To trade or not, what would you do.........

[ShadowsPapa]

So MMR doesn't take into account for bumpers and winches and stuff like that. It has mine valued at between $33,000 and $37,000 and they offered me $41,000 at the dealership yesterday for mine so I'm assuming the bumpers and maybe the 37's bumper the price up for the dealership. My guy at Hendricks called me this morning and said they would match the offer but do better on the price of one.

And that's fine if it doesn't. There are too many variables on accessories - how well was it done, how cheap or good are the parts. There's a beautiful Rubicon in the showroom where I was last week, but IMO they ruined the looks of the truck with the bumpers that look unhappy and like they are for a MACK truck or a Panzer tank. I told them when they asked what I thought and if I was interested - their bumpers and a couple other mods ruined it for me.
You may love your bumper, others may not. But stock it's a blank canvas. So I can see MMR not accounting for "taste".
If that Rubicon had a MOPAR steel bumper, or even one of the other 3rd party bumpers I think fit the looks of a Gladiator fine, I'd have told them yes, it's a beaut, but way out of my price. Someone will love it as it is, just not me. And that's the risk with accessories, IMO.
Unless a dealer says "we will give you this in trade - and add xxx for your bumper and winch", I'll take mine off. Now if they want it left on, that's different, but they have to be at least close to what it would be worth if I sold them used. (I don't expect new prices for a bumper and winch on a trade - they are used, not new. I would have to make up the difference replacing them, it's a given)

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[Wheelin98TJ]

I looked at your occupation and thought "trust this guy - he knows numbers and facts", and it's because of 'bean counting' (and my wife's methodical spreadsheet tracking of my vacation and sickleave) I was able to retire at 60.

Mega-thanks for the info.

That's very interesting. I knew very very little of MMR. Interesting also is the average mileage (31K on your screenshot?) so the miles under 31 added some value.
Condition - mine now has a small rock chip on the hood smaller than a B-B. One of my own front tires threw a rock forward but because the rock and I were traveling almost the same speed, it was not a "hit" so much as a landing. Otherwise, no scratches or dings I am aware of. It really does wash up like new. (no trails in Iowa, rocks are what farmers haul out of the fields)

I am extremely curious as to what MMR means to people like dealers. I know they'll look at NADA and see much lower numbers than that.




I did a brief search and what I found is what you said...........

@spenchey explained it well, it's what the dealers are paying. It's the wholesale price.

Congrats on the retirement at a young age, that's awesome!

 

[Suszynch]

in my opinion, trading apples for apples wouldn't gain much unless you removed your mods.

but since your here as an addict asking other addicts for advice. I'll just chime in and say if you're gonna do it.
Do the diesel powertrain.. Driven both, own the diesel now.. Night and day difference.
plus right now I'm really not gonna complain about getting 27mpg vs what I was getting in my manual Pentastar JLUR.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

in my opinion, trading apples for apples wouldn't gain much unless you removed your mods.

but since your here as an addict asking other addicts for advice. I'll just chime in and say if you're gonna do it.
Do the diesel powertrain.. Driven both, own the diesel now.. Night and day difference.
plus right now I'm really not gonna complain about getting 27mpg vs what I was getting in my manual Pentastar JLUR.

Nope, no diesel. No reason to.
I don't want the extra expense and maintenance.
People brag about the mpg but leave out the extra oil, filters, DEF and other maintenance and issues. It's as much as emotional thing as practical to many people.
It would add 4 grand (plus 200 tax) to the numbers and make it undoable. That 4 grand buys a lot of gas. (1,000 gallons and over 19,000 miles worth of gas)

Gas engine does fine, cheaper to buy, cheaper to maintain.

Maybe I should refresh the rules on this -
It would be the same drivetrain (3.6 automatic), same color (or snazzberry as an option) but with the full-time transfer case option.
You can't even get the Selec-Trac transfer case with diesel, so one reason for the trade would disappear with the diesel.
I also want to know that if I get hit by the bus tomorrow, my wife will be happy with it and be able to keep it up and fueled.

