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JTDay

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My Gladiator got a new auto transmission at 21k miles. It currently has bubbling paint, heated wheel doesn’t work, driver proximity doesn’t work, passenger heated mirror doesn’t work, and the screen glitches occasionally. I still wouldn’t call it a POS, but someone else might.
Why not fix those items? None of those sounds that bad. My Ranger was a genuine, documented, piece of garbage.

The JT clutch issue is a little pathetic but otherwise I've been extremely happy with my Jeep. If mine got totalled tomorrow however, I'd probably go look at the new Canyon or a manual Taco. The newest gens of those trucks took a big leap forward.
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You haven't been to a Ford or GM/Chevy dealer.. literally ROWS and ROWS of trucks piled up. Truck sales are down big time- alot of these 23's are now hitting lots as well.. shoot there are still 23 model years being delivered.
Sales across the whole industry are up though. People are just realizing trucks aren't worth $70k.
 

Wheelin98TJ

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Why not fix those items? None of those sounds that bad. My Ranger was a genuine, documented, piece of garbage.

The JT clutch issue is a little pathetic but otherwise I've been extremely happy with my Jeep. If mine got totalled tomorrow however, I'd probably go look at the new Canyon or a manual Taco. The newest gens of those trucks took a big leap forward.
Paint is still under warranty, but bumper to bumper warranty is over. It's a 2021 with 46k miles. I have some guidance on the heated wheel from the fine folks here. Just need to find time to look at it. I'm not sure how to fix the proximity lock issue, heated mirror, or screen. Paint issue will likely take more time at the dealer than I'd like.
 

Jglad15

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@Jglad15

Yes, now they are all pushing upper 7000s which wasn't the case just 5 years ago before all the newest generation trucks started coming out. May or may not have much bearing on purchase decisions but it seems to be a huge topic in truck forums. People talk about 100lb payload variances making a difference to them which to me doesn't matter at all. My JT has a towing capacity of 4000lbs.
Just towing alone, I have not looked up payload.
The ranger has a max of 7500
Tacoma has a max of 6500
Colorado 7700
And Gladiator 7650

So that’s gonna depend how you configure your truck. Mine is rated for like 7200. But if I’m towing that much I would be getting a full size.

Edit: I did a quick search on payload
Tacoma 1709
Gladiator 1710
Colorado 1684
Ranger rear wheel1805
4x4 1711

That’s just me doing a quick search, but that’s what the trucks are capable of. So couple hundred pounds I don’t think can sway sales that much alone. But that’s just my opinion.
 
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JTDay

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Just towing alone, I have not looked up payload.
The ranger has a max of 7500
Tacoma has a max of 6500
Colorado 7700
And Gladiator 7650

So that’s gonna depend how you configure your truck. Mine is rated for like 7200. But if I’m towing that much I would be getting a full size.

Edit: I did a quick search on payload
Tacoma 1709
Gladiator 1710
Colorado 1684
Ranger rear wheel1805
4x4 1711

That’s just me doing a quick search, but that’s what the trucks are capable of. So couple hundred pounds I don’t think can sway sales that much alone. But that’s just my opinion.
Didn't realize the new taco was only 6500. I'm surprised as I think k it has like 400 something torque from the iforce max engine.
 

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Jglad15

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Didn't realize the new taco was only 6500. I'm surprised as I think k it has like 400 something torque from the iforce max engine.
Yeah I think the hybrid max capacity is lower than just the standard 2.4 turbo or whatever it is. Don’t quote me on that. But I think that’s what it is. But the Jeep will always sell less. Since apparently they drive so much worse and their god awful reliability. Haha. I’ve owned three jeeps knock on wood and have never had any issues. Love my jeeps!
 

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The 2023 model is hindered by high interest rates, above-market MSRP, a 2024 mid-cycle interior update, and upcoming 2025 powertrain changes. Even Jeep's current 15% discount on MSRP may not be enough to boost sales. However, the new inline-6 engine with 420hp should attract attention next year.
 

SoK66

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Price it wrong and it won't sell.
 

bleda2002

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The 2023 model is hindered by high interest rates, above-market MSRP, a 2024 mid-cycle interior update, and upcoming 2025 powertrain changes. Even Jeep's current 15% discount on MSRP may not be enough to boost sales. However, the new inline-6 engine with 420hp should attract attention next year.
Unless you have really good inside knowledge that no one else does, the new power train will be the 4xe, not the inline 6 that doesnt fit in the engine bay of the current gen JL/JT's. 4xe should help boost sales like it did for the wrangler though. 7500 off the sales price to put it at or below straight gas and plentiful power with great city gas mileage sways a lot of fence sitters and truck leasers. Especially if they offer it in the lower trims where the MSRP and feature set is more in line with competitors.
 

