Leaking axle seal?

[loud0g40oz]

I just picked mine up for the leaky axle seal I have had since October. I had been driving it until late march when the gear whine became too much. Back then they had ordered a right axle shaft, which took 5 months to come in. They pulled it apart to fix and found shavings everywhere, which necessitated a complete rear axle rebuild. Once they saw that they wouldn’t give the truck back until it was fixed. Another 3 weeks to get the parts in and finally done last week. The truck was down for 26 days. Just got it back and so far so good. We’ll see how it does.

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[ShadowsPapa]

For some fairly old tech, solid axle seals, this whole issue is very strange and complicated. Incuding why the old fix works for some (knock on wood, mine is still bone try after 5k miles) and not others. Why it seems to be prevalent mostly on 2021s but they need to engineer a new solution, rather than revert back to what worked in 2020 or what is seemingly working now in 2022.

Hopefully once the new fix is released, Jeep will see fit to share what went wrong. Until then I will continue checking mine every month or so since I don’t have complete confidence it won’t reoccur like it has for many others who got the same fix I did.

That's what is baffling me!
IF, and I don't know this for a fact, but it "looks like a pattern" - IF the 2020s didn't leak, why do they have to go back to engineering?
OR, did they find other problems or flaws in the 2020 design, they tried to fix that and broke the right seal area and now have to start over?
It's just so baffling for a simple seal setup.


I mean, really, how hard can it be?

 

[Maximus Gladius]

LOL - I see your "logic" but that's not how these work.
Seals seal even if they are sitting funny under oil or lube.
They could be up to half-way under oil, or even fully have the backside covered in oil and it won't matter. They can also typically hold back at least 7 pounds of pressure. In fact, a little pressure holds them tighter against the shaft.

But think of a crankshaft oil seal, or the seal on the vertical shaft engine sitting on a rotary lawn mower - all of that oil is above the seal.
There are plenty of applications where seals like this work partially or fully in oil, submerged, etc.

There's also some out there that are already running a bit low.........
And then you have some roads that have little crown.

Yes, I totally agree with your explanation but the right “leaky” seal can’t handle any oil or its not able to stop the flow so “lower” the oil level bits at a time to see if it stops without doing damage to the diff gears. If the physics prove right that because of the angle the truck sits at would have the left axel “drier” than the right side, then drop the level so the right becomes drier. I would try this if my truck was leaking and if I could even drive the thing but maybe dropping the fluid level would stop the leak until the fix arrives.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yes, I totally agree with your explanation but the right “leaky” seal can’t handle any oil or its not able to stop the flow so “lower” the oil level bits at a time to see if it stops without doing damage to the diff gears. If the physics prove right that because of the angle the truck sits at would have the left axel “drier” than the right side, then drop the level so the right becomes drier. I would try this if my truck was leaking and if I could even drive the thing but maybe dropping the fluid level would stop the leak until the fix arrives.

My take - drop the level so that there's no fluid against the seal to leak - will the bearing get adequate lube?

Paved roads usually aren't more than 1.5 to 2% cross-slope. Not enough to fill that axle tube.

Since seals should work regardless of angle or lube contacting the rear, it's not a problem of too much lube - it's a faulty seal or housing. Of course if you drop the lube level, it's less likely to leak, but you will always have lube going out that direction because of the way the housing is shaped to ensure there's lube at those bearings. Lower it too much and you fry them.

 

[ecidiego]

5 months for a part is unacceptable and it's Jeeps fault. How? They can cancel dealer orders and focus on warranty first. They literally couldn't care less about the customer.

They are building these. They have parts. Jeep is ignoring the warranty/service pipeline on purpose. The fact that I can order a new one and have it in 2 months but some guy can't get his truck fixed for 5 months is BULLSHIT. @JeepCares

 

[ShadowsPapa]

This has been hashed out before, at least twice. Talk to people who supply auto makers. It can't be done as you'd think. It just doesn't work that way, nor can it. There are too many reasons to go into here.
They can't cancel orders and builds and handle warranty needs.
Don't holler to jeepcares - that can't do anything and will tell you the same thing I am - they can't pull parts out of production for warranty or other repairs.
Even back in the 70s and 80s it didn't work that way and it's even more complex now.

Another way to look at it - so you are more important than the guy who has put in an order for his business truck? Your needs trump all others?
And what about the logistics of packaging and shipping? These parts don't come to the factory ready to ship to a dealer for use as a repair part. Then there's all of the adjustments for production use.
It's different orders and ordering systems.............different supply chains, and it gets a lot more complex from there.
I've even posted how the parts for replacement are different than those for production.

Others who actually supply parts to FCA, or even others, have already spoken on this and why it can't happen.

 

[ecidiego]

Your needs trump all others?

A guy waiting 5 months? Yes. Unless someone has been waiting longer. Imagine paying a payment on a truck you can't drive for 5 months. Most dealers won't give loaners, either.

Sounds like Jeeps warranty is toilet paper. The excuses are nonsense.

'Different supply chains, COVID bro. '

Funny how only warranty repair parts are affected but Jeep can build these things all day long. What a coincidence! Global supply chain issues don't touch new builds!

This is Jeep's fault. They're telling suppliers what to prioritize. No one should be waiting 5 months for a warranty repair, period.

 

[Thomaas]

5 months for a part is unacceptable and it's Jeeps fault. How? They can cancel dealer orders and focus on warranty first. They literally couldn't care less about the customer.

