Ecodiesel power derating as temps rise?

[@californiajeeping]

The charge pipes will have absolutely nothing to do with Inter cooler efficiency. What they CAN do is help with airflow(depending on stock design) and help with throttle response(rubber Inter cooler hoses will flex slightly with boost which hurts response).

I'm curious if the rumored new grill will make a difference. I'm guessing yes or since I doubt FCA would make that large of a change for nothing.

When it comes down to it, I think injection is going to be the route to go unfortunately. Just not enough room in the bay unless you want to go wild with your engineering. Turn on the injection when you know you are going to hit your temps such as inclines and keep it off when you don't need it.

I would try the new grill..

FYI this is your factory "oil cooler"

Engine coolant cycles through the heat exchanger to stabilize oil temps. Unfortunately oil temps regularly get higher than the coolant system and due to this design are unable to be cooled below the coolant system temp (210-230).

I have been talking about potentially seperating the coolant going to the heat exchanger with two hoses that run to a pump and fan cooled radiator. That would allow oil temps to drop below the ECT and give you more "headroom" before an overheat/derate.

Just an idea.

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[Jefe1018]

The charge pipes will have absolutely nothing to do with Inter cooler efficiency. What they CAN do is help with airflow(depending on stock design) and help with throttle response(rubber Inter cooler hoses will flex slightly with boost which hurts response).

I'm curious if the rumored new grill will make a difference. I'm guessing yes or since I doubt FCA would make that large of a change for nothing.

When it comes down to it, I think injection is going to be the route to go unfortunately. Just not enough room in the bay unless you want to go wild with your engineering. Turn on the injection when you know you are going to hit your temps such as inclines and keep it off when you don't need it.

Injection of what exactly?

 

[ZoneArc]

He's talking about water injection.
It works very well to cool the ambient air as it's entering the combustion chamber. On Diesels it can give you a serious power boost too. I'm not sure it does much about oil temps.

 

[ZoneArc]

https://www.dieselpowerproducts.com...XARHoM3GTfsEK-kNPqqUksJ6rL2sZeJBoCjWYQAvD_BwE

 

[steelponycowboy]

There is an external transmission cooler but the oil cooler is a small heat exchanger built into the filter housing that cycles engine coolant through it.

There is no external oil cooler on the ecodiesel?

Both diesel shops I had it at said the oil cooler was external, I don't know, I didn't crawl around under it to look. They both took lots of pictures from top to bottom to try to figure something out. Bulletproof Diesel in Mesa has a pretty good rep for diesel performance and after looking at mine was going to buy one to play with it. I just sent my contact an email to see where they are.

Dealer told me that if I replace the oil cooler, it could cause warranty problems, so there must be a cooler other than where it is on the 3.6 motor. The whole idea with the diesel that is stuffed into the small engine compartment is that heat is an issue. There is no issue on the Ram truck with the 3.0 as there is plenty of space under the hood.

So based on what the dealer and Bulletproof Diesel told me I'm still thinking there is an external cooler somewhere for the 3.0. I can't find one but I know that the Ram does not have one for sure and there is some complaining of derating on their forums also towing 8000+

Now for Trans and Coolant, you can't go wrong with a Mishimoto radiator, I'm thinking that is the next thing to try. If your coolant is running 20 degrees cooler you would think the cooler engine would also have the oil running cooler. It really helped out on my 3.6 Wrangler here in the hot AZ summers

 

[steelponycowboy]

He's talking about water injection.
It works very well to cool the ambient air as it's entering the combustion chamber. On Diesels it can give you a serious power boost too. I'm not sure it does much about oil temps.

It could because it lowers the EGR temps. My son has an injection system on his Hell Cat motor with twin turbos. He says it makes a world of difference. It actually plumbs into the washer reservoir and uses the blue washer fluid that has alcohol in it.

 

[CrazyCooter]

Both diesel shops I had it at said the oil cooler was external, I don't know, I didn't crawl around under it to look. They both took lots of pictures from top to bottom to try to figure something out. Bulletproof Diesel in Mesa has a pretty good rep for diesel performance and after looking at mine was going to buy one to play with it. I just sent my contact an email to see where they are.

Dealer told me that if I replace the oil cooler, it could cause warranty problems, so there must be a cooler other than where it is on the 3.6 motor. The whole idea with the diesel that is stuffed into the small engine compartment is that heat is an issue. There is no issue on the Ram truck with the 3.0 as there is plenty of space under the hood.

So based on what the dealer and Bulletproof Diesel told me I'm still thinking there is an external cooler somewhere for the 3.0. I can't find one but I know that the Ram does not have one for sure and there is some complaining of derating on their forums also towing 8000+

Now for Trans and Coolant, you can't go wrong with a Mishimoto radiator, I'm thinking that is the next thing to try. If your coolant is running 20 degrees cooler you would think the cooler engine would also have the oil running cooler. It really helped out on my 3.6 Wrangler here in the hot AZ summers

The oil cooler is external.....its bolted to oil oil filter housing and fed water to cool it.

