I’m new here - could be great…

[Viper501]

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[Janster]

More complex is kinda blown out of proportion. Sure with the can bus everything is electronically integrated but the vehicle is the same. The process of installing a lift or replacing a starter or swapping out a transmission is pretty much unchanged. The number of back yard mechanics is likely down, moreso because there's a generation of people who don't do anything for themselves. Between door dash and Amazon and Uber some of these people simply aren't functioning adults anymore. Frame off restorations weren't exactly common even for the avid home wrench. I've done engine swaps, transmissions, custom 3 and 4 link suspensions, cages, etc and never done a full restoration. Will people still be buying 30 year old clapped out Jeeps and wheeling them hard in 30 years? I would imagine so.

More complex - …. The technical/computer aspect. I mean… in order to get to the radiator (in some cars), you gotta take off the entire front end to get to it. What a pain in the ass!! OK…that just shows my age….

We helped a buddy do a frame off restoration on a CJ. That was fun as hell…..I would’ve loved to do that (back then) but we just didn’t have the room, the garage, or the $. We did do Dana 44 swaps, installed lifts and just about everything else. Stripped. a YJ down to frame, (totaled in accident)etc. We had the professionals install the gears/ARB‘s, rotate the knuckles and weld the spring perches.

I agree… about generations not doing anything for themselves. It’s crazy how popular Door Dash is and how often they use it!! They’ll be living from paycheck to paycheck and scrapin’ by and order Door Dash 3x a week. Seriously?
And be the same people who will complain about how ‘little’ money they make.

I totally understand why some Senior Citizens are so grumpy. To sit back and watch things unfold…. They’re grump about US (my generation) and we’re grumpy about the younger folks.

 

[imallcrawl]

More complex - ….I mean… in order to get to the radiator (in some cars), you gotta take off the entire front end to get to it. What a pain in the ass!! ….

For me it was the older Acura Integras, yes front and under carriage needed to be removed just to get to that radiator, and the older Corvettes with the reverse hood was also a nightmare

 

[Zachanadandy]

More complex - …. The technical/computer aspect. I mean… in order to get to the radiator (in some cars), you gotta take off the entire front end to get to it. What a pain in the ass!! OK…that just shows my age….

We helped a buddy do a frame off restoration on a CJ. That was fun as hell…..I would’ve loved to do that (back then) but we just didn’t have the room, the garage, or the $. We did do Dana 44 swaps, installed lifts and just about everything else. Stripped. a YJ down to frame, (totaled in accident)etc. We had the professionals install the gears/ARB‘s, rotate the knuckles and weld the spring perches.

I agree… about generations not doing anything for themselves. It’s crazy how popular Door Dash is and how often they use it!! They’ll be living from paycheck to paycheck and scrapin’ by and order Door Dash 3x a week. Seriously?
And be the same people who will complain about how ‘little’ money they make.

I totally understand why some Senior Citizens are so grumpy. To sit back and watch things unfold…. They’re grump about US (my generation) and we’re grumpy about the younger folks.

It's not like terrible designs that make maintaining and repairing difficult are a new thing. The old caddy 500s with the starter mounted under the intake manifold? My wife's '01 grand cherokee had the starter so wedged in next to the unibody that the manual recommended removal of the exhaust manifold just to get the starter out. I figured out you could remove the upper control arm and get it out from the bottom and then not chase exhaust leaks. My company car for a while was a Ford escape. The battery went out and I figured I'd just swap it out vs taking it in. The YouTube video said step 1, remove the windshield wipers? Then the upper cowl. Then the lower cowl. They wedged that battery so far back you had to strip the damn vehicle. My step 1 after that video was to make an appointment at the Ford dealer since I wasn't paying anyway. $900 for a battery replacement. The Jeep on the other hand is a dream to work on by comparison. The computer complexity is worth it for the combination of efficiency, driveabilty, wheeling ability, and performance that comes with computer controlled engine/transmission combos if you ask me. Wouldn't go back to a TJ or XJ and certainly not a CJ or YJ with terrible flex combined with a need for tuning adjustments when I drive up into the mountains for anything. Even if I were to build an old Jeep at this point it would get a modern drivetrain.