 

[DirkG]

@ShadowsPapa, I haven't read through the 8 pages thus far, but I didn't see one important factor (to me) which would be color choice. I've got Gator which would be very difficult for me to part with. (edit: I see you want Snazzberry). BUT if I had to do it over again, instead of a Sport S, I'd probably go Rubicon. So going a level up would be very tempting to me. (another edit: I see you're staying with same model).

I was an Economics major and apart from the happiness (measured in "utility") and peace of mind that you would acquire from the new vehicle, which would certainly be worth a monetary value, you have to consider a couple more factors from a financial standpoint. It looks like there's about a $10K - $12K price difference in trade-in and new value. Let's cut the difference and say $11K.

So, for $11K, what do you get? If I read correctly, you're currently around 25K miles, or 11K away from your 36K mile warranty, so with a new vehicle, instead of 11K more miles of warranty coverage, you'll have a brand new 36K miles (delta: you'll get 25k extra miles under warranty). The market value for a Mopar extended warranty right now is a range of $2,500 to $5,000 (depending on vehicle, variables, etc.). Let's say a modest $3K considering you're not getting a full extra 36K as you still have 11K on your current vehicle. So far we're at $3,000 value.

Resale: this is a little tricky as who knows where the automobile landscape will be in 3 years given we're in the post-pandemic ether. I'm saying "3 years" because that's when your 36K mile warranty will have expired. If you take your $11K, subtract the $3K value above, we're at $8K. The question is: will a 2022 Gladiator (I didn't read which model you're interested in - we'll keep it generic) be worth $8,000 more than a similar model 2020 Gladiator? Given historical pricing of Wranglers, absolutely it should. But again, we're in a weird bubble right now, so nothing is guaranteed.

So there are many factors at play here, including mods and personal tastes (color, options, etc.), but IMO, if you look at it through a financial lens, it makes sense.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

@ShadowsPapa, I haven't read through the 8 pages thus far, but I didn't see one important factor (to me) which would be color choice. I've got Gator which would be very difficult for me to part with. (edit: I see you want Snazzberry). BUT if I had to do it over again, instead of a Sport S, I'd probably go Rubicon. So going a level up would be very tempting to me. (another edit: I see you're staying with same model).

I was an Economics major and apart from the happiness (measured in "utility") and peace of mind that you would acquire from the new vehicle, which would certainly be worth a monetary value, you have to consider a couple more factors from a financial standpoint. It looks like there's about a $10K - $12K price difference in trade-in and new value. Let's cut the difference and say $11K.

So, for $11K, what do you get? If I read correctly, you're currently around 25K miles, or 11K away from your 36K mile warranty, so with a new vehicle, instead of 11K more miles of warranty coverage, you'll have a brand new 36K miles (delta: you'll get 25k extra miles under warranty). The market value for a Mopar extended warranty right now is a range of $2,500 to $5,000 (depending on vehicle, variables, etc.). Let's say a modest $3K considering you're not getting a full extra 36K as you still have 11K on your current vehicle. So far we're at $3,000 value.

Resale: this is a little tricky as who knows where the automobile landscape will be in 3 years given we're in the post-pandemic ether. I'm saying "3 years" because that's when your 36K mile warranty will have expired. If you take your $11K, subtract the $3K value above, we're at $8K. The question is: will a 2022 Gladiator (I didn't read which model you're interested in - we'll keep it generic) be worth $8,000 more than a similar model 2020 Gladiator? Given historical pricing of Wranglers, absolutely it should. But again, we're in a weird bubble right now, so nothing is guaranteed.

So there are many factors at play here, including mods and personal tastes (color, options, etc.), but IMO, if you look at it through a financial lens, it makes sense.

I was using very rough figures, knowing depreciation normally isn't a straight line, especially the first couple of years, it's a steep slope normally.

