Oil - going from 0w20 to 0w40

[jac04]

It's still just putting sawdust in that gearbox ...

I heard GM was changing their recommendation from sawdust to oatmeal.

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[harryator]

I just had the intake cam (cylinder 6 side), rockers, and lifters replaced on a 2022 JT with 24500 miles on it. Oil and filter changes every 5k to 6k with mopar filter & penzoil 0w20 full syn. Took about two months to source parts at the dealership (FCA case opened as well to speed it up).

Coming from vehicles with +100k miles with not a single wrench touching their engines, it sounded insane to require engine work at such low miles.

On one hand, it gives comfort learning that the issue seems limited to one intake cam (based on many posts that I've seen so far). On another hand, there's uncertainly if this will turn into a maintenance item every 25k miles.

At this point the idea of parting out with the truck is being entertained, despite how much i really like this gladiator. oh well.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The 2012 3.6 was not the same 3.6 as used in current Jeeps, it was the Classic Pentastar (no Variable Valve Lift). It was designed with 5w30 oil specified, and then switched to 5w20 around the '12 or '13 model year. The Pentastar Upgrade engine has always had 0w20 oil specified, it has many differences from the Classic Pentastar. The switch in the Classic Pentastar to 5w20 oil was for CAFE standards, but the PUG was designed from the start for 0w20.

I wish it was possible to make clear to the Jeep community that the 3.6 in our Jeeps, and 2018+ Wranglers, isn't the same engine. It's a 3.6, looks the same, some parts interchange, but it's a very different design in so many ways.
In 2015 for the 2016 model year (only in certain models*) a second 3.6 came out, based on the first but with pages worth of changes, some very minor (moving oil temp sending unit) to major (VVL, oil pump, crank journal sizes, different bearings).
When you talk wrangler it gets confusing because Wrangler kept the old generation up through the end of the JK series, Wrangler didn't get this engine until 2018 and the JL.
So oils, parts (phasers, intake cams, followers and much more) are very very different.

Also - the bit about oils - its a committee thing - the engine was made for 0w20, but the OIL was made for the engine. API consists of engineers who design the engines and other parts, as well as oil chemists and so on. So it's a matched thing - when they specify xxxx oil, it's because that oil was made to operate under those conditions, and the engine was made to operate using that oil. They worked together. FCA didn't make an engine and then say - gee, now we need to see what oil will work in this. It was a day-one thing, with the oil chemists involved - API was involved.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I heard GM was changing their recommendation from sawdust to oatmeal.

Great, now we'll have mice fighting to get into the engines! That's going to be a sticky mess changing that out.

I guess our neighbor will have to be setting mouse traps around his truck.

 

[Stan H]

The 2012 3.6 was not the same 3.6 as used in current Jeeps, it was the Classic Pentastar (no Variable Valve Lift). It was designed with 5w30 oil specified, and then switched to 5w20 around the '12 or '13 model year. The Pentastar Upgrade engine has always had 0w20 oil specified, it has many differences from the Classic Pentastar. The switch in the Classic Pentastar to 5w20 oil was for CAFE standards, but the PUG was designed from the start for 0w20.

Man that right there is the definitive statement , moderator mark this for all to see and close the thread
Very well said

 

[Stan H]

I heard GM was changing their recommendation from sawdust to oatmeal.

A healthy choice hopefully with butter and brown sugar

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Man that right there is the definitive statement , moderator mark this for all to see and close the thread
Very well said

We've both been saying this in almost every oil thread, over and over, but it never takes. A Youtube comes along and "but...but...but...but.... GM, or what about this!" and facts be damned.

Ok, I've lost track, but here's just one of the snippets (of the pages of changes made to the PUG 3.6 vs. the first generation)

(and again, API works with manufacturers to make oil for their engines, manufacturers don't build an engine and then go to Walmart and shop for something that might work. They are engineered to work together)

 

[Mike5]

I just had the intake cam (cylinder 6 side), rockers, and lifters replaced on a 2022 JT with 24500 miles on it. Oil and filter changes every 5k to 6k with mopar filter & penzoil 0w20 full syn. Took about two months to source parts at the dealership (FCA case opened as well to speed it up).

Coming from vehicles with +100k miles with not a single wrench touching their engines, it sounded insane to require engine work at such low miles.

On one hand, it gives comfort learning that the issue seems limited to one intake cam (based on many posts that I've seen so far). On another hand, there's uncertainly if this will turn into a maintenance item every 25k miles.

At this point the idea of parting out with the truck is being entertained, despite how much i really like this gladiator. oh well.

My first Jeep (2023) and if it isn’t a good one, I intend to trade it off for something other than a Jeep product. That said, the majority run a long time without issues so we shall see.

 

[JTGuy]

If I had done zero mods to my JT I would probably be looking to dump it soon. I really like the JT but this cam thing is going to be the last straw. If it ever happens to me.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

My first Jeep (2023) and if it isn’t a good one, I intend to trade it off for something other than a Jeep product. That said, the majority run a long time without issues so we shall see.

So based on the first and only Jeep?
I wonder how many guys swear off women if the first is a lemon?

 

[Minty JL]

Very interesting reading the comments to this very scandalous thread. Keep it coming

 

[agoldxj]

The newest revision of this recall is to use a picoscope near a provision near the knock sensor, to what I presume to listen for noises from bad main bearings. If it passes this test we are to switch that VIN to 0w40 change the cap and update the owners manual. If it fails, we are to order a “new engine”. No eta total shit show. Just had a low mileage 23 suburban towed in today, catastrophic failure. Replace engine, refill with 0w20. I don’t believe GM has a clue on what to do, this is going to be a bad one.

 

[agoldxj]

To be accurate 4th revision and counting.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Just had a low mileage 23 suburban towed in today, catastrophic failure. Replace engine, refill with 0w20. I don’t believe GM has a clue on what to do, this is going to be a bad one.

What they want to do and what they know the fix is are two different things. The fix is to rebuild or replace all affected engines. What they want to do is spread it out over a lot of time, buy time, push some people out a ways so the failure happens next fall, not this summer.
it's a time-buyer.
They know the fix - replace all of the problematic engines.
I'd think with technology these days, they know what engine numbers went where and what the crankshaft journal condition was.
A crank kit would likely fix each one - but that ain't gonna happen at a dealership/warranty level. Reman short-block will be the answer. But how to get that many thousands in short order? You don't - so you kick the can down the road.

 

[agoldxj]

GM is the guy behind the curtain, who when someone catches a glim

Exactly. That's what I said in another one of these threads.
Leave the ones before and after the affected dates alone (proving it wasn't an oil issue) and once the engine is replaced, go back to the book and put the prior cap back on.
Again proving it was simply a bandaid on an artery, not a fix - otherwise they'd make it a change and keep it that way.

I do believe the 0w40 is a bandaid for sure.

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