IFS coming in 2029?

[ShadowsPapa]

Insiders have already said that the new Dakota is expected to share its frame. I think frame sharing (badge engineering) is to be expected.

I've heard the before - but to have two different frames and suspension systems for the same model just based on "trim" (which again, is really a goofy nomenclature as it's a whole lot more than "trim". trim is and SST vs. a non-SST, same car, literally different TRIM)

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[Jrgunn5150]

The Wrangler is the Wrangler and J70 has no IFS in any configuration, proposed, imagined, theoretical, hypothetical or otherwise.

Dakota is Dakota, won't be in Toledo, won't be sharing anything with Wrangler except powertrain bits and dealerships.

 

[BearFootSam]

So, Jeep/Stellantis is trying to figure out how to "catch up" with Ford, Toyota, and GMC, and floats an idea out via the media. Meh, I think it is just market research

There is no shortage of enthusiasts who state they chose a bronco over a gladiator due to IFS handling on the street or on open dirt roads at higher speeds. For the dollars, I would rather go with an F150 Raptor or Dodge TRX over a bronco for racing around the desert, but, that's me.

IFS could also improve sales for the customers that want the "real" Jeep look, and never ever expect to have the tires touch dirt.

And then there is a solid contingent of enthusiasts who chose the gladiator in whole or in part due to the SFA. I confounds me a bit the dreams of dessert running. I mean really, how many of us live local to some terrain where high speed driving of that sort is possible? I'd venture it's aspirational, "if when I might one day get the opportunity".

While the same might be said of SFA, I feel there are definately more locales where low speed crawly activities are possible. All around colorado for instance you have opportunities to drive the passes where a slow pace and control are the ticket. In those scenarios the fixed ground clearance of solid axles holds an advantage against the dynamic clearance of IFS. Think steps and ledges with nice pointy rocks.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

And then there is a solid contingent of enthusiasts who chose the gladiator in whole or in part due to the SFA. I confounds me a bit the dreams of dessert running. I mean really, how many of us live local to some terrain where high speed driving of that sort is possible? I'd venture it's aspirational, "if when I might one day get the opportunity".

While the same might be said of SFA, I feel there are definately more locales where low speed crawly activities are possible. All around colorado for instance you have opportunities to drive the passes where a slow pace and control are the ticket. In those scenarios the fixed ground clearance of solid axles holds an advantage against the dynamic clearance of IFS. Think steps and ledges with nice pointy rocks.

When you live here, you have no opportunity for either.
I asked again about trails around here and a guy at a show insisted there were - ok, where are they?
The conversation ended.

 

[Stan H]

You really think they'll double up on the different frames needed, run two lines and so on?
It will be 2 different platforms in many respects, not just a different front axle.
If it was one line people would need the equipment and training to install both axle and suspension types. The IFS would slow things down substantially unless it was a sub-assembly in the frame building.

Another unsubstantiated rumor . Rumors are rumors for a reason. And of A rumor becomes a reality especially in the case of IFS it wont be happening to the JT.
I would almost bet a 100.00 it won't.

 

[MT1]

There is no reason for any real difference on good roads, highways, interstates, or city streets.

And then there is a solid contingent of enthusiasts who chose the gladiator in whole or in part due to the SFA.

Agreed.

The discussion points are no different today than years ago when IFS front came around for full size trucks; 88 or 89, somewhere around then. Solid is stronger, independent is softer ride, some feel better control. SFA was one of the reasons why I chose a JT instead of other manufacturers and models.

 

[Chasm]

That says "continue", so it might just be an article from an idiot.

 

[Sweetums]

There is no reason for any real difference on good roads, highways, interstates, or city streets.
The ZJ and WJ pretty much demonstrate that.
I'll never understand why some believe that IFS is superior on the highway or city streets.

I have yet to find such a place in the US, where is this mythical place?

And I can say with certainty that my old Xterra with a very mild lift would destroy any equivalent live axle Jeep in desert running. We had a Jeep tag along on a trip with a group of Xterras for a circumnavigation of the Great Salt Lake. We would blast across the desert, climb a mountain and have time to pose for photos while the Jeep was in the background still hauling across the open desert. They just couldn't keep control at the higher speeds the way the IFS could.

The Jeep would have eaten us all alive on Top of the World.

They are different tools for different jobs - but IFS is going to be superior and more planted for on-road handling and comfort.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I have yet to find such a place in the US, where is this mythical place?

