3.0 Diesel 85K mile service - results & photos

[CrazyCooter]

It’s a pyramid scheme, or as they like to call it a MLM. I guess someone is slacking in your area and needs to build a pyramid, er more levels there. It’s a good product, but that itself steers me away from it.

If you really think about it, EVERYTHING is a pyramid? The CEO at McDonalds makes more than the burger flipper? Is that a scam or scheme? No it's a business model that works!


I'm a dealer with a retail location, but have no desire to build a MLM team. Trust me when I say it's not really worth it monetarily. With them directly competing by offering to sign anyone up with no skin in the game it can be a race to the bottom with wannabe's fighting to death for sales, but the product is good and that's why I'm in it.

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[Hootbro]

Amsoil is a family owned and run company. They have stated in the past the main reason they do not do large big box retail sales is that they then loose control of the product with big box retail dictating their business conditions and not them.

They scale at their own pace. It is hard for some to understand that some businesses are not out to be corporate behemoths and not everybody will be their customer.

 

[JTdiRtyD]

Amsoil is one of the leading oils and fluids in motorsports and powersports. I'd not hesitate to run it.

 

[biodiesel]

Does that change your oil recommendation for a gen 3 at all?

Last time I asked, you had recommended this:
"AMSOIL 5W-40 MS 100% Synthetic European Motor Oil"

No, Amsoil MS is the superior oil for the Gen 3 EcoDiesel.

 

[ericw.]

No, Amsoil MS is the superior oil for the Gen 3 EcoDiesel.

Good to know. I couldn't find any MS-# certification number on their product page but admittedly didn't look any further than that.

 

[biodiesel]

Good to know. I couldn't find any MS-# certification number on their product page but admittedly didn't look any further than that

Let me try to explain this in a way that makes sense. Stellantis has had a long-term partnership with Shell. I believe that partnership started back in 2011. Shell owns Pennzoil, Rotella, etc. So, Stellantis will choose an oil from Shell's oil collection that best meets the application. In the case of the Gen 3 EcoDiesel, the best oil from Shell's offering was Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W-40, which is a A3/B4 oil. I've been told by the oil gurus that A3/B4 oils are designed to operate at temperatures up to about 275*F.

Amsoil MS is a C3 oil which is also designed to operate at those super high temps. From my understanding, the A3/B4 spec is an older specification for older tech engines. C3 is the newest spec that is designed for modern engines with DPFs (think Mid-SAPS). I've been told that C3 oils can do everything that a A3/B4 oil can do, and perhaps do it better.

Back when the Gen 3 EcoDiesel was released, Amsoil's technical department couldn't understand why Stellantis chose a very outdated spec (MS-12991). But now we understand why. Shell has a very good C3 oil (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W-30) which was the original oil specified for the Gen 2 EcoDiesel in 2014. However, FCA revised that specification to 5W-40, which is why they started recommending Rotella T6 5W-40 (another Shell product).

As you can see, we have gone full circle with this oil conversation. Not only does Amsoil MS perform better based on UOA tests, but the C3 specification is best for the Gen 3 EcoDiesel. Even the folks at Amsoil's Technical department agree, but unfortunately, they can't recommend an oil that goes against Stellantis.

 

[ericw.]

Let me try to explain this in a way that makes sense. Stellantis has had a long-term partnership with Shell. I believe that partnership started back in 2011. Shell owns Pennzoil, Rotella, etc. So, Stellantis will choose an oil from Shell's oil collection that best meets the application. In the case of the Gen 3 EcoDiesel, the best oil from Shell's offering was Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W-40, which is a A3/B4 oil. I've been told by the oil gurus that A3/B4 oils are designed to operate at temperatures up to about 275*F.

Amsoil MS is a C3 oil which is also designed to operate at those super high temps. From my understanding, the A3/B4 spec is an older specification for older tech engines. C3 is the newest spec that is designed for modern engines with DPFs (think Mid-SAPS). I've been told that C3 oils can do everything that a A3/B4 oil can do, and perhaps do it better.

Back when the Gen 3 EcoDiesel was released, Amsoil's technical department couldn't understand why Stellantis chose a very outdated spec (MS-12991). But now we understand why. Shell has a very good C3 oil (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W-30) which was the original oil specified for the Gen 2 EcoDiesel in 2014. However, FCA revised that specification to 5W-40, which is why they started recommending Rotella T6 5W-40 (another Shell product).

As you can see, we have gone full circle with this oil conversation. Not only does Amsoil MS perform better based on UOA tests, but the C3 specification is best for the Gen 3 EcoDiesel. Even the folks at Amsoil's Technical department agree, but unfortunately, they can't recommend an oil that goes against Stellantis.