They are building these. They have parts. Jeep is ignoring the warranty/service pipeline on purpose. The fact that I can order a new one and have it in 2 months but some guy can't get his truck fixed for 5 months is BULLSHIT. @JeepCares

Agree...keep getting these calls about engineering is working on it, Jeep put a hold on parts, etc. etc. My '51 Willys truck doesn't have a seal leak and I've driven it 40k miles...the PO put on the 1st 50k. Either bad machining on the axle boss or the seals and bearings are out of tolerance. I assume they use SK seals. There is no reason for this crap. Supply chain issues? That excuse is getting old. Hey...charter a FEDEX cargo jet, land near the factory(s) load the thing up with parts and drop ship to the dealership s that have a customer "waiting list".

 

[staying_tuned]

Query for the folks affected who are familiar with the lemon law. My understanding is 3 attempts at a fix and it’s a clean case. If that’s true, what do I need to do other than ensure proper acknowledgment of the leak on my visit next week? My local dealership has been great, I don’t get the sense that they’d intentionally try to abstract the issue away undocumented but we will be moving soon and despite loving my truck, we simply can’t deal with 3x rounds not it burning up while crossing the country back and forth while we nail bucket list items. Kids, work, active lifestyle etc.

What does that look like too when, in a few cases such as mine, they literally can’t order the part? Is there some cap, say 6 months or something?

Thanks in advance for any insight!

 

[Mojave2021]

Query for the folks affected who are familiar with the lemon law. My understanding is 3 attempts at a fix and it’s a clean case. If that’s true, what do I need to do other than ensure proper acknowledgment of the leak on my visit next week? My local dealership has been great, I don’t get the sense that they’d intentionally try to abstract the issue away undocumented but we will be moving soon and despite loving my truck, we simply can’t deal with 3x rounds not it burning up while crossing the country back and forth while we nail bucket list items. Kids, work, active lifestyle etc.

What does that look like too when, in a few cases such as mine, they literally can’t order the part? Is there some cap, say 6 months or something?

Thanks in advance for any insight!

Given the resale prices right now I think you’re better off selling or trading in.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Query for the folks affected who are familiar with the lemon law. My understanding is 3 attempts at a fix and it’s a clean case. If that’s true, what do I need to do other than ensure proper acknowledgment of the leak on my visit next week? My local dealership has been great, I don’t get the sense that they’d intentionally try to abstract the issue away undocumented but we will be moving soon and despite loving my truck, we simply can’t deal with 3x rounds not it burning up while crossing the country back and forth while we nail bucket list items. Kids, work, active lifestyle etc.

What does that look like too when, in a few cases such as mine, they literally can’t order the part? Is there some cap, say 6 months or something?

Thanks in advance for any insight!

Look up the lemon law for your state. It varies since it's not a national thing. The number of visits, the time spent in the shop, numbers of days, etc. may vary.
For your state, it may not be 3 - best check it out.


In Pennsylvania, a vehicle (including cars and passenger trucks) may qualify as a lemon if a defect or condition that substantially impairs the use, value, or safety of the vehicle is reported to a dealer within the first 12 months or 12,000 miles, whichever comes first, and the vehicle requires more than three repair attempts to repair the defect or condition. The Lemon Law is also triggered if the vehicle is out of service for thirty days or more for any number of defects or conditions. Only the first report of a defect or condition must be reported within the first 12 months or 12,000 miles. The subsequent repair attempts or days out of service may occur after the first year.

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The law covers problems that occur during the first 12 months or 12,000 miles of ownership. The problem must substantially impair the value, use or safety of the vehicle. Each time you take your vehicle to the dealer for service or repair, the dealer must provide you with a copy of the repair invoice. The dealer must also notify the manufacturer that your vehicle has been brought in a second time for the same problem. As long as the first problem occurs during the first 12 months or 12,000 miles of ownership, you are covered for any subsequent problems occurring after that point.

The law allows the manufacturer three repair attempts for the same problem. If the repairs are unsuccessful and the problem substantially impairs the value, use or safety of the vehicle, you may demand a refund or replacement vehicle. Also, if your car is at the dealership for any repairs for a cumulative total of thirty days during the first 12 months or 12,000 miles, you may demand a refund or replacement.

The manufacturer is allowed to receive a reasonable offset for your use of the vehicle that you are having problems with. That refund offset can total no more than 10% of the purchase price of the vehicle or $.10 for each mile driven before the first reported repair. If the manufacturer cannot replace your particular model or year, you must be given a comparable vehicle of equal value.

 

[Maximus Gladius]

My take - drop the level so that there's no fluid against the seal to leak - will the bearing get adequate lube?

Paved roads usually aren't more than 1.5 to 2% cross-slope. Not enough to fill that axle tube.

Since seals should work regardless of angle or lube contacting the rear, it's not a problem of too much lube - it's a faulty seal or housing. Of course if you drop the lube level, it's less likely to leak, but you will always have lube going out that direction because of the way the housing is shaped to ensure there's lube at those bearings. Lower it too much and you fry them.

Ya, bad idea. Back to the white board. Mine is still good! …do I have to drive it to make it leak?

 

[Hootbro]

5 months for a part is unacceptable and it's Jeeps fault.

You are not alone.

 

[onebad427]

New guy here, just bought my 2022 less than 2 weeks ago. Really didn't want this to be my first post,...but add me to the list of leaking axle seals.. About to stop by the dealership.

 

[Hootbro]

New guy here, just bought my 2022 less than 2 weeks ago. Really didn't want this to be my first post,...but add me to the list of leaking axle seals.. About to stop by the dealership.

That sucks. What is the mileage?

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