Let's Talk Winches

[PyrPatriot]

I have the smittybilt Gen 2 X20 - I like it because it has a wireless controller. I live in MN and the extra heavy duty waterproofing is helpful in dealing with salt. The only difference between their 10K and 12K versions (as far as I can tell) are the thickness of the synthetic rope - the motors have the same power rating. I have the 10K version - gives me 90 feet of rope and use a snatch block if I need the extra grunt (especially where the pull is short and I have a lot of wraps on the drum already). They are on Amazon for less than $600. No need to spend a crap ton on Warn. I don't have any experience with badlands or other similar brands but if you are merely recreational then you're probably fine. I think there are a lot of people out there (jeepers and otherwise) who buy the brand or the spec when they probably don't need it. If that is your thing then all power to you. I prefer functionality, general reliability, and extra beer money (ahem - money for rye actually but there is no saying for that).

Just my $0.02...

I got mine for about $350 with tax on mine. But it came with a steel cable. $100 synthetic line (rated twice of the one SM offered) and $30 fairlead.

Dont forget mounting plates folks. Some plates wont work with some bumpers and winches.

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[ShadowsPapa]

Dont forget mounting plates folks. Some plates wont work with some bumpers and winches.

And some aren't worth using as a serving tray under extreme use.

 

[uplandgunner]

One thing that has not been mentioned here is that if you buy a winch and it sits in your bumper unused for a long period of time, that winch has a high percentage of not working or failing. If you ever read the whole instructions, almost all will tell you to run the line out and then back under some load every few months.

think about it, These are electro / mechanical units. Running them keeps the gears lubed, the contacts working and the other mechanicals functioning and not becoming froze up.

I'll bet most winch failures happen to winches that have sat for some time and then expected to work flawlessy

 

[PyrPatriot]

And some aren't worth using as a serving tray under extreme use.

such as?

 

[Blade1668]

such as?

If you look at some that are available they look substandard. I've got 3 or so of them 2 are 20 plus years old one was sold by "Hidden Hitch" no frills but solid made, I know it's had way past 10k of force put on it. The mounting plate thickness, 2×2 square tube part, gusset's and welds are critical to check before buying and use. I've seen a few shady ones.

 

[eaglerugby04]

One thing that has not been mentioned here is that if you buy a winch and it sits in your bumper unused for a long period of time, that winch has a high percentage of not working or failing. If you ever read the whole instructions, almost all will tell you to run the line out and then back under some load every few months.

think about it, These are electro / mechanical units. Running them keeps the gears lubed, the contacts working and the other mechanicals functioning and not becoming froze up.

I'll bet most winch failures happen to winches that have sat for some time and then expected to work flawlessy

This is my favorite part. Gives me a legit excuse to do some redneck landscaping every month!!!

 

[rr11]

It would be remiss of you, with that experience with those winches, to venture outside of what has worked so very well for so long.
That's just it - people would, and really should, go with what they know and have experience with. That's why there will be so many good responses.
A person can factor all of that in, along with their budget, how hard will they use it, when they do use it would be it for "it sure would be nice" or "this had better work or I'm in big trouble" (and balance all of that with their budget)

Factoring in the intended use of my JT I will not need a heavy winch my main use now is riding on the beach and surf fishing. This truck will not see as much heavy usage off road or as much severe usage as I have put my trucks through in the past.

 

[Gladman]

Zeon 10 due to 7yr electrical and limited lifetime mechanical. I paid 820 for it and used my gift card to buy the spydura synthetic rope.

I initially wanted the Engo winch with pressure washer but the warranty was just 1 year.

I happened to be in a major 4x4 accessories chain store in Alberta a few days ago and saw a Warn Zeno Platinum 12k with steel line - $2460.00 CAN. $525 more for a synthetic rope.
No wonder I have not seen one mounted yet! This would be $3k CAN or roughly $ 2100.00 US for the full package. And then, if you were not able to mount it yourself the shop would gladly install it for $140.00/hour.

 

[AggieJeep]

I put a Warn 9.5 CTI-S on my ‘12 jkur with no complaints, light use. I bought the Apex 12k before Christmas for my JT. Still waiting on the Warn winch plate from Quadratec. Many log trucks here use the Apex for the trailers with good success. Like others, I don’t skimp on my builds. If it is right for me, I pay the cost. I thought long and hard about the Warn Zeon but I just could not justify it. We will see if this choice bites me in the butt.

 

[Empty Pockets]

Other than a huge Braden PTO winch on a M715 truck I once had, all of my winches have been Warn. I’m just really comfortable with the brand as a result. ALMOST went with a Super Winch or Badlands this time, but found the right deal on my M8000 at the last minute. Added synthetic line during the install.