My first choice color is the hydro blue - like my current JT.
Second choice if blue disappeared, OR if there was one on the lot ready to go, would be snazzberry. I'd order blue if I can't find one on the lot, I'd take snazzberry if one existed ready to go.
I'd get these added options - Selec-Trac full time transfer case, MAYBE, MAYBE add aux switches. I have waffled on that one.
We have a loaded Overland and would most likely stick with that - it's what we know, the ride is good, tows fine, etc. and don't need the extra expense of the Rubicon lockers and electric sway bar disconnect.

I have noted that the "Alpine premium audio" seems to have disappeared for 2022?

The trick for me is that all local dealers sell only at MSRP. They won't budge, even when I tell them others will. They say we sell MSRP only. I was even told that by a couple. One flat said they don't do any affiliate discounts. So the problem now is - finding the right dealer who sells at other than MSRP.

 

[Suszynch]

Nope, no diesel. No reason to.
I don't want the extra expense and maintenance.
People brag about the mpg but leave out the extra oil, filters, DEF and other maintenance and issues. It's as much as emotional thing as practical to many people.
It would add 4 grand (plus 200 tax) to the numbers and make it undoable. That 4 grand buys a lot of gas. (1,000 gallons and over 19,000 miles worth of gas)

Gas engine does fine, cheaper to buy, cheaper to maintain.

Maybe I should refresh the rules on this -
It would be the same drivetrain (3.6 automatic), same color (or snazzberry as an option) but with the full-time transfer case option.
You can't even get the Selec-Trac transfer case with diesel, so one reason for the trade would disappear with the diesel.
I also want to know that if I get hit by the bus tomorrow, my wife will be happy with it and be able to keep it up and fueled.

Sure, it's a 'performance option' and has some extra care needed for that. I'd say the same reason buy the 392 wranglers for power. The diesel works a lot less hard to turn some large torque numbers. fuel economy, in my opinion, is a byproduct of that.
I agree though it's not for everyone. got my dealer to include a couple of extra oil changes, fuel filters, and 5 gals of DEF in addition to my jeep wave agreement. certainly helps.

Not trying to persuade you in any sense. But just to make sure everyone else has the correct information. Unless the dealerships are pushing the rock-trac full-time buy-up option, the Selec-trac part-time 4wd is standard on diesel gladiators.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Not trying to persuade you in any sense. But just to make sure everyone else has the correct information. Unless the dealerships are pushing the rock-trac full-time buy-up option, the Selec-trac part-time 4wd is standard on diesel gladiators.

Sorry, you are incorrect.
The Selec-Trac is a full-time transfer case option not available with diesel at all.
Click diesel and the Selec-Trac t-case goes away.

Rock-trac isn't even a player, I suspect that's Rubicon only, perhaps. It's not even an option otherwise.

Maybe you are thinking of other Jeeps, past models, or Rubicon?

This is a very different animal.

 

[Suszynch]

Sorry, you are incorrect.
The Selec-Trac is a full-time transfer case option not available with diesel at all.
Click diesel and the Selec-Trac t-case goes away.

Rock-trac isn't even a player, I suspect that's Rubicon only, perhaps. It's not even an option otherwise.

Maybe you are thinking of other Jeeps, past models, or Rubicon?

This is a very different animal.

well, correct and wrong I guess that I'm finding out, so yes if you're not buying a rubicon. I guess it's not standard. Thank you for correcting me.
Kinda funny though, my buddy has an eco diesel sport, with a selec-trac that came standard on his build. That I am positive of.
I had no idea that it's not offered currently. I have the rubicon so when I went to check the build, I didn't even think to check the other trims.

But yeah, the full-time rock-trac is the buy up option on the rubicon where the selec-trac is standard. pretty much the exact counter what's offered for the other trims from the looks of it.

?‍

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The Selec-Trac auto/"full-time" has never been offered with the diesel - there are others in the forum who have complained about that. Likely it's the torque of the diesel they didn't want going through this t-case.

