Jeep ceo…. Wants zero emission freedom brand

[SargeDiesel]

Im skeptical just like most owners are. The 4xe’s pitiful 21miles on EV is just a slap in the face for what that thing costs.

BUT

I enjoy how markets shift and believe that since every brand is doing this we will see a good product a couple years from now. Competition is good for development.

i just hope to still be able to tow with the electric gladiator when it comes out l

At this point, I'm just hoping I can still buy diesel in a couple years... if not I will have a very expensive driveway ornament..lol.. not really !

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[WK2JT]

That all works out until you see your cost to insure the ev and your electric bill. Oh and by the way have fun installing a 60-90 amp circuit in yr garage if youbdont want to wait 12 hours to charge. Oh and by the way you cant park it in the garage and charge at same time for fear of a lithium fire. Oh and by the way imagine every person on your block for miles pulling the same current as they charge overnight while its summer time and everyone has their a/c on. Ever hear of brown outs? Electric cars are a meme. Where does everyone think all this electricity to fuel this is coming from? If you think renewable you are dead wrong. Oh and. By the way- Where is all the toxic lithium to be mined for the precious batteries? Who are the top producers of lithium and battery manufacturing? Ask these questions to yourself. All you pro EV people are well off for the most part. But you think people who make 20k a year and live in an apartment complex are going ev???

Oh snap… does this mean I shouldn’t be charging my phone, laptop, headphones, watch, etc in the house. Man, I’ve been leaving dangerously and didn’t know it. Queue the James Bond theme. ?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The American Clean Power Association ranked the state of Iowa first in clean power penetration with 57.6 percent of the state's energy coming from wind and solar.
No other state had more than half of its electricity come from renewable sources. Iowa isn't just a bit over 50%, it's not far from 60%.

 

[robinsonmac]

Leasing drops your payment, but if you buy an EV, you get a huge tax credit. Depending on make and model, you can get up to $7,500 back federally. Then many states provide more. EV purchases in CO got an additional $2,500 in 2021. That’s 10k off the purchase price.

That's not how it works. The price of the vehicle is not lowered in any way shape or fashion. The tax credit is "up" to $$ if you owe taxes at the end of the year. The only way you get $10K in tax credits from your EV purchase is if you owe $10K in taxes.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

That's not how it works. The price of the vehicle is not lowered in any way shape or fashion. The tax credit is "up" to $$ if you owe taxes at the end of the year. The only way you get $10K in tax credits from your EV purchase is if you owe $10K in taxes.

Depends on if it's a refundable credit or not.

A refundable tax credit can be used to generate a federal tax refund larger than the amount of tax paid throughout the year. In other words, a refundable tax credit creates the possibility of a negative federal tax liability.

One site says -
The Qualified Plug-in Electric Drive Motor Vehicle Credit is a non refundable credit. So your example fits the EV credit - you don't get it all unless you owe that much in taxes or more.

On the other hand, another site explaining says the opposite!!

You Don’t Get the Tax Credit Right Away
First, the bad news: You have to front the money to the government as part of your purchase deal.

The tax credit is just that — a tax credit. Manufacturers often advertise it as a discount on the car’s price, but it isn’t. Instead, it’s a government policy that allows you to claim up to $7,500 in credit against the federal income taxes you owe in the year in which you buy the car. In other words, it reduces your tax liability. If you’re eligible for a refund, you’ll get whatever the amount of your credit on top of that.

Buyers must still pay the price they negotiate for the car (whether paying it in cash or folding it into the loan amount). They can then claim the credit the next time they file their taxes. That credit lowers your tax liability. If your tax bill is lower than the credit, you’ll receive the balance as a refund. However, you can’t roll that credit or any remaining balance into the next tax year.


INTUIT says -
A tax credit is a dollar-for-dollar reduction of the income tax you owe. For example, if you owe $1,000 in federal taxes but are eligible for a $1,000 tax credit, your net liability drops to zero. ... Therefore, if your total tax is $400 and claim a $1,000 earned income credit, you will receive a $600 refund.

With a non-refundable tax credit, on the other hand, you won’t end up with a refund if your tax liability falls below zero.
So if you have a $2,500 non-refundable credit (like the Adoption Tax Credit) but you only owe $1,000, the extra $1,500 won’t be accessible to you. Some tax credits are partially refundable, meaning that part of the credit can be added to your tax refund.

So we have two automotive sites saying the opposite - one says you can get more back than you owe, the other says not.

 

[WILDHOBO]

That's not how it works. The price of the vehicle is not lowered in any way shape or fashion. The tax credit is "up" to $$ if you owe taxes at the end of the year. The only way you get $10K in tax credits from your EV purchase is if you owe $10K in taxes.

Patently incorrect. Look it up.

 

[GEETCH]

I like what electric has the potential to do, more power instant torque etc, however currently it will limit my driving range, or where I decide to go, I can’t just took out in the back country as much as I could with a gasser and some jerry cans, or cross country trips within the time frame I might need to. Example moving states for work etc, if I can only go 300 miles on a charge and need 8 to 10 hrs for a charge it won’t work in some instances.

cost of hotels for extended tripsjust to wait for charging etc.

Cost of ev cars currently are to pricey for me plus maint cost.


Tesla Model 3 Battery Replacement Cost

Current Automotive posted the 2020 receipt of one customer’s replacement of a remanufactured 75kWh battery in a Tesla Model 3:

• Battery: $13,500
• Labor $2,299.27
• Total: $15,799.27
• 
  
  
• Tesla Model S Battery Replacement Cost
  
  • In April 2021, FindMyElectric reported that there were a few cases where the price of the batteries cost $12,000 to $15,000.
  • A used 2014 Tesla Model S owner reportedthat a full battery pack replacement would have cost $20,000, including labor, in Dec 2020.
  • On Tesla motors club, there are two reports of owners of (2012 and 2013) Model S’s being quoted in 2021 $22k for full battery replacements out of warranty.
    
