Clayton 3.5 Kit & 37s... is this normal?

[jwoz]

Hi All,

Not sure if this is just a "Jeep thing" or if I have a bigger problem that should be addressed...

So I've had my gladiator just over a month and the first 200 miles I drove it stock with zero complaints. It didn't feel as smooth as other midsize trucks I test drove, but compared to my lifted Liberty it was a massive improvement in ride quality.

A couple weeks back I had the following installed by a local shop:

• Clayton 3.5 Overland kit
• Fox 2.5 adjustable shocks front and rear (set to the softest setting)
• Mickey Thompson Baja Boss A/T All-Season 37X12.50R17LT (aired at around 29 cold psi)
• BLACK RHINO Arsenal Rim 17X9.5 5X127 Offset -18

The truck looks awesome, and on smooth roads and highway it still drives prretty great, but now whenever I hit any decent size bump in the road im getting quite a bit of feedback in the steering wheel; best described as a shimmying or shaking... video of the described shaking

I've done some reading and research but i'm not sure if this is just a reality of the modifications made? The problem seems similar to this video by [Banned Site] Jeep JL Wrangler Steering Wobble Fix with Rancho Front Track Bar or this post https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/death-wobble.52908/

I know Clayton sells a kit with a steering stabilizer and beefier tie rod and drag link, which I'm currently considering to add as upgrades to address my "problem"... but I don't want to go spending a ton of money on things if it isnt the best solution. I am going to take it back to the shop that installed it in another couple hundred miles for their standard check over of the install not sure if I should mention anything specific? They are a speciality shop, but I don't think they normally do Clayton lifts.

Appreciate any suggestions/perspectives.

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[Burghardphotography]

I’m learning as I go here, so don’t quote me on this, as I haven’t got mine all installed yet, but I’m doing the Clayton 3.5 and 37s as well on Monday.

It was explained to me that if you are going to 37’s when you’re lifting, upgrading the tie rod and drag link is a must, or else you’ll encounter issues like you’re experiencing. Hence why Clayton encourages buying the 3.5 lift bundle that includes those items.

I’m also doing metalcloak’s sector shaft brace and reenforcement bracket for the steering box as well on top of the tie rod and drag link upgrade.

 

[CrazyCooter]

I got my money on 3 main issues with your combination.

1)73lb wheel that is hanging off your axle end 17x9.5 -18? Thats Brodozer territory.

2) Tires are over inflated assuming you truck doesn't have a bunch of armor plating bolted on. A 37x12.50 on a 9.5" wheel will probably land somewhere between 23-26 psi on an unloaded Gladiator.

3) The valving on those shocks out of the box is horrible for controlling that kind high speed wheel movement. You can try to dial in some high speed and see if it helps, but I didn't start noticing a real difference till I cracked the shocks open and made some changes.

I'm sure a more rigid tire rod/draglink combined with a good steering stabilizer will help some, but do the free stuff first......tire pressure and shock clickers.

 

[Burghardphotography]

I got my money on 3 main issues with your combination.

1)73lb wheel that is hanging off your axle end 17x9.5 -18? Thats Brodozer territory.

2) Tires are over inflated assuming you truck doesn't have a bunch of armor plating bolted on. A 37x12.50 on a 9.5" wheel will probably land somewhere between 23-26 psi on an unloaded Gladiator.

3) The valving on those shocks out of the box is horrible for controlling that kind high speed wheel movement. You can try to dial in some high speed and see if it helps, but I didn't start noticing a real difference till I cracked the shocks open and made some changes.

I'm sure a more rigid tire rod/draglink combined with a good steering stabilizer will help some, but do the free stuff first......tire pressure and shock clickers.

If -18 is nearing brodozer territory, I worry what the ones I have sitting in the garage are going to look like ?

 

[Timgco]

You’re going to get answers that are guesses without getting hands-on.
any good shop that’s installing suspension will give you an alignment sheet, paint mark every nut/ bolt they touched, and do a re-torque on everything after 500 miles.

would need to see alignment specs to further attempt a diag.

don’t start throwing money and parts at it to fix it though. Diag the changed components and geometry first.

