TPMS unavailable after tire swap

[Mr._Bill]

Yeah, how much more would it really cost them to put a matching spare on the JT? I mean, it's already the same tire. How much price difference can there be between that steel wheel and the other four?

It's the cost of the wheel, not the tire. Why do you need a matching spare when it is hidden under the truck? It is there for emergency use. Five tire rotations are not common for the general public, and not recommended in the owners manual.

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[ShadowsPapa]

It's the cost of the wheel, not the tire. Why do you need a matching spare when it is hidden under the truck? It is there for emergency use. Five tire rotations are not common for the general public, and not recommended in the owners manual.

It is actually recommended in the owners manual of Jeeps that come with a matching spare.
They don't talk about it with the JT simply because there's no matching wheel.

If you've ever had a tire that couldn't be fixed, or didn't have time to deal with it, you'd appreciate being able to pop on the spare and LEAVE IT until you could either get another tire or get that one fixed.
Been through more than one scenario where I was really happy I had a full matching spare.

Look in the other owners manuals, Tirerack and other sites - if there's a matching spare wheel/tire, it's recommended (and this is a conversation had many times here before )

BTW - from the Jeep Gladiator owners manual -

 

[Mr._Bill]

It is actually recommended in the owners manual of Jeeps that come with a matching spare.
They don't talk about it with the JT simply because there's no matching wheel.

If you've ever had a tire that couldn't be fixed, or didn't have time to deal with it, you'd appreciate being able to pop on the spare and LEAVE IT until you could either get another tire or get that one fixed.
Been through more than one scenario where I was really happy I had a full matching spare.

Look in the other owners manuals, Tirerack and other sites - if there's a matching spare wheel/tire, it's recommended (and this is a conversation had many times here before )

BTW - from the Jeep Gladiator owners manual -

And how many Gladiators actually come with a matching spare, or even just a matching tire?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

And how many Gladiators actually come with a matching spare, or even just a matching tire?

It's probably a holdover from the Wrangler book as they do have.
Our Grand Cherokees also had matching spare and they talked about doing a five tire rotation

 

[Mr._Bill]

It's probably a holdover from the Wrangler book as they do have.
Our Grand Cherokees also had matching spare and they talked about doing a five tire rotation

I understand the logic of a five tire rotation, and would do one if I had an easy access matching spare like the Wrangler comes with. The extra expense required to be able to do a five tire rotation on the pickup just doesn't make sense to me. Both of my Gladiators came with the standard factory spare that did not match the tires and wheels on the truck. In over four years on the first one and over a year on the second one the spare has never been dropped. I do have AAA Service, just in case, but it's required since I have AAA Insurance.

 

[Splenda]

It is actually recommended in the owners manual of Jeeps that come with a matching spare.
They don't talk about it with the JT simply because there's no matching wheel.

If you've ever had a tire that couldn't be fixed, or didn't have time to deal with it, you'd appreciate being able to pop on the spare and LEAVE IT until you could either get another tire or get that one fixed.
Been through more than one scenario where I was really happy I had a full matching spare.

Look in the other owners manuals, Tirerack and other sites - if there's a matching spare wheel/tire, it's recommended (and this is a conversation had many times here before )

BTW - from the Jeep Gladiator owners manual -

Have you seen the companies that put a bright yellow spare wheel on their vehicles? I think they want to deter the owner from leaving that sucker on there. This is a Lexus spare.

 

[Splenda]

I understand the logic of a five tire rotation, and would do one if I had an easy access matching spare like the Wrangler comes with. The extra expense required to be able to do a five tire rotation on the pickup just doesn't make sense to me. Both of my Gladiators came with the standard factory spare that did not match the tires and wheels on the truck. In over four years on the first one and over a year on the second one the spare has never been dropped. I do have AAA Service, just in case, but it's required since I have AAA Insurance.

I definitely hated spending an extra $1000 on my spare (plus $300 for the Clayton Offroad track bar), but since I did, I will be doing a five-tire rotation.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I understand the logic of a five tire rotation, and would do one if I had an easy access matching spare like the Wrangler comes with. The extra expense required to be able to do a five tire rotation on the pickup just doesn't make sense to me. Both of my Gladiators came with the standard factory spare that did not match the tires and wheels on the truck. In over four years on the first one and over a year on the second one the spare has never been dropped. I do have AAA Service, just in case, but it's required since I have AAA Insurance.

My logic - (it suits my needs and style and preferences, I understand not everyone will care)
I was glad the spare matched on my 22.
I had a flat, was in a hurry, dropped the spare, put it on the right front and tossed the flat into the back. (spare drops easily as it comes down every 5,000 miles or so and I use silicone spray on stuff).
I got it fixed at DT - for free - and put it up under the vehicle. So the rotation was now off a bit but I always have 5 tires equally warn, never have to worry about whether or not it's inflated and ready to use (nothing worse than dropping a spare - finding you can't or that it's flat.)

