New JT Gladiator Steering Issue TSB 08-074-20 (for "Improved Steering Feel")

[JTBurns]

Dealer's mechanic talked to me today about some issues he's seen with the replacement Steering Boxes. I had mine done and it did improve the steering. Here's the story...


Yesterday I had Safelite replace my broken windshield (stone chip) with Mopar factory glass. And that's when the "fun" started.

The recalibration of my 2020 Jeep Gladiator was NOT successful. Well, they thought it was but I got a Check Engine light after I started it up. So they used 3-4 of their tablets to recalibrate my Gladiator with Adaptive Cruise Control. They finally got it to clear and on my drive home my IP lit up as it showed a Traction Control light and warning.

Back I went to Safelite this morning. They tried to recalibrate it and said they couldn't do it because my truck is lifted (3.5" Metal Cloak Gamechanger suspension lift and 37" tires). I told them to re-set it to factory settings because it worked fine when I brought it in. And they said, no can do Shamu. They said their updated software/tablets can't do it and I need to go to the dealer.

So off I went to the dealership. No can do. They cleared the codes and they were thrown again - a number of them including Traction Control, Radio and others per their mechanic. Told me he's not seen codes like this and I need to go back to Safelite to get them to clear the codes.

I'm stuck in No Man's Land. While I think Safelite has an issue they need to fix and I'm holding them responsible, I am glad I didn't go to the local windshield place as I don't have confidence they know as much as Safelite as they deal with this stuff many times every day on lots of vehicles.

I've told Safelite about this problem and that I need them to address it. But I am going back to the dealership on Tuesday for a different issue. The mechanic said he wants to look closely at my Jeep's new, replacement Steering Box because he's seen some issues with replacement Steering Boxes and he wants to make sure that's not an issue. When it's in there he'll spend more time with the codes and see if he can clear them but he's not confident (plus they told me they have this issue with all their other FCA/Stellantis vehicles with ACC, etc. and they said they don't have the machine/software - not clear what they don't have - to address this issue).

Well you'll have to let us know if the mechanic finds anything or if he'll even tell you what he's looking for.. for the most part it seems like when people have issues it's because bolts aren't tourqued correctly or something along those lines. I wonder if he's talking about a specific wear and tear afterwards or if other components are jeopardized. I hope he can at least shed some light on what he's talking about instead of just vagueries.

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[DaveL]

part of the tsb is refreshing after changing the steering gear. It would be easy to leave that out....

 

[Redbear]

I had the steering box replaced months ago. It made huge difference and really tightened up the steering for me. I was driving I-10 this week and noticed the steering drifting a bit and seemed to be getting worse through the trip. Jeep dealer can't get me in for a few weeks due to ownership change? (Another story, another time), so I had a look to see if anything obvious was amiss.

The photo is the steering box, the nut was loose. I hand tightened about 2 1/2 turns and torqued it down as best I could. Steering is back to being excellent again.

It's an easy to see nut, but it's a pain to get a wrench on it!

 

[seven30]

I had the steering box replaced months ago. It made huge difference and really tightened up the steering for me. I was driving I-10 this week and noticed the steering drifting a bit and seemed to be getting worse through the trip. Jeep dealer can't get me in for a few weeks due to ownership change? (Another story, another time), so I had a look to see if anything obvious was amiss.

The photo is the steering box, the nut was loose. I hand tightened about 2 1/2 turns and torqued it down as best I could. Steering is back to being excellent again.

It's an easy to see nut, but it's a pain to get a wrench on it!

That is somewhat frightening!! I believe the torque on that nut is really high like 200ft/lbs.

 

[Hootbro]

I had the steering box replaced months ago. It made huge difference and really tightened up the steering for me. I was driving I-10 this week and noticed the steering drifting a bit and seemed to be getting worse through the trip. Jeep dealer can't get me in for a few weeks due to ownership change? (Another story, another time), so I had a look to see if anything obvious was amiss.

The photo is the steering box, the nut was loose. I hand tightened about 2 1/2 turns and torqued it down as best I could. Steering is back to being excellent again.

It's an easy to see nut, but it's a pain to get a wrench on it!

New, that pitman arm nut is suppose to come with a thread locker agent in the threads. The problem is the steering TSB does not call out a new nut or tell the tech to put thread locker agent back on the nut before reinstallation.

Still though, I suspect if it had been properly torqued down to begin with, should not have backed off and thread locker agent is just adding margins to that.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

New, that pitman arm nut is suppose to come with a thread locker agent in the threads. The problem is the steering TSB does not call out a new nut or tell the tech to put thread locker agent back on the nut before reinstallation.

Still though, I suspect if it had been properly torqued down to begin with, should not have backed off and thread locker agent is just adding margins to that.