 

[Vtur]

Hi All,

Not sure if this is just a "Jeep thing" or if I have a bigger problem that should be addressed...

So I've had my gladiator just over a month and the first 200 miles I drove it stock with zero complaints. It didn't feel as smooth as other midsize trucks I test drove, but compared to my lifted Liberty it was a massive improvement in ride quality.

A couple weeks back I had the following installed by a local shop:

• Clayton 3.5 Overland kit
• Fox 2.5 adjustable shocks front and rear (set to the softest setting)
• Mickey Thompson Baja Boss A/T All-Season 37X12.50R17LT (aired at around 29 cold psi)
• BLACK RHINO Arsenal Rim 17X9.5 5X127 Offset -18

The truck looks awesome, and on smooth roads and highway it still drives prretty great, but now whenever I hit any decent size bump in the road im getting quite a bit of feedback in the steering wheel; best described as a shimmying or shaking... video of the described shaking

I've done some reading and research but i'm not sure if this is just a reality of the modifications made? The problem seems similar to this video by [Banned Site] Jeep JL Wrangler Steering Wobble Fix with Rancho Front Track Bar or this post https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/death-wobble.52908/

I know Clayton sells a kit with a steering stabilizer and beefier tie rod and drag link, which I'm currently considering to add as upgrades to address my "problem"... but I don't want to go spending a ton of money on things if it isnt the best solution. I am going to take it back to the shop that installed it in another couple hundred miles for their standard check over of the install not sure if I should mention anything specific? They are a speciality shop, but I don't think they normally do Clayton lifts.

Appreciate any suggestions/perspectives.

Steering damper solved my bump steer issue with mine 37, but i also have f/r track bars. Still on stock tie rod and drag link.

 

[rezar1]

I have the overland plus 3.5 and 37s and the Falcon steering stabilizer helped out a lot. I also install the Rockjock steering system.

 

[Tommyd]

Steering damper solved my bump steer issue with mine 37, but i also have f/r track bars. Still on stock tie rod and drag link.

He has both track bars too. It comes in Clayton’s lifts

 

[jwoz]

Thanks to everyone who's responded thus far, really appreciate the suggestions and feedback.

I got my money on 3 main issues with your combination.

1)73lb wheel that is hanging off your axle end 17x9.5 -18? Thats Brodozer territory.

2) Tires are over inflated assuming you truck doesn't have a bunch of armor plating bolted on. A 37x12.50 on a 9.5" wheel will probably land somewhere between 23-26 psi on an unloaded Gladiator.

3) The valving on those shocks out of the box is horrible for controlling that kind high speed wheel movement. You can try to dial in some high speed and see if it helps, but I didn't start noticing a real difference till I cracked the shocks open and made some changes.

I'm sure a more rigid tire rod/draglink combined with a good steering stabilizer will help some, but do the free stuff first......tire pressure and shock clickers.

I had debated quite a bit on the wheel/tire weight but had seen quite a few posts on here stating it didn't matter too much in the scheme of things. Obviously swapping wheels and tires isn't really a route I'd like to go at this point but It's something I'll keep in mind as far as performance goes.

Definitely going to take a look at further adjusting the shocks and tire pressure though.

If -18 is nearing brodozer territory, I worry what the ones I have sitting in the garage are going to look like ?

Not sure what offset your wheels are, but I think mine don't look "brodozer", but I suppose it's all subjective....

You’re going to get answers that are guesses without getting hands-on.
any good shop that’s installing suspension will give you an alignment sheet, paint mark every nut/ bolt they touched, and do a re-torque on everything after 500 miles.

would need to see alignment specs to further attempt a diag.

don’t start throwing money and parts at it to fix it though. Diag the changed components and geometry first.

From what I can tell all of that was done. Here's the alignment sheet, excuse the lower quality I don't have access to a scanner at the moment:

I have the overland plus 3.5 and 37s and the Falcon steering stabilizer helped out a lot. I also install the Rockjock steering system.

I remember seeing your post; I did decide to go ahead and order the steering system and stabilizer. Hoping I end up with a similar improvement.

