6 Speed Manual Regrets?

[DanW]

I just pulled my new boat with my 6 speed JL Sunday. I had been raving about the automatic in the JT and how effortless it pulls it. Well, the manual pulls it just as easily. The boat weighed in at about 2700lbs, with gear and fuel. No problem for either Jeep, but I was very pleased with how the 6 speed did. And it achieved about 1/2 to 3/4 mpg better than the JT did. That surprised me. But I was able to keep the revs a little lower in some situations. The auto likes to keep them up higher, to suit the 3.6's powerband. I will note, my JL is running 4.56 axle gears while the JT is with 4.10's. But it used to be that manuals were usually equpped with a higher gear ratio from the factory than their equivalent automatic counterpart. That's why I won't need to regear the auto. Both are on 35's.

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[Libis22]

Ok, so my 2021 Mojave with 71K lost its right side cam. Every high lift lobe was toast. Left side is pristine.
The engine really should have been retuned for more low rpm torque for the 6spd manual.
At 8000feet it regularly sees 5000rpm to make it move like a Mojave is meant to. I have no doubt at low altitudes behind the auto the engine is acceptable.
My son commented: Its said when the clutch and brake pads outlast the engine.
Its really sad because its such a fantastic machine otherwise.

It's such a bummer a non high-performance NA engine has issues this early! regarding the tune.. Didn't they detune these engines using a software 'fix' for clutch issues? At least that's what I understood from this forum. Wonder if there is a way to change that..

Do technicians have a clue how this happened? What are the next steps? Do you have a Mopar Warranty?

 

[DanW]

It's such a bummer a non high-performance NA engine has issues this early! regarding the tune.. Didn't they detune these engines using a software 'fix' for clutch issues? At least that's what I understood from this forum. Wonder if there is a way to change that..

Do technicians have a clue how this happened? What are the next steps? Do you have a Mopar Warranty?

There was no de-tuning during normal operation. That is a popular misunderstanding. The detune only occurs if the computer detects enough clutch slippage to trigger it to avoid excessive heat. If you don´t have excessive slippage, it will never happen and the engine gives its full power.

It is no different than the OBD2 system detecting an engine problem and going into a limp home mode. EVERY modern engine sold in North America has certain things that will trigger a limp home mode, which detunes the engine. So this is nothing radical, new, or unusual. It is intended to avoid a catastrophic failure by preventing the high heat buildup in the clutch if excessive slipping is present.

My engine has the update and has never experienced that kind of slippage nor has the detune been triggered.

Btw, if the detune is triggered, you will see a message on the dash display telling you that the clutch is in an overheat condition. I can´t remember the exact message, but there have been owners report seeing it.

If anyone does get that message, take it to a dealership ASAP. If your clutching habits are not terrible, then you have a problem that needs to be addressed immediately. The clutch should never slip that much to trigger this mode.

 

[seven30]

Out

It's such a bummer a non high-performance NA engine has issues this early! regarding the tune.. Didn't they detune these engines using a software 'fix' for clutch issues? At least that's what I understood from this forum. Wonder if there is a way to change that..

Do technicians have a clue how this happened? What are the next steps? Do you have a Mopar Warranty?

Why indeed! Soccer van motor in a Mojave!
The "detune" was just a power drop if your slipping the clutch too much. Normally it has no effect. The mechanic suspected improper camshaft heat treatment because every lobe on right cam was similarly damaged while left cam was still perfect.

The salesman I bought it from basically said I should have gotten the extended warranty......

I think Ill park it at the train terminal with the repair bill on the window and let it speak for itself.

 

[hjdca]

I ran 37's with the factory 4.10 for 2 years and just moved to 5.13's after driving a 4-speed for the last 2 years. Daily driving wasn't so bad and, like you, I actually liked the taller 1st gear except I stalled many more times in this rig than any other in my life (and I've been driving manuals for almost 35 years)

On the trail though, it's a different story. Obstacles I could easily cross just by feathering the brake pedal (no clutch or skinny pedal) became an issue. 1st gear rock crawling was not nearly as fun as it was before. Stalling on the trail was much more frequent.