Take a look at the transfer case shift lever - if there aren't 2 positions for 4H (one with 4H auto) then it's not the full-time Selec-Trac transfer case.

The standard transfer case is lacking the 4H AUTO position and has only 4H PART TIME

This is the shifter on the Selec-Trac full time transfer case.
It's really "Automatic" more than "full time". I guess full-time is a sort of imperfect description other than you can leave it there full time, but it's automatic.
It's like Chevy has offered in their trucks for over a decade.

 

[Suszynch]

Take a look at the transfer case shift lever - if there aren't 2 positions for 4H (one with 4H auto) then it's not the full-time Selec-Trac transfer case.

The standard transfer case is lacking the 4H AUTO position and has only 4H PART TIME

Oof, got my trac-systems all mixed up. There's a hand full of them now.
Sorry about that mate. I'll see myself back to the bleachers before I'm in risk of hijacking your OP..


But, in regard to your original post. I had the same dilemma trading in my JLUR, had a lot of mods but they offered me 10k more than I paid for it with 30k miles. the agreement I wouldn't remove the mods. (still took some small stuff) but with the price of parts now + new platform premium on parts I didn't really save much. (trying to find a reasonable lift for the diesels is stupid)
But, if there's something in the current factory offerings that makes it worth it. You may just think about it until you convince yourself to do it anyways. I see that a lot in the 35s vs 37s crowd.
why torture yourself? order today

 

[shokker70]

Funny you posted this. I mentioned in replying after you to another thread I was considering trading my Mojave with only 8k miles that I just bought at the end of Nov last year. Maybe a little easier for me since I've only added tires and wheels. I always buy with the plan to keep it until the wheels fall off. 2 years in, I get the itch for something new. Not always the smart money play, but I always have a vehicle under warranty.

Only real reason I started looking is my Mojave is missing 2 things I really wanted, leather and diesel. I can add leather, can't add a diesel. Understand the extra costs and maintenance, but have my reasons for preferring it. So I'm looking at ordering a Gobi Texas Trail with the EcoDiesel and get the exact options I want. Already been offered what I paid for mine in trade at one dealer. They didn't want to negotiate enough on theirs so I walked away.

Does it maybe come down to what you can buy one for? Apologies if you updated in a later thread, but you were talking more in hypotheticals on the new one I believe. That would be a big factor in deciding for me. Dealers are paying a lot for trades, but not negotiating on the new ones for the most part. I happen to know I can order one at invoice and not have to deal with any dealer ads. And then not have to drive to Gupton...

What makes you happy? Something not on your current one you wanted? Like the idea of it smelling new again for a couple of months? You can afford it and you just want to? Will your trade value go down if you remove mods? Jeep is one of the very few, if not only, vehicles where mods and ads can actually add value.

I absolutely LOVE my Mojave. If I could order it with a diesel, I would. I'll be extending my payoff 5 or 6 payments, but other than that, it doesn't hurt me financially to trade. I'm a fan of getting what you want if you can.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Funny you posted this. I mentioned in replying after you to another thread I was considering trading my Mojave with only 8k miles that I just bought at the end of Nov last year. Maybe a little easier for me since I've only added tires and wheels. I always buy with the plan to keep it until the wheels fall off. 2 years in, I get the itch for something new. Not always the smart money play, but I always have a vehicle under warranty.

Only real reason I started looking is my Mojave is missing 2 things I really wanted, leather and diesel. I can add leather, can't add a diesel. Understand the extra costs and maintenance, but have my reasons for preferring it. So I'm looking at ordering a Gobi Texas Trail with the EcoDiesel and get the exact options I want. Already been offered what I paid for mine in trade at one dealer. They didn't want to negotiate enough on theirs so I walked away.

Does it maybe come down to what you can buy one for? Apologies if you updated in a later thread, but you were talking more in hypotheticals on the new one I believe. That would be a big factor in deciding for me. Dealers are paying a lot for trades, but not negotiating on the new ones for the most part. I happen to know I can order one at invoice and not have to deal with any dealer ads. And then not have to drive to Gupton...