I appreciate the insight. I hope you didn't take it as a dig at you or Amsoil. I have some sitting in my garage for the next oil change so they were genuine questions.

I just want to stay in my lane and you're more educated on this topic than I ever wish to be, which is why I ask. lol

 

[Stan H]

It’s a pyramid scheme, or as they like to call it a MLM. I guess someone is slacking in your area and needs to build a pyramid, er more levels there. It’s a good product, but that itself steers me away from it.

They sell it that way because of the Dad He wanted others to be able to make a living.
I got 2 people sells it within 10miles.

 

[biodiesel]

I appreciate the insight. I hope you didn't take it as a dig at you or Amsoil. I have some sitting in my garage for the next oil change so they were genuine questions.

No, I didn't take it personal. I'm just trying to help everyone understand that the MS-12991 spec was only chosen because Shell didn't have anything else to offer. There are better oils for the Gen 3 EcoDiesel.

It is true that Amsoil and HPL are top tier oils, however, neither company produces to the masses. Both companies like to stay in their niche markets and focus on direct-to-consumer sales.

I've been running Pennzoil Platinum in my Gen 3 engines and running Rotella T6 in my 2015 Gen 2 engine. Before this knowledge came to light, I bought a huge stash of Pennzoil Platinum back around 2021 when it was heavily discounted/clearanced. Once I work through that, then I'll be switching to Amsoil MS myself. And if I'm not satisfied with the results from Amsoil MS, then I'll try HPL.

 

[Vtur]

No, I didn't take it personal. I'm just trying to help everyone understand that the MS-12991 spec was only chosen because Shell didn't have anything else to offer. There are better oils for the Gen 3 EcoDiesel.

It is true that Amsoil and HPL are top tier oils, however, neither company produces to the masses. Both companies like to stay in their niche markets and focus on direct-to-consumer sales.

I've been running Pennzoil Platinum in my Gen 3 engines and running Rotella T6 in my 2015 Gen 2 engine. Before this knowledge came to light, I bought a huge stash of Pennzoil Platinum back around 2021 when it was heavily discounted/clearanced. Once I work through that, then I'll be switching to Amsoil MS myself. And if I'm not satisfied with the results from Amsoil MS, then I'll try HPL.

I've also bought lots of QS back in 2021 when they were $15 a jug and been running it since first OC. Bought 7 jugs of VPB 5w-40 recently from a closed out Carquest. I'll take a sample before switching.

Unrelated but t-case Mopar ATF+4 for just $24 for 6qt.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07VFJYQJ3?ref_=ppx_hzod_title_mob_b_fed_asin_title_0_0

 

[RudeJeepin]

@biodiesel since you've probably forgotten more about oils than I'll ever care to know, what do you think about Valvoline Premium Blue Extreme Full Synthetic Diesel Engine Oil SAE 5W-40
https://shop.valvolineglobal.com/pr...SoD6TPxhyx_DxiQhg4kwbm6josbp3Kcmyxe&Size=1+GA

I used this in my Ram Cummins and have a supply of it still.
I'm just asking for your educated opinion and take all responsibility on myself.

 

[biodiesel]

I've also bought lots of QS back in 2021 when they were $15 a jug and been running it since first OC.

Back during COVID, I bought 13 jugs (5 quart in size) of Platinum Euro for $14.25. That comes out to $2.85 per quart. I bought enough for a 5-year supply.

 

[biodiesel]

what do you think about Valvoline Premium Blue Extreme Full Synthetic Diesel Engine Oil SAE 5W-40

It's a good oil for the Cummins and 2nd gen EcoDiesel, but I wouldn't run it in my Gen 3 EcoDiesel. We've seen the turbo that was taken off a Gen 3 test mule with a CK-4 oil. The deposits were a big enough concern for Stellantis to change the oil specification and send memos and a video to the service departments letting them know the concern.

 

[Vtur]

It's a good oil for the Cummins and 2nd gen EcoDiesel, but I wouldn't run it in my Gen 3 EcoDiesel. We've seen the turbo that was taken off a Gen 3 test mule with a CK-4 oil. The deposits were a big enough concern for Stellantis to change the oil specification and send memos and a video to the service departments letting them know the concern.

What's the difference between the gen2 vs gen3 that caused turbo issues with the CK4 oil? I just don't get it.

 

[biodiesel]

What's the difference between the gen2 vs gen3 that caused turbo issues with the CK4 oil? I just don't get it.

The Gen 3 produces more heat and pressure compared to the Gen 2 engine. You can literally run Rotella T6 in the Gen 2 engine for 20,000 miles and still have good UOA results. The Gen 3, on the other hand, shears oils quickly which is more evidence of extreme heat and pressure.

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