Any reason to avoid Manual Transmission?

[MF Comics]

Sorry to be late to the 5 O'clock free crack giveaway, but wanted to see how people felt about it today

Read on the Jeep forum, different (lighter) flywheel made a difference, maybe a different clutch would help as well

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[hjdca]

I'm happy with my 6speed manual in my Rubicon. Clutch takes some getting used too and reverse is pretty tall - used to other vehicles with gear whiners in reverse - have to rev a bit higher. The throws are short and precise. Wish the Jeep engine was louder since I am accustomed to shifting by sound but often can't really hear it. May be going aftermarket exhaust. I wonder if I'd be less happy if I didn't have a Rubi with 4.10 axle gears?

I am also pretty happy with the Rubi manual with the 4.10s. I live in hilly, mountainous area, but, I am pleased enough to try larger tires when I change the Falken M/Ts, I think I will stick with the stock rims and try a light 34" to 35" tire, something like a 285/75, 305/70, 315/70, 35x12.5..... The stock Falken M/T is 61 lbs, so, I hoping to not add more than 5 to 6 lbs of rubber. I am thinking, the gears will still be good with this increase.....

 

[Gatorized]

I'm at 2K flawless experience on the MT. If you expect the gearing to be like a close-spaced car 6 speed you'll be confused and frustrated. Someone said it's like an old truck four speed with stump puller first- and then a pair of overdrives, and I think that is a really good way to describe it, and once I approached it/ drove it that way, I really like it. Before I got it I also wondered, since I live in VT, if I'd find the overdrive gearing too tall to ever stay in OD on hills. But I have found on the interstate that depending on the speed I'm going, I can hold steady speed uphill one some steep, long hills, in 5 or even 6, though I have to downshift if I need to accelerate uphill.

If you want an MT, get an MT, the sky is not falling. If you want maximum acceleration under the widest possible range of conditions, you may want to consider the auto, because an auto can probably keep the 3.6 "up at full boil" in its higher RPM higher torque powerband more readily than most drivers are going to be able to with the MT.

They have probably replaced clutches for people between 80,000 - 160,000 miles.

The Gearing is like a 4 speed. You'll shift outta first quick and then have one less shift getting to 65mph. But doing 70-80/90 mph you'll be flipping between 5th and 6th

if you look at this gearing its basically the same as the NSG370 in the JK, same as in the TJ/LJ '04-'06, which I often find I just skip gears, 3rd and 4th are so close, or especially 5th (1.0-1) because 4th is 1.15-1 and that is too close most times unless you're down shifting to get up a mountain, and I always want a 7th due to the 6th being only .85-1, so I think I'm gonna really like 2 overdrives.

My '55 cj5 only has 3 gears and you're out of first (2.79-1) by maybe 3-5 mph, 2nd (1.55-1) by 20 mph and whine out 3rd (1.0-1) to its maximum speed 50 mph and you have to pause between each shift just like an old truck or you are grinding gears even though they are synchronized. But you can see the gears are almost the same positions as well, I think, maybe people expect this truck to shift like a car and they prefer acceleration over fuel economy, with a manual you get to chose when to make shifts and you can make 'em fast or slow, which is the beauty of a stick. This transmission as I see it is a granny gear, a 3 speed, then 2 overdrives, yoohoo! The venerable NV4500 valued for its granny gear (5.61), then 3.04, 1.67, 1, and .74 overdrive, basically the same as the JL/JT,

The clutch in the JL/JT is a little lighter than I would prefer.

The gearing in the JK vs JT is totally different. While the JTs transmission and linkage is clearly better the JK had better gear ratios which would've been nice on the JT. FCA was clearly going for MPG with the JT wide gearing and two overdrives. This would be ok with a torque rich engine which the 3.6 is not. The combination just does not work as it should and the results are lackluster.

JL/JT vs JK
1st – 5.13 4.46
2nd – 2.63 2.61
3rd – 1.54 1.72
4th – 1.00 1.25
5th – 0.81 1.00
6th – 0.72 0.80
Rev – 4.49 4.06

I was curious myself about gearing in earlier models so rounded up these figures:
1955-1970 (CJ)
B-W T98 (4sp): 6.40 3.09 1.69 1.00 — — Rev 7.82
1971-1979 (CJ)
B-W T18 (4sp): 4.02 2.41 1.41 1.00 — — Rev 7.44
1977-1979 (CJ)
B-W T18A (4sp): 6.32 3.09 1.69 1.00 —- —- Rev 7.44
1976-1979 (CJ)
B-W T150 (3sp): —- 2.99 1.75 1.00 —- —- Rev 3.17
1980 - 1986 (CJ)
T-176 (4sp): 3.52 2.27 1.46 1.00 —- —- Rev 3.52
1987 - 1989 (YJ)
Peugeot BA 10/5 (5sp):3.39 2.33 1.44 1.00 0.72 —- Rev n/a
1987 - 1995 (YJ), 1997 - 2006 (TJ)
Aisin AX-5 (5sp): 3.93 2.33 1.45 1.00 0.85 —- Rev 4.74
1988 - 1995, 1997 - 1999
Aisin AX-15 (5sp): 3.83 2.33 1.44 1.00 .795 —- Rev 4.22
2000 - 2004 (TJ)
NV3550 (5sp): 4.01. 2.33 1.39 1.00 .78. —- Rev 3.50
2005-2006 (TJ), 2007 - 2018 (JK)
NSG370 (6sp): 4.46 2.61 1.72 1.25 1.0 .84 Rev 4.06
2019 - (JL, JT)
Aisin AL6 D478 (6sp): 5.13 2.63 1.53 1.00 0.81 0.72 Rev 4.49

I drove the T18a in my CJ5 and it was a stump puller in 1st!