 

[taintedsaint]

I have the same lift, running Milestar Pats 37". I spent the money for the adjustable Fox ATS stabilizer and I have never had a shimmy AT ALL. At any speed, any road bump, any load, nothing. Yes, the ATS is pricey but you can adjust its resistance as needed. Highly recommended.

 

[Dlish]

37s and similar lift.
i did upgrade to RPM tie rod and drag link. I also run tires down around 26-28. Makes a difference

but also attaching my alignment spec. My shop added a little more caster, seemed to help exactly what you describing.

Also, one of my wheels dropped a weight, could immediately feel what I would call pre-wobble over bumps. Shimmy would start but would go away. Did they get good balance on the wheels?

 

[Vtur]

-18 offset doesn't sounds like much when crawling and under 65mph, but anything over 70mph will amplifies any imperfections with 37s.

 

[JT1]

Hi All,

Not sure if this is just a "Jeep thing" or if I have a bigger problem that should be addressed...

So I've had my gladiator just over a month and the first 200 miles I drove it stock with zero complaints. It didn't feel as smooth as other midsize trucks I test drove, but compared to my lifted Liberty it was a massive improvement in ride quality.

A couple weeks back I had the following installed by a local shop:

• Clayton 3.5 Overland kit
• Fox 2.5 adjustable shocks front and rear (set to the softest setting)
• Mickey Thompson Baja Boss A/T All-Season 37X12.50R17LT (aired at around 29 cold psi)
• BLACK RHINO Arsenal Rim 17X9.5 5X127 Offset -18

The truck looks awesome, and on smooth roads and highway it still drives prretty great, but now whenever I hit any decent size bump in the road im getting quite a bit of feedback in the steering wheel; best described as a shimmying or shaking... video of the described shaking

I've done some reading and research but i'm not sure if this is just a reality of the modifications made? The problem seems similar to this video by [Banned Site] Jeep JL Wrangler Steering Wobble Fix with Rancho Front Track Bar or this post https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/death-wobble.52908/

I know Clayton sells a kit with a steering stabilizer and beefier tie rod and drag link, which I'm currently considering to add as upgrades to address my "problem"... but I don't want to go spending a ton of money on things if it isnt the best solution. I am going to take it back to the shop that installed it in another couple hundred miles for their standard check over of the install not sure if I should mention anything specific? They are a speciality shop, but I don't think they normally do Clayton lifts.

Appreciate any suggestions/perspectives.

Looking at your toe numbers, they may be a little high. Mine on the same lift and tire size, but with less offset is really sensitive to toe. Also, as your jeep is new, I would suggest checking all 4 ball joints. Mine were loose from the factory. My tierod on the passenger side was also pretty loose from the factory. It drove ok stock, but once lifted, all those things were really exacerbated by the lift and tires.

 

[Minty JL]

37s and similar lift.
i did upgrade to RPM tie rod and drag link. I also run tires down around 26-28. Makes a difference

but also attaching my alignment spec. My shop added a little more caster, seemed to help exactly what you describing.

Also, one of my wheels dropped a weight, could immediately feel what I would call pre-wobble over bumps. Shimmy would start but would go away. Did they get good balance on the wheels?

Your alignment sheet looks a lot better then the OP.

On his sheet, I would have not let it leave with the Toe that far out and he barely tried on the Caster up front.

Shitty alignments are normally the byproduct of the Tech getting paid a flat rate for an alignment or it being included with a "package". You can make killer money on Flat Rate if you're efficient, but for some, they make money by halfassing it.

 

[Escape.idiocracy]

Steering damper solved my bump steer issue with mine 37, but i also have f/r track bars. Still on stock tie rod and drag link.

A steering damper isn’t going to solve any issues- it will mask the real problem. All of my previous jeeps on 37’s-40’s when first setup are ram without a dampener for that reason- they mask loose bolts/issues….. a well setup lift should be able to track straight and not have any shimmy’s, shakes etc….

don’t get me wrong- hydro assist has always been added so the masking in my experience still takes place… but I run them with nothing first to make sure everything is set.

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