I am looking forward to my next trail ride with the 5.13's. I would also like to hear your experience on the trail with the 4.10 and 37's to compare to mine.

You will love the 5.13's on the rock gardens with the manual transmission. On a JTR, with the 4 to 1 Transfer case, 1st gear, 4WD low is like a tractor. Here I am doing Holcomb Creek's second rock garden. At the end of the run, you can see me feathering the brake pedal to slow down, but, never using the clutch. You can basically "pause" with 5.13s using the brake without stalling.

If you have a tazer, I also map my steering wheel button to "Rock Crawl" brake lock, so, I can pause on a sloped boulder using the clutch, then, start again without moving backward at all - with my feet on the clutch and gas pedals... If you practice with the "Rock Crawl" brake lock button, you can get really good at it. It is really a game changer in the Boulders when you need to stop.

 

[shootify]

In plain English,
Auto is boring, manual is not boring.

 

[Birds83]

In plain English,
Auto is boring, manual is not boring.

This!
but really I wish Jeep didn’t have the issues with the manuals that we do and I’m working to get mine squared away.
at the same time I can’t imagine owning a Jeep that wasn’t a auto.
I test drove an auto before driving 2 hours to get my manual and the auto is nice but doesn’t feel like a jeep.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

In plain English,
Auto is boring, manual is not boring.

Bet I can back a trailer/boat/camper/flatbed into a complex parking position a lot faster and easier.................
I've had both, and for maneuvering long trailers around less than straight areas, I'll take auto and leave the stupid high reverse and burning clutch smell behind.
Sorry, i like a stick, too - and own a car with a T5, but I'd never be able to maneuver my car hauler back into place with a stick and I challenge a MT JT owner to hook onto my trailer and put it into its spot as quickly as I can.

Each has their place and reason. if I never towed, I'd be fine with a stick Gladiator, but then I hate driving my car in 4pm I80 traffic by Altoona, too.......... I'm going to boil the clutch hydraulic fluid with the constant stop and go, fast and slow, all at the same time.

I didn't own an automatic transmission anything until I got married, except for a truck I had because of my busted up collar bone that never properly healed. Otherwise, everything was manual.
Luckily, the clutch in my car isn't hard to use, otherwise I'd be looking at converting it because of my knees and hips.
You'll get old one day, kid. My neighbor has two replacement knees - decades of driving and operating the county's heavy trucks and other equipment. He swears he'll never own another manual transmission.
Enjoy your great health while you can.

 

[ArchEtech]

I’m loving mine so far and don’t really think it’s that tricky to shift. Every manual shifts differently and it takes a little getting used to. First gear is definitely a little quick. So far with its little quirks, I haven’t smelled the clutch even one time.

Ive found that feathering the gas a little bit helps you also don’t have to slam the clutch all the way to the floor to make smooth shifts either.

I hadn’t driven a manual for 15 years hopped into test drive and had no issue at all. I stalled it a couple times at a stoplight just because I forgot that I was in a manual, but that’s about it. the engine does like to rev and if you want to get it going quick to 30 it can get there pretty quick. I’m only a week in to ownership. Again, it’s a truck don’t drive it like a GTI.

 

[Birds83]

Bet I can back a trailer/boat/camper/flatbed into a complex parking position a lot faster and easier.................
I've had both, and for maneuvering long trailers around less than straight areas, I'll take auto and leave the stupid high reverse and burning clutch smell behind.
Sorry, i like a stick, too - and own a car with a T5, but I'd never be able to maneuver my car hauler back into place with a stick and I challenge a MT JT owner to hook onto my trailer and put it into its spot as quickly as I can.