I haven't found any radiators that have a good reputation for reliability. Mishimoto was horrible for the local diesel shop I was dealing with and the internet reviews look much the same. All of the aftermarket aluminum radiators for jeep have a horrible reputation for leaks within a years time........

 

[steelponycowboy]

I could agree with you on that and that why the engine coolant temp climbs so high, but @steelponycowboy was saying its between the frame rails. That should be the trans cooler.

Every trans cooler I've ever seen on a Jeep was in front of the radiator and AC condenser

 

[steelponycowboy]

The oil cooler is external.....its bolted to oil oil filter housing and fed water to cool it.

I haven't found any radiators that have a good reputation for reliability. Mishimoto was horrible for the local diesel shop I was dealing with and the internet reviews look much the same. All of the aftermarket aluminum radiators for jeep have a horrible reputation for leaks within a years time........

My Mishimoto has been on my JK since 2016 and has not leaked yet. Coolant temps in the summer are 20+ degrees cooler than with the factory radiator.

 

[CrazyCooter]

Every trans cooler I've ever seen on a Jeep was in front of the radiator and AC condenser

Almost none of the Jeeps that have come into the shop till JL/JTs have had separate coolers in front of the radiators......they are in the radiator.

Like most production vehicles over the years....unless they had some kind of "HD towing package" that's all they usually have is the water/oil exchanger in the cold side tank of the radiator.

 

[CrazyCooter]

My Mishimoto has been on my JK since 2016 and has not leaked yet. Coolant temps in the summer are 20+ degrees cooler than with the factory radiator.

I'd be all over a solution like that, but its hard to trust the quality of stuff these days.

Cold Case offers one for us, but b the reviews look bad too?

 

[steelponycowboy]

Almost none of the Jeeps that have come into the shop till JL/JTs have had separate coolers in front of the radiators......they are in the radiator.

Like most production vehicles over the years....unless they had some kind of "HD towing package" that's all they usually have is the water/oil exchanger in the cold side tank of the radiator.

they were aftermarket HD trans coolers.

I'm wondering if something is mounted to the frame rails, it can't get much air flow to cool the liqued

 

[CrazyCooter]

they were aftermarket HD trans coolers.

I'm wondering if something is mounted to the frame rails, it can't get much air flow to cool the liqued

No room or it would have been suggested. I think any cooler will have to go under the bed. Its just too tight under there.

 

[LOGS]

It could because it lowers the EGR temps. My son has an injection system on his Hell Cat motor with twin turbos. He says it makes a world of difference. It actually plumbs into the washer reservoir and uses the blue washer fluid that has alcohol in it.

It greatly reduces intake temps which greatly reduces temps all around. Good power boost, great for the engine(cleans it out, check out the tear downs on people who use it), and really brings temps down nice. Put it on a switch, plumb it up to the windshield fluid reservoir and use only when needed.

The oil cooler is external.....its bolted to oil oil filter housing and fed water to cool it.

I haven't found any radiators that have a good reputation for reliability. Mishimoto was horrible for the local diesel shop I was dealing with and the internet reviews look much the same. All of the aftermarket aluminum radiators for jeep have a horrible reputation for leaks within a years time........

This may be the ONLY route for those who want to keep factory warranty. Hopefully some company puts out a high quality efficient radiator(or separate coolers for each boost,water,and oil). I don't think I have ever been impressed with any factory radiator so I'm sure there is room for improvement which would greatly help out our platform but there just isn't money there. Not that many JTDs out there to justify the research costs and now with our economy cratering, that's just going to make it less incentive for a company to do it.

I'm curious, I haven't gotten into the core support on this yet, but if it's possible to route different charge pipes to run a more efficient front mount Inter cooler. Keeping that separate may lower temps all around at higher boost applications. May not have the room but tons of really good efficient inter coolers out there already to try with.

 

[@californiajeeping]

It greatly reduces intake temps which greatly reduces temps all around. Good power boost, great for the engine(cleans it out, check out the tear downs on people who use it), and really brings temps down nice. Put it on a switch, plumb it up to the windshield fluid reservoir and use only when needed.



This may be the ONLY route for those who want to keep factory warranty. Hopefully some company puts out a high quality efficient radiator(or separate coolers for each boost,water,and oil). I don't think I have ever been impressed with any factory radiator so I'm sure there is room for improvement which would greatly help out our platform but there just isn't money there. Not that many JTDs out there to justify the research costs and now with our economy cratering, that's just going to make it less incentive for a company to do it.

I'm curious, I haven't gotten into the core support on this yet, but if it's possible to route different charge pipes to run a more efficient front mount Inter cooler. Keeping that separate may lower temps all around at higher boost applications. May not have the room but tons of really good efficient inter coolers out there already to try with.

I doubt it’s the IAT’s causing this not that they would change your coolant and oil temps much. I get high oil temps with relatively low IAT under low boost.
I do see 350 MaT regularly which is super high. I wonder if it’s actually measured by a sensor or approximated.
Either way even with cool ambient temps 50-70 degrees I still see oil temps that are high.

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