Official EcoDiesel Oil and Filter Recommendations

[biodiesel]

T6 was one of the worst performers.

T6 has not been tested by anyone in that group but GDE. The guy who says that T6 is junk oil is the guy who is an Amsoil dealer, plus he's referring to the 2nd gen EcoDiesel, not the 3rd gen. The highest mileage EcoDiesels (400,000+ miles) were all running T6. It's far from junk oil.

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[Almost]

T6 has not been tested by anyone in that group but GDE. The guy who says that T6 is junk oil is the guy who is an Amsoil dealer, plus he's referring to the 2nd gen EcoDiesel, not the 3rd gen. The highest mileage EcoDiesels (400,000+ miles) were all running T6. It's far from junk oil.

It’s been tested else where too. I could care less about what that guy says because I’ll never buy amsoil, but I do like tests. It’s not the right oil for this motor.

Here is a test with worrying results on the Ram forum by a member that is well aware that he shouldn’t be running it.

https://5thgenrams.com/community/threads/oil-analysis-report.29854/

My local dealer put T6 in mine and I made them change it immediately. And 2 quarts extra.

 

[rharr]

the debate about oil is like pissing in the wind. It just turns into a mess and goes everywhere.
The biggest take away from any oil debate is less about the brand and more about interval.

Pick your flavor of choice and half the intervals the MFR suggests.

Me personally I go 3500 miles per change like in the old days. These oil burners dump a ton of soot in the oil even at 3500 miles, the stuff is midnight black by then and will stain a drive way, i can't imagine what 8k mile oil looks like.

 

[biodiesel]

I’ll never buy amsoil, but I do like tests. It’s not the right oil for this motor.

If you notice, some of the oils that are performing well aren't the right oils for this engine, either. We have to stop looking at what FCA recommends and start looking at the data. So far, we haven't seen any data to suggest that T6 is harmful for the engine. GDE has inside connections to the engineers. They told him that T6 is perfectly fine.

"In our Gen3 engines we have run the Rotella T6 since day 1. FCA’s explanation about why not to run the Rotella is due to “turbocharger deposits” which is a completely bogus reason in our opinion as other engines in the US using the exact same turbocharger internals spec the CJ-rated oils with no issue.

Unofficially we’ve been told the Rotella is just fine, but not sure we can “tell” people to run the Rotella. For sure we see no reason not to run the Rotella, our last oil sample in August of this year had aluminum at 9ppm and that was after about 250-300hrs of dyno abuse and 4500miles.

High aluminum in the oil I’d think would be from a piston scuffing the cylinder walls. These engines have low-tension piston rings which reduce a little bit the friction (effort needed to push/pull it in the cylinder bore) but leads to degraded oil film management on the bore surface.

There should have been an anti-scuff coating on the piston skirts like on the Gen2 engine but maybe the piston is getting fore-aft loaded in the bore where there is no coating."

 

[biodiesel]

the debate about oil is like pissing in the wind. It just turns into a mess and goes everywhere.
The biggest take away from any oil debate is less about the brand and more about interval.

I agree with you. Unlike most vehicle owners, I actually take oil samples at every interval. I also take coolant samples, transmission fluid samples, and differential fluid samples. I have lots of data and use the data to drive my decisions.

People flip out when a 5W-40 engine oil falls into the 5W-30 range. That doesn't mean the oil has stopped protecting the engine. The 2014 EcoDiesel came out of the factory with a 5W-30 oil, lol. These engines can run all day on 5W-30. 5W-40 just gives the oil enough time to protect the engine for the longer 10,000-mile interval.

Personally, I do a lot of towing, idle time, and short commutes. Due to my severe service driving conditions, I change the oil at 5,000 - 6,000-mile intervals.

There are a dozen possible things that will eventually cause an engine failure, and the brand of engine oil that we use isn't going to be one of them.

 

[rharr]

I agree with you. Unlike most vehicle owners, I actually take oil samples at every interval. I also take coolant samples, transmission fluid samples, and differential fluid samples. I have lots of data and use the data to drive my decisions.

People flip out when a 5W-40 engine oil falls into the 5W-30 range. That doesn't mean the oil has stopped protecting the engine. The 2014 EcoDiesel came out of the factory with a 5W-30 oil, lol. These engines can run all day on 5W-30. 5W-40 just gives the oil enough time to protect the engine for the longer 10,000-mile interval.

Personally, I do a lot of towing, idle time, and short commutes. Due to my severe service driving conditions, I change the oil at 5,000 - 6,000-mile intervals.

There are a dozen possible things that will eventually cause an engine failure, and the brand of engine oil that we use isn't going to be one of them.

yeap,
One of these days BD when I am in Gallup for work, we should get a beer and talk EcoD.

 

[Almost]

I have abandoned the MS rating recommendation, but I'm not willing to abandon the API SN or SP rating as that is the requirement to keep your warranty intact. Unfortunately, T6 isn't SN or SP rated and is CK-4 by API. I never said it was junk - I said it was a worse performer.