Each has their place and reason. if I never towed, I'd be fine with a stick Gladiator, but then I hate driving my car in 4pm I80 traffic by Altoona, too.......... I'm going to boil the clutch hydraulic fluid with the constant stop and go, fast and slow, all at the same time.

I didn't own an automatic transmission anything until I got married, except for a truck I had because of my busted up collar bone that never properly healed. Otherwise, everything was manual.
Luckily, the clutch in my car isn't hard to use, otherwise I'd be looking at converting it because of my knees and hips.
You'll get old one day, kid. My neighbor has two replacement knees - decades of driving and operating the county's heavy trucks and other equipment. He swears he'll never own another manual transmission.
Enjoy your great health while you can.
[/QUOTE
My opinion it’s a Jeep I’m not pulling a car hauler with that. I do keep things with it and enjoy it. If I need something to work I’ve got a 1 ton diesel full size truck to tow and haul.

I get the body deterioration aspect I feel it some days myself unfortunately.

 

[CampThree]

I grew up on sticks and owned many in my adult years including six Harley's. I ordered a 2013 2 door Rubicon Wrangler with a stick and instantly regretted it. From being in traffic on a hill, stop and go, backing up a trailer to scratching a gear or two I went with an auto in my Mojave and love every minute of it.

 

[Birds83]

I grew up on sticks and owned many in my adult years including six Harley's. I ordered a 2013 2 door Rubicon Wrangler with a stick and instantly regretted it. From being in traffic on a hill, stop and go, backing up a trailer to scratching a gear or two I went with an auto in my Mojave and love every minute of it.

I hated the clutch in my Mojave when I got it and it’s just not a good set up. I daily drove a 97 TJ 5speed before it and have drove manuals for a long time prior.
Recently at 4,500 miles I put a ACT heavy duty clutch with pro-mass flywheel in it.
absolutely night and day so far. Only about 50 miles on it so not ready to give a full review but I’m impressed.

 

[shootify]

I hated the clutch in my Mojave when I got it and it’s just not a good set up. I daily drove a 97 TJ 5speed before it and have drove manuals for a long time prior.
Recently at 4,500 miles I put a ACT heavy duty clutch with pro-mass flywheel in it.
absolutely night and day so far. Only about 50 miles on it so not ready to give a full review but I’m impressed.

where did you get it from?

 

[Birds83]

got mine straight from ACT

https://www.advancedclutch.com/jp6-hdss-act-heavy-duty-off-road-performance-street-sprung-clutch-kit

 

[seven30]

This!
but really I wish Jeep didn’t have the issues with the manuals that we do and I’m working to get mine squared away.
at the same time I can’t imagine owning a Jeep that wasn’t a auto.
I test drove an auto before driving 2 hours to get my manual and the auto is nice but doesn’t feel like a jeep.

I agree the manual is what really decided it for me. While it took some time to break in the clutch its now superb. My camshaft failure really took the shine off the Gladiator though. I have had zero issues with the truck until the cam issue. No steering or clutch problems. I will say FCA should have retuned the engine for six gears instead of eight.

I’m loving mine so far and don’t really think it’s that tricky to shift. Every manual shifts differently and it takes a little getting used to. First gear is definitely a little quick. So far with its little quirks, I haven’t smelled the clutch even one time.

Ive found that feathering the gas a little bit helps you also don’t have to slam the clutch all the way to the floor to make smooth shifts either.

I hadn’t driven a manual for 15 years hopped into test drive and had no issue at all. I stalled it a couple times at a stoplight just because I forgot that I was in a manual, but that’s about it. the engine does like to rev and if you want to get it going quick to 30 it can get there pretty quick. I’m only a week in to ownership. Again, it’s a truck don’t drive it like a GTI.

It will get even better with time. My clutch took a while to bed in but its really superb now. Funny a lot of people bad mouth this clutch but at 70k miles the only problem the truck had was a total camshaft failure!

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