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Unless you have really good inside knowledge that no one else does, the new power train will be the 4xe, not the inline 6 that doesnt fit in the engine bay of the current gen JL/JT's. 4xe should help boost sales like it did for the wrangler though. 7500 off the sales price to put it at or below straight gas and plentiful power with great city gas mileage sways a lot of fence sitters and truck leasers. Especially if they offer it in the lower trims where the MSRP and feature set is more in line with competitors.
Where did you hear the inline-6 doesn't fit? Seriously, explain how my 4.0L straight six in my 06 TJ doesn't fit. Wow...
 

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bleda2002

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Where did you hear the inline-6 doesn't fit? Seriously, explain how my 4.0L straight six in my 06 TJ doesn't fit. Wow...
Its been mentioned multiple times and on the JL forum even calculated, its too long for the JL/JT engine bay. Maybe if they were just installing the old 4.0 it would fit, but the new one is too long with the cylinder spacing they gave it.

Meanwhile the 4xe gladiator has basically been confirmed by union docs. Personally I expect the 4.0 to make its wrangler debut in the 2028 next gen JM or possibly as a 392 replacement. They are still manufacturing constrained on the inline 6 as it is slated to replace existing v8's first then move in to the next gen vehicles (like the new charger and challenger).
 
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bleda2002

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"The new powerplant will fit into any vehicle currently sold that has a longitudinal engine." - https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a39530125/stellantis-twin-turbo-inline-six-specs-details/
I hope you're right, every other article as well as measurements says it doesnt fit. The hurricane is 5 inches longer than a 392, thats a pretty tall order to pack inside the JL/JT engine bay and cool it with out extending the front or moving the firewall back.

Edit: Inline 6 is 34 inches, pentastar is 19 inches, 6.4 is 29 inches. Thats a lot of extra length for an engine bay that only kind of fits the 392. Obviously where there is a will, there is a way, but the JM is 3 years out from debut, hard to imagine they'll do that kind of engineering for a 3 year run.
 
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jwolfejt

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Sales across the whole industry are up though. People are just realizing trucks aren't worth $70k.
Yes crossover sales are strong and cheaper vehicles are moving up there - $50+k vehicles not so much.
 

maSS-hole

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Just towing alone, I have not looked up payload.
The ranger has a max of 7500
Tacoma has a max of 6500
Colorado 7700
And Gladiator 7650

So that’s gonna depend how you configure your truck. Mine is rated for like 7200. But if I’m towing that much I would be getting a full size.

Edit: I did a quick search on payload
Tacoma 1709
Gladiator 1710
Colorado 1684
Ranger rear wheel1805
4x4 1711

That’s just me doing a quick search, but that’s what the trucks are capable of. So couple hundred pounds I don’t think can sway sales that much alone. But that’s just my opinion.
Even though the tow rating on the Gladiator is competitive, the Pentastar is not going to hold a candle to how the Colorado or Ranger 2.7L tow. The Colorado 2.7 is making 348 ft-lbs at 1500 rpm, 391 ft-lbs at 2000 rpm, and 430 ft-lbs at 3000 rpm. Thats more torque than my 2014 F150 3.5L Ecoboost.

The Ranger 2.7 is not to far off of that.

I'm less excited about the Tacoma's 2.4L as its not able to put out numbers anywhere near the Ford or GM 2.7L and you can't really count the electric power toward towing with the iforce max. But still, even the 2.4L should have a decent advantage over the Pentastar.

Didn't realize the new taco was only 6500. I'm surprised as I think k it has like 400 something torque from the iforce max engine.
The battery is like 1.7 kwh. For the electric motor to provide constant torque/power to drive the truck and trailer, you would end up draining that battery in a matter of minutes.

Basically, while towing, you can figure that the truck only has the power of the gasoline engine only because the electric motor will only step in to provide short bursts here and there. If you are towing down the freeway at 65mph under constant high load, the battery just can't supply continuous power for any meaningful amount of time.

When TFLTruck tested the Tundra with the iForce Max, which uses the exact same battery and electric motor as the Tacoma, the electric motor completely shut off above 50mph. They climbed up I-70 for 8 minutes with zero assist from the electric motor aside from the initial acceleration to 50 mph.

Yeah I think the hybrid max capacity is lower than just the standard 2.4 turbo or whatever it is. Don’t quote me on that. But I think that’s what it is. But the Jeep will always sell less. Since apparently they drive so much worse and their god awful reliability. Haha. I’ve owned three jeeps knock on wood and have never had any issues. Love my jeeps!
It weighs a good 500-600 lbs more which probably hurts the payload. At least in the Tundra, the same exact system adds that much.
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