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DickensCPA

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If I remember correctly, JKs and JLs were being built simultaneously in 2018 and I think some did get their JLs in 2017. As for the high mileage JL, seems like someone was using theirs as an escort vehicle for heavy equipment trailers, putting in the long days and accumulating excessive miles.
I did not know that. I think I assumed they just used the first part of the 2018 model year to use up old JK parts and then started churning out JLs.
 

ShadowsPapa

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Same for my vehicles, I've been fortunate and have only had really reliable vehicles. The only item to fail and get me stuck somewhere has been starters, at least on vehicles over 100K, 3 of them. Of course, those were all Fords, so maybe that's a "Ford thing" 😄
Not sure what years you are speaking of, but for some years - gotta agree. The most reliable were the mad chihuahua starters as in the 70s and 80s - their gear reduction starters were reliable if not a bit noisy. The 90s Mitsubishi starter (I mistakenly said Denso earlier) was real small and real reliable. They'd go 150,000-200,000 miles without issue. They had bearings, not bushings, and permanent magnet fields. So the power draw was really low - a fraction of Ford and GM starters, and few moving parts to wear.
The fact that modern engines start so danged easily and turn over really easy even in cold weather means even longer starter life.

This video should be taken as opinion. Not fact. As long as everyone's going into it with that mindset, then it is what it is.
That's the problem with YT videos in general. Too much "I think" and not enough "here's proven facts". And add to it "tech for 10 years" and suddenly they know all there is to know and they let everyone know it on YT.

YT is actually dumbing people down, not making them smarter in too many cases. I cringe when I see YT links in forums - with many exceptions, of course - the fun ones with a guy racing a Wrangler 4xe, taking some trails on all electric, and some of the legit "how-to" videos out there like how to remove a part (many are good) how to replace a part (again, many are good - but beware of a few) and so on.
Opinion is not necessarily fact but when it's in a video, it seems to become just that.

Techs see the worst of things - "I had to replace 20 of these in the last 2 years, they are junk" - but they never see the hundreds of thousands that never need to be replaced...... the human race is doomed because everyone has cancer - says the janitor for the 8th floor of the hospital.
 
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montechie

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Not sure what years you are speaking of, but for some years - gotta agree.
Yeah, and to your other point about modern starters probably being more resilient too. These were a '96 Explorer, '00 Mustang, and an '03 F150. The F150 I suspect was corrosion related to be fair, it was low mileage when I bought it but it came from Chicago and had a surprising amount of corrosion on the components.

Actually the F150 did leave me temporarily stranded for a couple hours for one other cause, that darn infamous Triton spark plug issue, I had the 5.4L. Still regret selling that truck though.
 

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Yeah, and to your other point about modern starters probably being more resilient too. These were a '96 Explorer, '00 Mustang, and an '03 F150. The F150 I suspect was corrosion related to be fair, it was low mileage when I bought it but it came from Chicago and had a surprising amount of corrosion on the components.

Actually the F150 did leave me temporarily stranded for a couple hours for one other cause, that darn infamous Triton spark plug issue, I had the 5.4L. Still regret selling that truck though.
I had a 95 F250 with the heavy duty front axles. Like the truck a lot, but the 351 was wimpy as it aged, and it got to the point that on the highway, it had a bad wobble just shy of "death wobble" and no one could figure it out - yeah, not me, either. 2 grand worth of new parts up front - still really bad shimmy or wobble shy of DW. That and the fact that it struggled pulling my car hauler, and it rusted badly frame-wise...... it popped several brake lines due to rust. Weird. Luckily each time it happened on my own property. 80,000+ miles it was time for trade.
I guess every company has their issues, depending on the year and model and so on. But I can't think of any for the 2011 Silverado I had...... trying hard to remember a problem or failure and I just can't think of ony. Oh, yeah - it did fail one time - it left me stranded where it was parked next to my shop one time because the 6+ year old original battery failed. That was pretty bad and disappointing.
 

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You buy his wares??
Not sure what you're asking. I've just always thought it was excess stress on a vehicle for the stop/start function for such a small 'gain' in mpg. I don't believe we would even have this if it wasn't for the gov forcing high mpg's on manufactures
 

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I found the guy extremely credible. I think I agreed with everything he said that I am knowledgable about. I definitely agree with the front camera as standard. That was a great answer. Thanks for the link.
 

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Not sure what you're asking. I've just always thought it was excess stress on a vehicle for the stop/start function for such a small 'gain' in mpg. I don't believe we would even have this if it wasn't for the gov forcing high mpg's on manufactures
7 to 10% mpg gain in tests by independent groups such as Edmunds and others.
No stress on the starter, and the engine "stress" has been taken care of years ago. New bearing technology makes them slicker than any bearing ever made for engines.
In short, you basically lose nothing, but stand to gain mpg.
It's just that people find it annoying, so don't like it.

I found the guy extremely credible.
Whatever...........
 

porsharman

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I've talked to and found techs who have never replaced one of these starters.
The engine design, the IROX bearings, the fact they know and control where the engine stops, fire injectors and coils at the right time even out of normal timing, it's crazy how the engines and starters are designed for this - but then it's been around in Europe and Asia for long before it came to the states. The technology is not new by any stretch.
Auto makers have been putting engine bearings in the engines that can handle 250,000-300,000 start cycles, compared to the previous 100,000 cycles.
Same for the starter - it can handle 4 to 5 times the number of start cycles and starting a warm engine is a fraction of the load on a starter. They have also slowed the RPM of the starter because it's the time spinning down that wears brushes and commutators. So running the starter motor slower, moving away from carbon brushes, changing the commutator materials and using needle bearings instead of bronze bushings (although the Denso starters of the 90s had bearings as well - and lasted 150,000-200,000 miles)

A lot of assuming out there, and thinking as if this is stuff from 20 years ago, even from that YT guy, who obviously is still a lot of old-school without much current training.
What have hybrids done for years? Stop the engine at every single stop sign, start it again.
I believe the start/stop function in the JL and JT is an Achilles heel and not worth the extra stress it puts on the engine and rest of the vehicles components not to mention the electronics. I have been at a trail head where a JT owner would have been stranded if not for his fellow Jeepers identifying his problem…. aux battery failure. I have a 21 JTRD that I have deleted the auxiliary battery without an issue and a Tazer so I don’t use the start stop function. All of this aggravation for an extra 1 or 2 mpgs seems nonsensical.
 

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ShadowsPapa

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I believe the start/stop function in the JL and JT is an Achilles heel and not worth the extra stress it puts on the engine and rest of the vehicles components not to mention the electronics. I have been at a trail head where a JT owner would have been stranded if not for his fellow Jeepers identifying his problem…. aux battery failure. I have a 21 JTRD that I have deleted the auxiliary battery without an issue and a Tazer so I don’t use the start stop function. All of this aggravation for an extra 1 or 2 mpgs seems nonsensical.
Your choice. Believe what you wish. The proof otherwise is out there if you open the mind. (and look in the correct places)
 

AmishMike

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A jeep tech, a mechanic, and a JT owner walk into a bar............
........................
and punch the s@*t out of an engineer.
 

ShadowsPapa

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What's more interesting is how half the internet impersonates engineers.
 
 



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