Winter Driving - Fishtailing

[GA D90]

I’ve commented before on this, but I still stand on that the JT has been the best snow handling vehicle I’ve owned. The last four NH winter’s on Falken MT’s , two sand tubes in the bed.

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[Sandman 4x4]

Lovr my JT Sport S - but man, I have been disappointed in the snow performance.​

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I live in WI (grew up driving here) and have driven everything from a small sedan to a Jeep Grand Cherokee, to now my JT.​

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I know I have a truck - and they drive different than a AWD vehicle of an SUV, but man I am not impressed with the constant fish tailing around town for now it’s third winter.​

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I don’t drive fast. Really… I don’t​

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I have p285/70/17 Falken AT3W tires. 36 psi​

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I have x2 70lbs tube sand bags in the bed over the axles.​

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I’ll shift it into 4hi sometimes to go on snow covered roads, but a lot of my issues are in 2hi and with turns.​

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I went to pickup my son from daycare today with my wife, and turning onto a road from a stop - I slipped multiple times and also saw the traction control light flash on.​

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Im not really sure what to do or if this is just how it is. My pregnant wife made a comment “isn’t this thing supposed to be good in snow” and I couldn’t really even answer her.​

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Any ideas or tips?​

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First of all AT tires are not exactly great snow tires. Throw a set of 245/75-17 Blizzak snow tires on a second set of wheels will make all the difference for driving in snow. Plus help both sets last longer and be safer. Does your Sport S have the locking rear differential? Because it sounds like it. That help with standing still traction to get going, but in a turn if you are on the gas pedal, the differential will lock both rear tires together and cause oversteer. But an open differential will just send power to the wheel with less traction, that’s the inside tire that should just spin but not cause oversteer. Good luck!

 

[Dave D]

Took a lot of searching but I was able to find a Rubicon with 4H Auto. That was a mandatory option coming from my previous Quadra-Drive WJ.

Thats a Unicorn.
I couldnt find one.

 

[montechie]

Already said, add more weight, probably double your sand bags. Specifically in my trucks I've usually have had a topper + ~160lbs of sand and gear over the axles in the winter. So 360-400 lbs almost in my F150s/Taco/JT. Makes a big difference. Even my old Wrangler gets the back seat put back in + 60lbs bag of sand and chains for winter.

I have a Rubi with 4auto which is great, but even in 2H with that big shiny topper + gear I don't really fishtail in snow unless I'm trying to. Even with the AT3w.

I usually get dedicated winter tires in general on any vehicle we own, but all our trucks definitely up'd the need for them with the light backend, even the ones I've had with limited slip. One other thing, you're going to feel your tail more in a truck vs a shorter vehicle, my F150 was way more composed than my TJ when the back end cut loose, but much worse feeling with that big tail wagging.

 

[Minty JL]

1) better throttle modulation
2) tires actually rated for snow
3) throw some weight in the bed where the ass end is light like ALL pick up trucks

 

[montechie]

Thats a Unicorn.
I couldnt find one.

Even in Montana where it's ideal for our conditions I had to order one to get a JTR w/4auto. Dealers don't bother checking the box even here, when it was a one off add-on. Now any Rubicon X package has it for all the $$$$.

 

[Redfour5]

If it's slippery put in 4H.

Easy peasy.

I live in MT. One they don't use salt. And they do not plow down to pavement and use a dirtlike substance on the slick areas for SOME traction. There is usually a couple of inches of snow on the roads other than interstates/limited acess. But once it is on there without snow for awhile and on the shoulder seasons like November December, you get a mile of clear road and then a mile of snow/ice covered and corners are always iffy either clear or some kind of mix.

After a "regular" part time 4WD without LSD then a 2015 with LSD and then a 2021 with auto 4WD. NOW, full time auto or Selec Drive on Gladiators was a required option. It makes such a big difference and no binding of the 4WD. I had an example yesterday at the mailboxes. We are mostly clear now on the main roads so I leave it in 2WD. At the mailboxes took off sliding sideways fishtailing slid it into auto 4WD and instant traction adjusting to the road.

I still remember having to remember with the "basic" part time 4WD having to engage and disengage all the time where I live. Then with the LSD I was pretty good to go but in cetain situations it was sketchy whereas, the auto 4WD is fantastic... AND much better than most AWD cars. AND, if you gotta go AWD for another car, just cut to the chase and go Subaru. Their 4WD is better than anyone else's particularly pricewise.

 

[Redfour5]

Even in Montana where it's ideal for our conditions I had to order one to get a JTR w/4auto. Dealers don't bother checking the box even here, when it was a one off add-on. Now any Rubicon X package has it for all the $$$$.

I am in total agreement on the value of the auto 4WD in Montana. It was a requirement of mine also and hard to find and like you I noticed few dealers ever checked the box for it. Heck you are lucky if they check the LSD box which ought to be a minimum requirement up here.

