opinion. I think we all agree here it's more of an econo-car and not as robust compared to the JL/JT, but the price also reflects that.

Provide stats? Stats on what? Anyone who claims Fiats are reliable are smoking crack.

Not an angry rant, more comical.

In the end I don't give a F what some guys dad on an internet forum buys. I just think it is hilarious that people are recommending a Renegade then completely ignoring and even disagreeing with the FACT that it is a rebadged 500X.

It is on the SCCS platform which was designed starting in 2002 and first released with the 2005 Fiat Grande Punto. So it is riding on a 17 year old Fiat platform.

It is built in Melfi, Italy on the 500X and 500L line, because that is what it is.

 

[Motoarch]

J Jonah Jameson, is that you?
You realize in no way does your rant here help the conversation? Provide some stats about all the points you're trying to make, otherwise it's just a personal (angry?) opinion. I think we all agree here it's more of an econo-car and not as robust compared to the JL/JT, but the price also reflects that.

This not an opinion. It's a fact. You know the difference right?

Other than the obvious story at the beginning aside everything he said regarding the 500x and the renegade is 100% factual.

 

[JRobes]

I'm not disputing the fact it's a rebadged (slightly upgraded) FIAT, I'm asking him to clarify the statements of it being "crap" on all fronts.

Do you guys also crap on challengers and chargers since their platforms are so old? They still sell like crazy.

 

[Motoarch]

Provide stats? Stats on what? Anyone who claims Fiats are reliable are smoking crack.

Not an angry rant, more comical.

In the end I don't give a F what some guys dad on an internet forum buys. I just think it is hilarious that people are recommending a Renegade then completely ignoring and even disagreeing with the FACT that it is a rebadged 500X.

It is on the SCCS platform which was designed starting in 2002 and first released with the 2005 Fiat Grande Punto. So it is riding on a 17 year old Fiat platform.

It is built in Melfi, Italy on the 500X and 500L line, because that is what it is.

Fan boys are delusional and unable to cope with the truth when it conflicts with their emotional connection to the thing they love.

It's fine to like a thing. You like the renegade, that's fine. You don't have to justify that but when presented with facts you can't just flat out dismiss them as untruthful.

 

[Motoarch]

I'm not disputing the fact it's a rebadged (slightly upgraded) FIAT, I'm asking him to clarify the statements of it being "crap" on all fronts.

Do you guys also crap on challengers and chargers since their platforms are so old? They still sell like crazy.

Just because something sells in volumn doesn't inherently make it a quality product.

 

[Aonarch]

I'm not disputing the fact it's a rebadged (slightly upgraded) FIAT, I'm asking him to clarify the statements of it being "crap" on all fronts.

Do you guys also crap on challengers and chargers since their platforms are so old? They still sell like crazy.

Owner satisfaction is a 1/5 on the previous model years. Reliability hovers between 1-2/ 5

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