And I can say with certainty that my old Xterra with a very mild life would destroy any equivalent live axle Jeep in desert running. We had a Jeep tag along on a trip with a group of Xterras for a circumnavigation of the Great Salt Lake. We would blast across the desert, climb a mountain and have time to pose for photos while the Jeep was in the background still so hauling across the open desert. They just couldn't keep control at the higher speeds the way the IFS could.

The Jeep would have eaten us all alive on Top of the World.

They are different tools for different jobs - but IFS is going to be superior and more planted for on-road handling and comfort.

I guess Iowa must have some of the best highways in the country. I've had all sorts of trucks, from IFS to solid to whatever Ford called theirs, to IFS again, and then these JTs. I've never once felt that my JT rode worse because it was not IFS, or handled any worse on our streets and highways. And frankly, on a good road there is no reason.
You have a camber advantage on super-tight turns at speed, but otherwise, you are running the same angles and so on, on the highways. Why would there be a difference?
Bumps and jounces, yes, because the tie rods pivot in the same plane as the lower control arms, reducing any toe in or toe out on a bump.

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

I have yet to find such a place in the US, where is this mythical place?

And I can say with certainty that my old Xterra with a very mild life would destroy any equivalent live axle Jeep in desert running. We had a Jeep tag along on a trip with a group of Xterras for a circumnavigation of the Great Salt Lake. We would blast across the desert, climb a mountain and have time to pose for photos while the Jeep was in the background still so hauling across the open desert. They just couldn't keep control at the higher speeds the way the IFS could.

The Jeep would have eaten us all alive on Top of the World.

They are different tools for different jobs - but IFS is going to be superior and more planted for on-road handling and comfort.

Maybe it was the driver.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Really? My Gladiator sticks to the road like a beast, for what it is at least. Probably due to my "low profile tires though, and when it does let go, it will probably be horrific.

I have a tendency to push my vehicles to their cornering limits. The other day I had a jacked up Suburban tailgating me, and as we went around a corner he lost it and slid into the ditch (across the oncoming lane, thankfully no one was there). Then I had some "sporty" little Kia riding my bumper on the interstate, but he gave up and lifted off the gas after a couple of curves on the 25mph ramp at 55. Granted, that was probably lack of confidence rather than lack of traction, but the Jeep continues to impress me with cornering.

Slow turning on the other hand, it kind of feels like a lumber wagon.

I suspect many people have that belief because of the tires they run. With the stock highway tires, I'd have taken my Overland against a lot of other trucks, against IFS.
I've never felt any problems, even with the sort of driving I tend to do (usually quick, in and out, as quick as I can get by with)

 

[Sweetums]

Yeah, solid axles are cheaper and perform just as well as independent suspension, which is why every luxury and performance vehicle uses solid axles instead of wasting money on more complicated and useless independent suspension systems.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yeah, solid axles are cheaper and perform just as well as independent suspension, which is why every luxury and performance vehicle uses solid axles instead of wasting money on more complicated and useless independent suspension systems.

Why are we comparing luxury and sports cars to Jeeps?

 

[Sweetums]

Saying that solid axle performs as well on pavement as a solid axle is just factually wrong. If solid axles were as good then every passenger car would be using solid axles for the reduced cost.

Independent suspension has better on road characteristics and better steering configuration, it's not even close. Independent suspensions are so much more expensive and complex than solid axles, but literally every car company in the world has decided that the added cost and complexity it worth it for everything from performance and luxury vehicles down to the cheapest eco-crapbox.

The only places where solid axles excell are load carrying, simplicity, cost, and articulation. You are taking a big hit to on road manners to get those gains. The steering is more precise with rack and pinion, the cornering is more stable, the responsiveness is better the ride quality is better due to less unsrung weight and a bump only affecting one tire and not the one opposite. The tires also stay flat during bumps rather than ride along the inside edge. The list goes on, but actual engineers who do this for a living have already done the math and chassis testing with more than "yeah, it feels the same to my ass".

 

[Supazuk]

That would make them totally different vehicles. Suspension types can't be an option, or vary.
There's too much difference to offer one trim with IFS and another in the SAME MODEL in solid axle.
your crash testing, fuel ratings and a lot more will differ, including the frame itself. You'd have to build one frame for one type, and another for the other type.
Very impractical.
Why would Mojave be one and Rubicon the other?

GM did it for years with the square body same frame, 2WD IFS, 4WD solid axle
as super duty the same

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