But I stumbled onto a dealer whose sales manager was a "selec trac" (Rock Trac for Rubicons) full time AWD advocate in Kennewick WA. He said he checked it on all of them he could as he KNEW how valuable and cheap it was at 695.00. AND they had 30% off MSRP in December 2023. So, I scored and that was on a Freedom Edition. I love it. 61K MSRP for 43 and change out the door and 500 miles home. The trip was worth it.

It is so weird that you can ONLY get it now on the X versions of the Mojave and Rubicons at $$$$$$. When Gladiators first came out they originally had it as standard on S models. I saw this on a jeep video pre market. I am not sure if they actually did it, but to go from touting it to essentially restricting it is stupid. But then Taveres was in charge. Maybe it will come back as an option. It is sure worth it at 695 when the stupid bluetooth speaker behind the back seat is 595...

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

First of all AT tires are not exactly great snow tires. Throw a set of 245/75-17 Blizzak snow tires on a second set of wheels will make all the difference for driving in snow. Plus help both sets last longer and be safer. Does your Sport S have the locking rear differential? Because it sounds like it. That help with standing still traction to get going, but in a turn if you are on the gas pedal, the differential will lock both rear tires together and cause oversteer. But an open differential will just send power to the wheel with less traction, that’s the inside tire that should just spin but not cause oversteer. Good luck!

Does anybody make an auto locker for the Advantek D44? I think all the offerings are selectable.

OP probably has a limited slip.

 

[LouisvEarlleJT]

Does anybody make an auto locker for the Advantek D44? I think all the offerings are selectable.

OP probably has a limited slip.

Yeah I'd say it's an LSD, but the terminology goes back & forth. Jeep brands it as LSD, Chevy brands it as a locker (or did in the 80's-90's at least) but the results are the same.

I think the easiest designation would be for brands to label what is in the rubi and mojave's as "selectable" lockers vs just lockers.

 

[Volt0]

I work in Hazelwood but drive an hour to get there from Illinois. I have been patiently waitiong for an appreciable amount of snow to liven up my commute. Six, 60# tube sand bags do ok for me. Do you have any favorite trails or just hit the roads?

I have some nearby roads ( w/in 30min drive ) that have some good water crossings; beyond that, I like to try to find roads where I’m the first to cut trail, and/or to see if there are any folks that might need an easy rescue.

for anything technical, I usually have to drive 3+ hours.

 

[Sigz]

Basically what I'm learning is (and pretty much what I have/do):

1. Have extra weight in the back.

1.a I also have a topper for extra weight

2. I have snow rated A/T tires

3. Drive slow, watch the throttle.

 

[DJPodratz]

I live in MT. One they don't use salt. And they do not plow down to pavement and use a dirtlike substance on the slick areas for SOME traction. There is usually a couple of inches of snow on the roads other than interstates/limited acess. But once it is on there without snow for awhile and on the shoulder seasons like November December, you get a mile of clear road and then a mile of snow/ice covered and corners are always iffy either clear or some kind of mix.

After a "regular" part time 4WD without LSD then a 2015 with LSD and then a 2021 with auto 4WD. NOW, full time auto or Selec Drive on Gladiators was a required option. It makes such a big difference and no binding of the 4WD. I had an example yesterday at the mailboxes. We are mostly clear now on the main roads so I leave it in 2WD. At the mailboxes took off sliding sideways fishtailing slid it into auto 4WD and instant traction adjusting to the road.

I still remember having to remember with the "basic" part time 4WD having to engage and disengage all the time where I live. Then with the LSD I was pretty good to go but in cetain situations it was sketchy whereas, the auto 4WD is fantastic... AND much better than most AWD cars. AND, if you gotta go AWD for another car, just cut to the chase and go Subaru. Their 4WD is better than anyone else's particularly pricewise.

I feel your pain. We have a lot of curvy roads running through the forest. Miles of bare pavement, then a curve with evergreens on the south side shading the sun. Even in 4WD I have slipped and slid on icy roads.

Full time AWD is easier than 4WD. My wife has a Subaru and I love driving it in the winter. I actually prefer it as it has seat heater (my Glad doesn't).

My comment to OP may have been a bit snarky. It's winter and the JT is very light in the rear end, like every other 4WD pickup I have owned (Tacos and Frontiers).

Best advice, slow down!

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

Basically what I'm learning is (and pretty much what I have/do):

1. Have extra weight in the back.

1.a I also have a topper for extra weight

2. I have snow rated A/T tires

3. Drive slow, watch the throttle.

Do you have a limited slip? It sounds like you might.

An open diff will not fishtail as easily.

 

[DailyMoparGuy]

Do you have a limited slip? It sounds like you might.

An open diff will not fishtail as easily.

Agreed. I find that the LSD is easier to fishtail in turns/curves but also easier to correct in my experiences.

With the LSD, acceleration from a dig in a straight line has SO MUCH control in slippery conditions. Not sure what that’s about but I love it for merging onto the highway.

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