Exactly. The thread lock is just a safety margin. It replaces the "staking" that was done in the 80s and before where the nut was torqued and then a punch used to stake the thread at the very bottom edge of the nut. If the nut DID come lose for some weird reason, it wasn't going anywhere. The torque alone should be enough. Obviously that wasn't properly torqued and then lacking the "LocTite" type stuff, it was free to vibrate down the pitman shaft.
Double boo-boo on their part but indeed part of the blame is the TSM - or is it? That nut should be a stocking item and they mention in the TSM to follow instructions for replacing the parts.
They shouldn't have to reiterate with every TSB HOW to change a part, all they need to do is say "look in the library for the procedure for replacing xxx part".
Otherwise every bulletin on replacing a given part would have to repeat the how - they either know how or should look in their reference library - what we used to call TSM - technical service manual.
Even the TSBs from decades ago assumed the tech knew how to remove and replace a head or where to find the information on doing so. It wasn't repeated for every single bulletin.
Like a college professor I had told us - you get full credit for a correct answer - if you don't know and leave it blank or get it wrong, you get no credit. But if your answer is where to find the information, you get partial credit.
These guys didn't go to the same college and training that I did, I guess.

 

[seven30]

Hey if anyone is having steering issues please include your tire specs and whether or not its lifted.
.
My 2021 JTM steered ok with the stock Wildpeak MT tires but swapping to some Cooper AT3 transformed its pavement manners. The MTs did not track as well on pavement as one might expect. They do look great though.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Hey if anyone is having steering issues please include your tire specs and whether or not its lifted.
.
My 2021 JTM steered ok with the stock Wildpeak MT tires but swapping to some Cooper AT3 transformed its pavement manners. The MTs did not track as well on pavement as one might expect. They do look great though.

Tires can have an impact, I'd expect more impact from wheel swaps. Different offset and backset numbers can make a huge difference, and going taller tires does change scrub radius, etc. You totally change where the center of the tire and the SAI line intersect. Moving it higher or lower than the road surface changes how a vehicle steers and BRAKES.

 

[Benbean66]

I'll throw this out there and maybe those more knowledgeable than I can share their expertise. Would taking the factory rake out, or increasing the amount of rake affect the castor angle of the front axle in relationship to the road? In my brain, it wouldn't affect pinion angle, but possibly how the tires tracked on the road surface due to the castor angle changing. Thoughts?

 

[Mouse]

I'll throw this out there and maybe those more knowledgeable than I can share their expertise. Would taking the factory rake out, or increasing the amount of rake affect the castor angle of the front axle in relationship to the road? In my brain, it wouldn't affect pinion angle, but possibly how the tires tracked on the road surface due to the castor angle changing. Thoughts?

Yes, rake will affect caster. With any caster change, it will affect steering, mostly "return to center," but low caster numbers can also cause wander.

 

[MPMB]

I'll throw this out there and maybe those more knowledgeable than I can share their expertise. Would taking the factory rake out, or increasing the amount of rake affect the castor angle of the front axle in relationship to the road? In my brain, it wouldn't affect pinion angle, but possibly how the tires tracked on the road surface due to the castor angle changing. Thoughts?

Since caster is determined by the forward or rearward location of the ball joints in relation to each other, it's unlikely that caster will change. Pinion angle will.

 

[Benbean66]

Yes, rake will affect caster. With any caster change, it will affect steering, mostly "return to center," but low caster numbers can also cause wander.

I have my castor set at around 6 degrees, and my toe-in a little higher than stock due to the heavy Nitto RG's I have. My steering is still a tad "flighty" and trying to figure out what my next step should be. (3-3.5" Evo lift, TSB done, Synergy brace, tie rod end @ pitman arm replaced, Falcon 2.2 SS, Clayton control arms...). I'm starting to wonder if my "new" steering box is having the same issues that the last one had. Seems to be happening to a few on here.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Since caster is determined by the forward or rearward location of the ball joints in relation to each other, it's unlikely that caster will change. Pinion angle will.

Yes caster will change because that relationship will change. It's not just the ball joints, it's a LINE drawn between the two.
For example, if one was straight above the other, the caster would be zero because the line is vertical. If you turn that circle with the line in it, you change the angle of the line related to vertical.
So yes, anything that causes the axle tube to rotate RELATIVE to the GROUND - and it will since it's directly attached to the truck, will change caster - although VERY VERY slightly.

Pinion angle in relationship to the driveshaft will not change since you are "tipping" the whole truck.
Raise the rear of the truck 2 feet off the ground with a jack - you change caster but you do not change pinion angle as it's a relative to the truck angle.

I have the gauges, etc. and more than once have had to change pinion angle after leaf spring swaps, etc.

Caster is relative to the ground, pinion angle is relative to the truck's other parts.
Heck, these guys that used to put long shackles and air shocks under the backs of their Mustangs and Camaros changed caster. Same with these trucks since changing the angle the truck sits relative to the ground changes the position of the ball joints relative to each other.

I helped pay for my automotive college degree by doing brakes and alignments for a year.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yes, rake will affect caster. With any caster change, it will affect steering, mostly "return to center," but low caster numbers can also cause wander.

You can actually predict the caster change by using an electronic angle checker and put it on the truck, set it to 0, then change the rake of the truck. If you change the truck's pitch by 1 degree, you change the caster by 1 degree since it's relative to the ground and not to the truck.

 

[DobaMark]

My Gladiator is a Sport with the Bridgestone HT tires, 245/75/17. I swapped to JK wheels with 255/75/17 BF Goodrich KM2s. Steering was actually a little bit better with the Goodrich tires I swapped on.

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