 

[Jt-wrx]

I'm happy with my 6speed manual in my Rubicon. Clutch takes some getting used too and reverse is pretty tall - used to other vehicles with gear whiners in reverse - have to rev a bit higher. The throws are short and precise. Wish the Jeep engine was louder since I am accustomed to shifting by sound but often can't really hear it. May be going aftermarket exhaust. I wonder if I'd be less happy if I didn't have a Rubi with 4.10 axle gears?

I have 3000+ kms on my sport 6 speed with mopar lift on 35's and agree with this, i'm pretty used to things but still stall occasionally, i do plan to re-gear when i can get truetrac lsd's from eaton but can easily live with 3.73's forever too. 4.10's would be about 10% higher on rpms for given speed and leave me around 2200 rpm at about 75 mph so that's the plan so far. Truck duty, wheeling build would be different. 4.56 would be about 20% change, not sure i'd go that far, maybe 4.30's if they have such a beast? No plans to go above 35's as i still want to fit in 6'6" parkades and i'm at 6'5" now.

I need to add that i love the manual and clutch etc. Hydraulic takes a little feel away from the old school but it's light and so much fun to drive, the satisfaction level is what i wanted. Very happy i chose the manual.

 

[Bbannongmu]

I have 3000+ kms on my sport 6 speed with mopar lift on 35's and agree with this, i'm pretty used to things but still stall occasionally, i do plan to re-gear when i can get truetrac lsd's from eaton but can easily live with 3.73's forever too. 4.10's would be about 10% higher on rpms for given speed and leave me around 2200 rpm at about 75 mph so that's the plan so far. Truck duty, wheeling build would be different. 4.56 would be about 20% change, not sure i'd go that far, maybe 4.30's if they have such a beast? No plans to go above 35's as i still want to fit in 6'6" parkades and i'm at 6'5" now.

I need to add that i love the manual and clutch etc. Hydraulic takes a little feel away from the old school but it's light and so much fun to drive, the satisfaction level is what i wanted. Very happy i chose the manual.

Not sure it’s cost effective to go to 4.10 from 3.73. The gains will be minimal and it costs the same as going to 4.56 or 4.88. Unless you find some max tow or Rubicon take off axle for sale with 4.10 gears.

Glad you are enjoying the manual. Me too. Jeeping is a disease where we turn money into parts and imagine ways to tear apart a perfectly good vehicle to make it a bit better. Good luck.

 

[Jt-wrx]

Ya because I want truetrac lsd’s in both ends instead of e-lockers I am opening them up anyway and would only re-gear when I do that. Part of the reason I wanted a sport instead of rubicon. I am happy with 3.73 on 35’s as is and would not change to 4.10 without an added reason like mine...if building a crawler or bigger tires or tow more etc then yes of course go deeper than 4.10.

 

[Jt-wrx]

Wish the Jeep engine was louder since I am accustomed to shifting by sound but often can't really hear it. May be going aftermarket exhaust.

Agree, and i did go aftermarket. First i had a muffler shop cut out the first two mufflers but ended up with a bad drone on highway, loved it around town, it's a performance v6 so does sound as good as a 6 can sound imo. I quickly ordered the magnaflow street series side exit and it's perfect, it lets you shift a lot more by sound and adds a reasonable amount of volume for manual shifting enjoyment. No drone, it's ideal for my desires, the 3" tip looks awesome too but if you're a crawler then you'll want the crawler version as you'll smash up the tip on the street series.

 

[Incommando]

if you look at this gearing its basically the same as the NSG370 in the JK, same as in the TJ/LJ '04-'06, which I often find I just skip gears, 3rd and 4th are so close, or especially 5th (1.0-1) because 4th is 1.15-1 and that is too close most times unless you're down shifting to get up a mountain, and I always want a 7th due to the 6th being only .85-1, so I think I'm gonna really like 2 overdrives.

My '55 cj5 only has 3 gears and you're out of first (2.79-1) by maybe 3-5 mph, 2nd (1.55-1) by 20 mph and whine out 3rd (1.0-1) to its maximum speed 50 mph and you have to pause between each shift just like an old truck or you are grinding gears even though they are synchronized. But you can see the gears are almost the same positions as well, I think, maybe people expect this truck to shift like a car and they prefer acceleration over fuel economy, the automatic does all the shifting when you smash the pedal, roving each gear into higher RPMs, but with a manual you get to chose when to make shifts and you can make 'em fast or slow, which is the beauty of a stick. This transmission as I see it is a granny gear, a 3 speed, then 2 overdrives, yoohoo! The venerable NV4500 valued for its granny gear (5.61), then 3.04, 1.67, 1, and .74 overdrive, basically the same as the JL/JT,

The clutch in the JL/JT is a little lighter than I would prefer.