    
  • So for most it is not economically viable, until production costs, maintenance costs, charging times, distance and most importantly charging station availability is addressed it won’t work for the bulk of Americans

 

[robinsonmac]

Patently incorrect. Look it up.

You're reply is patently false. The $7500 tax credit is what is says a tax credit. You don't get a check in the mail & you don't get $7500 off the price of your car. If you don't owe taxes you don't get a $7500 refund. If your federal tax liability is $ 1500 you get a $1500 tax credit. Some states offer tax refunds on your state taxes. I just went through this buying my wife's electric car. The only way in Colorado for example, to get $10K off the price of the car is to lease it, not buy it. Or have a $7,500 federal liability plus the state credit.

 

[WILDHOBO]

You're reply is patently false. The $7500 tax credit is what is says a tax credit. You don't get a check in the mail & you don't get $7500 off the price of your car. If you don't owe taxes you don't get a $7500 refund. If your federal tax liability is $ 1500 you get a $1500 tax credit. Some states offer tax refunds on your state taxes. I just went through this buying my wife's electric car. The only way in Colorado for example, to get $10K off the price of the car is to lease it, not buy it.

A tax credit is a simple math problem. We’ve now purchased 5 EVs. We received $7,500 for the first three, each, 10,000 for the 4th, and will receive just under 8k for the 5th. You’ve been misinformed. Check with a better CPA. If you owe zero when you file your return, you receive a 7,500 return. It’s just true. I’m sorry someone told you incorrectly.

 

[robinsonmac]

A tax credit is a simple math problem. We’ve now purchased 5 EVs. We received $7,500 for the first three, each, 10,000 for the 4th, and will receive just under 8k for the 5th. You’ve been misinformed. Check with a better CPA. If you owe zero when you file your return, you receive a 7,500 return. It’s just true. I’m sorry someone told you incorrectly.

Sorry, that is just plain B.S......

 

[WILDHOBO]

Sorry, that is just plain B.S......

And yet, it’s not. What motivation would I have to lie about this? You should amend your tax return. You’d still likely get anything you haven’t already.

 

[TroutFishingInAmerica]

Remember the good old days 65 million years ago when a astroid hit earth and killed 75% of all life?
Problem solved.

 

[robinsonmac]

Something else I've not heard anyone mention is the price of oil increase that will happen as demand falls with the decrease In fuel demand. Currently fuel consumption subsidizes the cost for all petroleum based products. A dramatic decrease in fuel consumption will lead to a dramatic increase in prices of petroleum based products like..... Plastic. How much plastic is in a vehicle? Your home? How about Synthetic fabrics, tires, containers, water bottles, foam, furniture, appliances, light bulbs, tires, etc. All petroleum based products. Gasoline, diesel & other fuel make up more than 65% of petroleum use. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum_product
OPEC & the big oil companies will cut production to eliminate over capacity & raise oil prices. There's a chance the Paris climate agreement & climate change policies will force us to find a green alternative to petrochemicals. But you can bet you ass big oil will throw everything they have to keep them being used & create shortages to raise the price of oil.

 

[AP Double]

Very simply this.....until technology makes a HUGE leap forward, this idea of all electric will be for a small %. Call it nano tech or whatever. Today’s technology cannot support millions upon millions of cars. Not to mention the cost of buying and charging every single day. It can’t. People just need to admit this to themselves.

Take the fact that ”most” will charge their vehicles overnight .....Go sit at your local gas station for 1 day and watch and count the sheer number of cars coming and going. Now imagine that each of those data points now takes 45 minutes to “fill up”. We are giving everyday drivers too much credit that they will be charging every night AND they are running around less than current vehicles capacity on 100% charge. ....today.

ICEs are here for a while.

ETA: electric is just a interim “Option”. There will be another technology in the future that will allow for greater adoption rates That makes more sense. Electric is not the answer.

instead of looking at what goes up front .....technology needs to look at what “goes in the tank”.

I think that most people do charge their EVs at home overnight. I do. It’s become a habit kind of like charging my phone overnight. Simple. The car doesn’t need to be charged every though. I do it maybe one or two times a week. It’s way more convenient than going to a gas station and way cheaper too.

It would suck if I had to go to a damn gas station every day to charge my phone though. Now THAT would be a hurdle to adopting mobile phone technology.

When we transitioned from horses to ICE, everyone had a horse stable but nobody could imagine a gas station as a worthwhile or convenient option. Everyone got anxious about the loss of their horses.

We all have electricity in our homes already. Many people already make their own electricity with solar. How many have a gas pump? How many refine their our gas?

This doesn’t seem all that daunting to me.

 

[LostWoods]

You're reply is patently false. The $7500 tax credit is what is says a tax credit. You don't get a check in the mail & you don't get $7500 off the price of your car. If you don't owe taxes you don't get a $7500 refund. If your federal tax liability is $ 1500 you get a $1500 tax credit. Some states offer tax refunds on your state taxes. I just went through this buying my wife's electric car. The only way in Colorado for example, to get $10K off the price of the car is to lease it, not buy it. Or have a $7,500 federal liability plus the state credit.

There are credits and there are refundable credits. Credits work as you believe and only reduce liability. If the credit exceeds liability, your liability is now $0 and that is the end of it. Things like the EV credit, many education credits, etc. are tagged as refundable which means you either reduce liability or, if your tax liability is lower than the credit, you receive the balance back from the IRS as a refund.

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