It is a very good point made to run the winch every couple of months to keep it lubed and dry. This applies to all mechanical things. I’ll even engage 4 high occasionally at a traffic light and disengage after running it 30 or 40 feet just to circulate oil around, wet the seals, etc.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

It is a very good point made to run the winch every couple of months to keep it lubed and dry. This applies to all mechanical things. I’ll even engage 4 high occasionally at a traffic light and disengage after running it 30 or 40 feet just to circulate oil around, wet the seals, etc.

Some of the earlier owner manuals when AMC had Jeep - they said right in them to engage the 4x4 system every so often (I forget the number they used) to keep lube up in the carrier gears.
The spinning ring gear carries the lube up and around inside the housing. At least in the older units there were channels case or made into the housing to direct that lube to the bearings and gears.
The left axle always turns when the truck is moving - in turn, it spins the carrier gear which turns the spiders and the right carrier and stub axle. Those small gears sit inside the carrier and get lube by the ring gear tossing the fluid around. There's no pump. So after a while those gears inside the carrier, would need lube.

 

[AmishMike]

Don't buy cheap tools for emergency situations. Like most people, I used to buy a cheap set of tools for the truck but I realized that when you are stuck somewhere in less than optimal situations, that is when you need the best tools available. But....I am cheap so I had to learn that lesson a few times.
I bought a Warn EVO 12S from Northern Tool. I needed other supplies and lined up their gift card deals so my winch only cost me ~$550. If you watch them you can get good deals.
Went with the 12 because the price difference to a 10 was minimal and when you need it, you NEED it. I went synthetic because of the safety factor (farmer, yes I have broken steel cables) and there is a weight savings. I see where some people buy the steel cable winch and then buy an aftermarket synthetic line to save money, heck you might even sell your new steel line.
Being cheap, I bought the Warn winch mount and simply modified my plastic bumper. Mount was ~$225, it fits perfect and has the front plate to mount the fairlead to. I also bought a winch cover not only to keep the mud and crap out of it but to keep the UV off of the synthetic line.

 

[Ole Cowboy]

I'm looking to put a winch on the front of my rig and wanted to hear y'all's opinions on what brand / model to go with. Is it really worth it to spend double the price to get a Warn?
Cheers

Not going to give a recommendation just gonna provide you with my experience and let you chose.

Anyone here done a FULL PULL with you winch under water, and I am talking a 100 ft pull, saving a life and a Jeeper. Well on a run we crossed a near dry river in the Sonoran desert that morning, spent better part of a day exploring old mines and ghost towns and headed back. Sun shining all day and what we did not know was up N there had been a torrential rain storm and when we got to the river to cross back over, the river was raging wide. One guy decided to he could make it and he almost did but his rig got caught on a stump between the tire and inner fender-well. He called for help and I said I would do it. I drove in to it and water was over my belly button in my Jeep and my coffee cup was floating. Wave are going in over the window sill and I had to roll up my windows. I pulled the drain plugs to let it drain as I drove out.

I hooked on to me, his engine had quit and I was driving up stream. I knew to get him out (IF I COULD). I needed to be on ground but I was limited on how far I could go with the remains of an old bridge. I pulled him out by hooking up and backing up while pulling a letting out rope at the same time. I ended doing that twice for 2 FULL PULLS the first under water.

At that time I was running a Warn 9.5Ti their top winch. My world its Warn or go home! Had a Warn on most of my Jeep over the past 50 years and have winched Jeeps, trucks, cars you name it from the Baja Peninsula Alaska, Eruope, Asia and lot of places in-between.

I have also seen a lot bad stuff go down, one of the guys that ran with us hooked up to a stuck and hooked on to the trailer ball, I told him not to and he did anyhow, it snapped and the ball came ball thru the windshield and caught his GF tween the eyes and she died on the helicopter on the way to the hospital. Point being winching in a dangerous game. I tell most folks just get a cheap winch and use it only if you must.

That said Winches can lead to a lot of trouble and unless you have a winch that can handle it things can go wrong. If you are moderate off roader, playing on the < 3 level trails and are a conservative driver there is little need for extreme stuff you will find with the Warn label on it.

Take away: Let your winch be driven by NEED and not your whim or Sonic drive in drive thru to everyone you dropped $2 K+ on a Warn. I assure you that $300 buck 9k will do the job for for most folks. I have winched a LOT of folks out with cheap winches, Harbor Fright stuff and I will NEVER put you down for saving a few bucks on a winch you may or many not ever use. Asses your needs and wallet size and you might want to study some winching and recovery techniques. Superwinch has a good guide on winching and the Army FM 20-22.