The NSG370 used in the JK had a lot of issues. The one in my ‘15 JKU got replaced at 32k. That may be what the sales weasel is thinking of... The JT uses a completely new transmission.

 

[DRAKENSTEIN]

The gearing of this transmission sucks. It's clearly geared for getting the best MPG on the EPA circuit. No one is expecting high performance "wow" out of Jeep truck. I do expect it to do 30 MPH uphill in third gear and maintain speed, it can't. I expect it to be able to back out of my driveway with out stuttering and stalling, it can't. We have two other manuals in the house and they are fine with the same task. The gearing in the JT is absolute crap for anyone that lives where there are hills. It's tough to admit that your $45k trucks transmission sucks but it does. Anyone saying otherwise lives in flat lands or doesn't want to admit it.

I will admit that it does take a bit of getting used to. I've stalled it many times especially in reverse. But I also came from a 2002 Wrangler 4.0 manual. Two different animals.

 

[Bbannongmu]

I am also pretty happy with the Rubi manual with the 4.10s. I live in hilly, mountainous area, but, I am pleased enough to try larger tires when I change the Falken M/Ts, I think I will stick with the stock rims and try a light 34" to 35" tire, something like a 285/75, 305/70, 315/70, 35x12.5..... The stock Falken M/T is 61 lbs, so, I hoping to not add more than 5 to 6 lbs of rubber. I am thinking, the gears will still be good with this increase.....

I ended up adding a Borla exhaust to shift by sound and now running 37x12.50 tires. Could use 4.88 or 5.13 gears. But at 10,000 miles and I still enjoy the manual.

 

[Bbannongmu]

Agree, and i did go aftermarket. First i had a muffler shop cut out the first two mufflers but ended up with a bad drone on highway, loved it around town, it's a performance v6 so does sound as good as a 6 can sound imo. I quickly ordered the magnaflow street series side exit and it's perfect, it lets you shift a lot more by sound and adds a reasonable amount of volume for manual shifting enjoyment. No drone, it's ideal for my desires, the 3" tip looks awesome too but if you're a crawler then you'll want the crawler version as you'll smash up the tip on the street series.

I went Borla climber S type. Tip dumps behind the axle to mostly keep it protected and out of the rocks . Sounds pretty good.

 

[YayMud!]

I usually get all of my vehicles with a stick shift. However, my last car had a very precise short throw shifter so the manual transmission in the Jeep felt like rowing a boat to me. The A/T is actually pretty decent and this is coming from a guy who normally tries to avoid an A/T as much as possible.

It really came down to knowing that I just would not enjoy the Jeep manual transmission as much as I normally do in my cars. That combined with my friend with a manual transmission Jeep who has worn out clutches a bit prematurely while off-roading convinced me to at least try the Jeep with the A/T and so far no complaints.

 

[Slapping_Rabbits]

I usually get all of my vehicles with a stick shift. However, my last car had a very precise short throw shifter so the manual transmission in the Jeep felt like rowing a boat to me. The A/T is actually pretty decent and this is coming from a guy who normally tries to avoid an A/T as much as possible.

It really came down to knowing that I just would not enjoy the Jeep manual transmission as much as I normally do in my cars. That combined with my friend with a manual transmission Jeep who has worn out clutches a bit prematurely while off-roading convinced me to at least try the Jeep with the A/T and so far no complaints.

Agreed. I tried a mini cooper with a stick and it was like playing Mario kart!

 

[Empty Pockets]

I’ve had quite a few manuals over the years (been driving 45 years and have had only 1 or 2 automatics). I really like the MT in my Gladiator. I think that today’s Jeep is not yesterday’s Jeep. It’s no longer a farm implement or a Forrest Service vehicle. So it is not geared to do extreme off road 100% of the time. Sure, there are guys that wheel them HARD. But, these same guys also drive them to work, to the ball park and even (dare I say it...) to the mall. It is an all around, all purpose vehicle and I think the MT chosen fits that role exceptionally well. It is as different from the 6 speed MT I had in my ‘05 Super Duty as it is from the sport cars and compact passenger cars that it is often compared to. I’m really happy with it. I live in the slightly hilly area of the North Atlanta Metro, but have driven in the flat lands of South Ga as well as the mountains of North GA and Tennessee. Never a complaint. If someone is really not into manuals or just really prefers AT, fine with me. But, apples to apples guys. To say it doesn’t shift as cool as the Mini you drove, or the Porsche you had, or that it is less trail worthy than your old CJ or M38A1 is like saying your sausage pizza isn’t as sweet as the cheese cake from the desert tray. Just my opinion.

 

[MoparDave]

The Jeep Gladiator manual is easy and smooth. At first I had to get used to the light clutch, but once I did, I realized the light clutch is what makes it a dream manual to daily drive.
After 13k plus miles and no issues, it’s been a winner for me. Still a winner on 37’s with stock gearing.

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