 

[Zachanadandy]

Things all fell apart when people stopped mowing their own lawns and changing their own oil.

I still mow my own lawn, but I'll pass on oil changes. With the fact you can always find a $35 off coupon for jiffylube it's basically the same cost to have them do it and I don't have to deal with the old oil.

 

[Viper501]

Modern cars are manufactured with speed of assembly paramount. No concern is given for repair or the end users. It’s cheaper for them to pay the warranty an extra hour than the union guy building it. Remember they set the book for repairs and won’t pay the dealer more than book.

 

[Lost1wing]

I still mow my own lawn, but I'll pass on oil changes. With the fact you can always find a $35 off coupon for jiffylube it's basically the same cost to have them do it and I don't have to deal with the old oil.

My brother used to work at a Jiffy Lube and then with that fine experience he got on at a GM dealer doing oil and transmission flushes. Lost both jobs for some reason. He can play a guitar but I wouldn't let him work on a lawnmower. I'm just saying.

 

[JonMN]

I still mow my own lawn, but I'll pass on oil changes. With the fact you can always find a $35 off coupon for jiffylube it's basically the same cost to have them do it and I don't have to deal with the old oil.

I look at it as there are "good oil changes and bad oil changes." (To paraphrase yet another Seinfeld quip.) JT is SO easy it's actually kind of fun. Ford van that we have is almost as easy so I do my own. Our older Lexus, with the oil filter mounted sideways so it's almost impossible to remove without a huge mess, I take to the dealer. [Of course, by comparison, the Lexus dealer has TV, recliners, coffee, snacks, fireplace . . .]

 

[Charles 236]

Things all fell apart when people stopped mowing their own lawns and changing their own oil.

Agreed. I quit mowing my lawn a couple of years ago. Now, I'm too lazy to even yell "Get off my lawn." at the youngsters passing by my house.

 

[Rusty PW]

I love how this thread went completely in a different direction, I think Mr. Don - Nighthawk learned his lesson! Well done members!

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

For me it was the older Acura Integras, yes front and under carriage needed to be removed just to get to that radiator, and the older Corvettes with the reverse hood was also a nightmare

I decided pretty young that I only wanted to work on rear wheel drive stuff.

 

[Chasm]

Are they expensive? Hell yes,

Overall yes, but not so bad when you look at comparable options.

 

[Deleted member 57233]

Things all fell apart when people stopped mowing their own lawns and changing their own oil.

Simple equation of how much my time is worth vs. how much they are charging. The girl that does my yardwork charges $60/hr to pull weeds by hand, she can do more in 30 minutes than I can do in half a day. I'll take that deal every time.

 

[Supazuk]

I miss the simplicity of the vehicles in the 90’s or earlier. I mean…. it was pretty easy to work on them yourself (for the most part). Turning wrenches was fun for us back then.

As vehicles improve…(and get more complex)…. the human body degrades. I’m loving my heated seats & creature comforts now (when I need/want it) versus back when I was in my 20’s & 30’s and didn’t need it. Turning wrenches now can be difficult and not as fun.

Is the younger generation turning wrenches & working on their vehicles like we did back in the 90’s? Or has things become so complex that you don’t see nearly as many backyard mechanics anymore? And what’s that say about keeping the history alive?? Are there going to be as many folks doing frame-off restorations on a 2025 Gladiator when it’s 30 years old?

the same was said in the early 2000's, but I am doing a soft resto on a '03 tracker for my mom because she always wanted one, they have JLR but she thought the tracker would be more comfortable then a golf cart at the campground

 

[Supazuk]

Things all fell apart when people stopped mowing their own lawns and changing their own oil.

my dad never mowed our lawn after I was 10 and I haven't done mine since my son was 12

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