When you call for help - I guess I'm just not that patient - it's often a fair wait. It can take 45 minutes for an ambulance to arrive, and over an hour or two for assistance for a flat or tow to arrive. I can be on the road before they arrive.
Also glad the wear was spread over 5 tires as the tires on my 22 still had life left - with only 4 I'd have had to put new tires on it last fall.

It's whatever people prefer and the experiences they've had with tire damage in the past. Nice thing, supposedly this new JT has a matching tire - it's only the wheel that doesn't match.
Still - it's not cheap to buy a wheel for a Jeep!
In my mind, I can easily justify it. It won't be that way for others. I hate WAITING.

 

[bill61]

My 24 Rubicon X has a matching spare tire so all that was needed was a matching wheel and TPS. Not bad. All the parts and work were done for around $400. But I like a 5 tire rotation and if/when I get a flat everything looks the same. I never was a fan of donut spares on cars.

 

[Splenda]

I changed my oil with Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 0w20, and I did my first five tire rotation today. 4500 miles on the truck. It was interesting to watch the TPMS figure things out. I put the spare on the front passenger, moved the front passenger to the rear passenger, moved the rear passenger to the front driver, moved the front driver to rear driver, and rear driver became my spare. The tire that was the spare has about 2 psi less pressure than the rest, and it initially showed up on the rear then moved to the front. I just need to add a little air to that tire. I coated the new spare with ceramic tire shine before cranking it back up under the bed so it will be easier to clean.

 

[grein46087]

I am not a TPMS expert by any means but do know RF systems in my day job working in the aircraft industry.

We first must baseline the situation. If the vehicle with stock wheels and stock TPMS sensors work, then the system is working as designed. Once aftermarket wheels are installed and assuming the OEM TPMS sensors are installed and the system does not report, then something has taking the system outside its design tolerance parameters.

From my understanding, the mid 2021 and up Gladiators went to a single antenna TPMS system that eliminated the dedicated TPMS module that also had 3 dedicated TPMS antennas and rolled that to our current system with the Radio Frequency Hub doing dual duty with a single antenna shared with the FOB and remote start.

Now we are presented with a problem of why with new wheels does the TPMS not report? TPMS sensors transmit on a very low power of like one-millionth of a watt to maintain long battery life and to also not stomp and overpower other vehicles you may be close to and vice-versa. That means our single antenna TPMS system has to comparative power readings of the TPMS sensor transmit power to determine which wheel each sensor to transmitting the data from and report on the cluster display for each wheel tire pressure.

My speculation is when you introduce wheels that may have more mass and put the TPMS sensor farther out on the offset, the RFH single antenna can no longer interpret the wheel TPMS sensor transmit power wattage strength because it is outside the design parameters of the system.

As to why the TPMS sensors seem to report when initialize by a TPMS tool? My speculation is the TPMS tool is using RFID to trigger the sensor that would normal transmit by wheel speed using an accelerometer, the TPMS sensor knows the difference of the RFID initialization and transmits a higher wattage signal briefly for the tool and RFH and antenna then now can pickup that signal but will eventually drop out once the wheel is rotating again and the TPMS sensor start transmitting again at the lower wattage.

I guess the million-dollar question is what can be done to fix a set of aftermarket wheels and tires with no TPMS sensor data reporting? Outside of making sure you have fresh manufacture TPMS sensors with high battery life remaining, I really do not know what can be done here. You are not going to find at least commercially, higher power TPMS sensors because of the previously mention issue of stomping on and overpower other near vehicle TPMS systems. When it comes the RFH and antenna, pretty much the same as if there was any way to adjust the signal gain, it would then run the risk of picking up other near by vehicle TPMS systems and give false reporting. The FCC regulates this kind of stuff and keeps both transmit frequency assignments and wattage transmissions into narrow swim lanes they must maintain.

Thank you @Hootbro I suppose I casn keep digging until I get to the final result. it is just irritating, that this is a problem. and really should not be.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The REAL problem isn't with the Jeeps - it's with the wheel manufacturers and designers who love the money they rake in selling pretty wheels at a premium (because people will pay anything they ask if the wheel looks "cool" enough, regardless of function.)
Do they even test? Unlikely, that costs money. it takes time. First to market with a design they pull people in with wins.

If they had to make really sure the wheels worked on each year, each type of receiver and TPMS sensor - they'd have to radically change things.
But people want their wheels so it's Jeep's fault, of course.
It comes from the factory working and working quite well. Any changes are changes to the engineered design of the vehicle, and on the owner, really.
That's going to piss off a lot of people who just gotta have the best looking Jeep wheels out there, I'm sure, but it's a fact - the wheel choice is on the owner, the wheel design is on the manufacturer.

Of course there are cases where there's a faulty antenna or receiver in the vehicle, that's a given, it happens and happens often enough there's a TSB about such things.
So absolutely, yes, it may be on the vehicle - the problem may there.
I know that if I made a choice to move to radically different wheels - it's on me to make sure things work or fall within original design criteria.
However, if a dealer is going to troubleshoot and they say - hey, look it works just fine with the stock wheels....... they need to charge the customer for their time in troubleshooting and diagnosis *if* it actually works just fine with stock wheels.

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