All oil is fine, there are just better and worse performers like I said. Nothing is going to cause catastrophic failure the moment you put it in. This is again the reason why I choose shorter intervals and change it at 50% oil life. Then I don't care how long the protection lasts for because I'm never going to get there anyway. I have no favorites and have used Pennzoil 3x, Quaker State 1x and now I'm on to Motul since I'm now only looking at API SP oils which is the latest and greatest rating introduced in 2020.

 

[biodiesel]

yeap,
One of these days BD when I am in Gallup for work, we should get a beer and talk EcoD.

That sounds good. ?

 

[22EcoDs]

@biodiesel @rharr @Almost I am running QS EUro 5-40 and my latest report wasnt too good on the factory PP for my mileage. From what I have seen on QS I should pull it early and swap it out. Problem is I have 9 qts sitting in my garage of QS to use.. https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/oil-analysis-21k-miles.71847/

 

[rharr]

@biodiesel @rharr @Almost I am running QS EUro 5-40 and my latest report wasnt too good on the factory PP for my mileage. From what I have seen on QS I should pull it early and swap it out. Problem is I have 9 qts sitting in my garage of QS to use.. https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/oil-analysis-21k-miles.71847/

I am run QS to since i got a good deal on it. Best I can tell QS and Pennzoil are the same thing, that have the exact same data sheet specs right down to format.

Good or bad just burn through your QS 3000 miles at a time if it's got you worried. 7800 miles seems like a lot and would have high contamination, just due to the period of time to concentrate them

Pull a sample at 3k and see what it says.

 

[biodiesel]

I never said it was junk - I said it was a worse performer.

Correct. The Amsoil fanboy in your group said it was junk. You said it was terrible.


I've seen pictures of the gen 2 engine with 400,000 miles tore down. It was clean inside (no slude and normal wear). I have yet to see a 3rd gen EcoDiesel tore down, so unfortunately, I can't make too many assessments outside of the UOA reports.

All oil is fine, there are just better and worse performers like I said. Nothing is going to cause catastrophic failure the moment you put it in. This is again the reason why I choose shorter intervals and change it at 50% oil life.

According to the labs, nearly 50% of all engine failures are related to the cooling system. Some failures are related to contamination (fuel dilution, seal/gasket failure, etc.). Taking oil samples allows us to see if something isn't working properly and trying to catch it before it becomes catastrophic. Generally speaking, there shouldn't be many problems in the first 100,000 miles. But eventually, the engine is going to reach its full potential.

There are three philosophies, and each have their pros and cons.
1) Scheduled maintenance
2) Preventative maintenance
3) Run-to-failure

An example of scheduled maintenance would be oil and filter changes. This happens based on miles and/or time. Its purpose is to prevent wear and tear and hope for the best.

Preventative maintenance, on the other hand, is when data is collected, and decisions are made about the service life of a particular part. In other words, you're forecasting when a repair should be made based on service life. Its purpose is to prevent costly downtime and being inconvenienced.

Run-to-failure is when you run the part until it fails.

 

[biodiesel]

I am running QS EUro 5-40 and my latest report wasnt too good on the factory PP for my mileage. From what I have seen on QS I should pull it early and swap it out. Problem is I have 9 qts sitting in my garage of QS to use.

I'm running Pennzoil and pretty much stick to 5,000 - 6,000 mile intervals. Mine are mostly towing miles. As you can see, I've hit coolant temps as high as 230*F and oil as high as 257*F.

One theory is that iron and aluminum numbers will continue to drop as the engine gets more miles on it. I just sent off a sample yesterday, so we'll see what my trends are looking like.

 

[rharr]

I'm running Pennzoil and pretty much stick to 5,000 - 6,000 mile intervals. Mine are mostly towing miles. As you can see, I've hit coolant temps as high as 230*F and oil as high as 257*F.

One theory is that iron and aluminum numbers will continue to drop as the engine gets more miles on it. I just sent off a sample yesterday, so we'll see what my trends are looking like.

Thanks for the photo, i am glad to see evidence the Ram EcoD's also get high oil temps.

There was chatter that the Ram's don't get high oil temps.
My jeep will see oil temps like that when running steep grades at high speed.

 

[22EcoDs]

I'm running Pennzoil and pretty much stick to 5,000 - 6,000 mile intervals. Mine are mostly towing miles. As you can see, I've hit coolant temps as high as 230*F and oil as high as 257*F.

One theory is that iron and aluminum numbers will continue to drop as the engine gets more miles on it. I just sent off a sample yesterday, so we'll see what my trends are looking like.

What was your last alum/potassium# and mileage? Heres mine for recap.

 

[biodiesel]

Thanks for the photo, i am glad to see evidence the Ram EcoD's also get high oil temps.

There was chatter that the Ram's don't get high oil temps.
My jeep will see oil temps like that when running steep grades at high speed.

The key is to let off the throttle. Here's an example of what happens when towing up a long steep mountain grade at 35 mph. The coolant is 215*F and the oil is 230*F. If you notice, I'm running in 5th gear at 1,800 RPMS.

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