If you goal is to be the trail hero you better have a winch that can do it and you damn well better know what you are doing, if you don't that high dollar winch is not going to help you.

Lastly: ROPE. Warn has good rope, but if you don't go with Warn there is only 1 ROPE: Masterpull, had mine for over 20 years: NOT CHEAP because Cheap does not come good and GOOD does not come cheap!

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/718buwyBiFS.pdf

http://www.bits.de/NRANEU/others/amd-us-archive/Fm20-22(62).pdf

 

[PyrPatriot]

Anyone here done a FULL PULL with you winch under water, and I am talking a 100 ft pull, saving a life and a Jeeper. Well on a run we crossed a near dry river in the Sonoran desert that morning, spent better part of a day exploring old mines and ghost towns and headed back. Sun shining all day and what we did not know was up N there had been a torrential rain storm and when we got to the river to cross back over, the river was raging wide. One guy decided to he could make it and he almost did but his rig got caught on a stump between the tire and inner fender-well. He called for help and I said I would do it. I drove in to it and water was over my belly button in my Jeep and my coffee cup was floating. Wave are going in over the window sill and I had to roll up my windows. I pulled the drain plugs to let it drain as I drove out.

With your JT in your profile pic? Water up to your bellybutton sitting is WAY over the fording depth of the JT, so if you were in that rig were there any long term effects on the vehicle from so much water? Water should be close to the hood at that depth, visualizing it in my head.

Never winched underwater, but that's why I like having an electric winch, in case I need to run one under water with engine off. I did do a full 100ft pull, friend's 4Runner was stuck in dense mud (talking your foot sinks into it and takes the boot when you try to walk) to his axles. I had to pull him out with my JT as pictured and Smittybilt 10k winch. Two Warn winches failed during the recovery before I was asked to help (idk why all the Wranglers got asked to try first). One was a fancy platinum model of some sorts, the remote interface broke and we couldn't even get the winch line out (for his Jeep to at least anchor another Jeep) because of no exposed clutch handle. Another was a Warn winch that was pulling and pulling but not making any progress.

I hooked on to me, his engine had quit and I was driving up stream. I knew to get him out (IF I COULD). I needed to be on ground but I was limited on how far I could go with the remains of an old bridge. I pulled him out by hooking up and backing up while pulling a letting out rope at the same time. I ended doing that twice for 2 FULL PULLS the first under water.

So you were out of the water and winched him out?

I tell most folks just get a cheap winch and use it only if you must.

Better to get a winch you can afford than nothing. If your budget allows for only a cheap $300 steel cable winch, then roll with that. Some folks get a JT/JL and can't afford much more. But they want to go wheeling a bit, nothing serious. And they have been stuck in just a slippery surface, not even mudding. I once drove over some clay mud that made my tires spin, not digging in much, but also not much traction with AT tires. A winch would have gotten me out quicker than an hour of finding bits of wood and brick to put under the tires and inch my way out.

That said Winches can lead to a lot of trouble and unless you have a winch that can handle it things can go wrong. If you are moderate off roader, playing on the < 3 level trails and are a conservative driver there is little need for extreme stuff you will find with the Warn label on it.

What is a <3 trail?

assure you that $300 buck 9k will do the job for for most folks. I have winched a LOT of folks out with cheap winches, Harbor Fright stuff and I will NEVER put you down for saving a few bucks on a winch you may or many not ever use. Asses your needs and wallet size and you might want to study some winching and recovery techniques.

See above, if that's all you can get better than nothing. And like you said, just know the limitations. For me learning about overheating the motor and having a faster line speed helped my decision in winch choice.

If you goal is to be the trail hero you better have a winch that can do it and you damn well better know what you are doing, if you don't that high dollar winch is not going to help you.

I have yet to see someone on the trails with a 15k lb winch, but I would like to. I guess it would be needed for one of the bigger trucks.

 

[uplandgunner]

Ha! I did a 600' pull last fall. I stuck a Kubota RTV 900 with tracks in a bog. The closest I could get my jeep was 600'. I used google earth to plot the closest straight pull, I bought 4 - 100' foot synthetic cables ( rated at 20,000lbs off e-bay and used several tow straps. The line of pull was through a section of red willows and I chain sawed a path through them, Using two 4"x4"x10' posts and two sheets of 3/4" plywood , a floor jack and lots of odds and ends of 2 x whats. % hours later I had recovered the Kubota.

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