What makes you happy? Something not on your current one you wanted? Like the idea of it smelling new again for a couple of months? You can afford it and you just want to? Will your trade value go down if you remove mods? Jeep is one of the very few, if not only, vehicles where mods and ads can actually add value.

I absolutely LOVE my Mojave. If I could order it with a diesel, I would. I'll be extending my payoff 5 or 6 payments, but other than that, it doesn't hurt me financially to trade. I'm a fan of getting what you want if you can.

My wife is normally the frequent trade person. She loves high trade-in values, likes lower miles, likes warranty, etc. Her current Jeep may be a forever Jeep since they ended the WK2 platform for 2021 and after. She refuses anything bigger and doesn't like some of the changes. I've not looked in detail at the new Grand Cherokee, but she won't get anything longer or wider.

If you prefer diesel, if you like diesel, you have your reasons and that's cool. It's a fit for you and that's the nice thing about where we live - choices.

I kept my last truck, a 2011, until the end of 2019. The truck before that was a 95 I traded in 2011 so normally I go long times on trucks. But normally I drive a truck as a truck and only for truck purposes so my 2011 went to a new owner 8 years later with less than 7,000/year average on it. It was somewhere around 44,000 or so as I recall. I'm over half-way there already in 2.5 years.
So my wife, after I told her how up-side-down things are, used vehicles high, etc. suggested that I was getting some miles on this one, would run out of warranty by the end of this year, "see what is possible". Didn't say do it, but more than once said if the numbers work, why not.
So there's all that - plus I'm very interested in the new transfer case since this truck has literally turned into the family daily driver, and a couple of other options are tempting. Otherwise mine is already loaded - I got almost everything you could possibly order in October 2019 except the aux switches.

I see that the Alpine premium audio is no longer a choice, bummer if that's true.....

Some of the stuff I've done on my current JT I MAY do differently next time around - may change course on front springs, a couple of minor things like that, but really the only "big" things I've done have been the springs, lower control arms, bumper, winch, skid plate, front receiver. Other stuff - storage, tailgate ladder, yellow fogs, backup lights, all easily removable and put back stock in very short order with little time involved.

I have now gotten 3 emails from Dewey in the last 2 days...... I keep responding that nothing happens unless they can match the numbers of certain other dealers, etc. I'm not desperate, there's nothing pushing me, it's not a must. It's a - if the numbers line up, if the stars line up, if things make sense after a while and if they get their butts off that bloody MSRP, then it's a definite "we'll talk more"

 

[shokker70]

I see that the Alpine premium audio is no longer a choice, bummer if that's true.....

Still showing as orderable... as far as I can see. Maybe on certain models? I think it's standard on Mojave and Rubi now. I did everything but cuss the dealer I bought mine from for having the 8.4 and the Alpine. Swore I didn't want it since Jeep FINALLY put a decent stock radio in. Not great mind you, but decent. As in you can roll the windows down and still hear it. Now I won't buy one without it. Bastards...

I have now gotten 3 emails from Dewey in the last 2 days...... I keep responding that nothing happens unless they can match the numbers of certain other dealers, etc. I'm not desperate, there's nothing pushing me, it's not a must. It's a - if the numbers line up, if the stars line up, if things make sense after a while and if they get their butts off that bloody MSRP, then it's a definite "we'll talk more"

This is the part that sucks. Fortunately I was in the business for a few years, and know the GM at a local dealer. Kinda get the best of both ends here. The dealers who are discounting have $1500 to $2k in ads. Still below MSRP, but not much.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yes, the 8.4 appears to be standard on Overland, but 0 mention of the premium sound.
When I bought in 2019, you could get the 7 or the 8.4 and then you could get the 8.4 with premium sound. The description NOW says HD radio, but nothing about premium sound. I'll have to look at my PDFs in the house. My shop chromebook has no access to my other computers.

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