Loose Steering?

[jrf]

Another FCA steering issue on Ram trucks

https://leftlanenews.com/ram/fca-faces-investigation-into-ram-2500-recall/

Notice...NHTSA needs enough people to complain to open a case.

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[ShadowsPapa]

A video I made of my steering on a drive today. Looks like crappy quality converting it to a gif, but a decent amount of play I’d say

Looks like one of those cheap B movies where they show someone in a car driving and they simply move the wheel back and forth to look like they are driving - and keep looking over at their passenger, not the road....... yikes!
Heck, I can rest my arm on the arm rest and unless it's WINDY, my hand hardly moves. Wind - now that's another matter but then I'm driving a billboard or a huge sailing ship down the highway - it's bound to get shoved around and need to be corrected. Trim the sails boys.

 

[Trauma PA]

A video I made of my steering on a drive today. Looks like crappy quality converting it to a gif, but a decent amount of play I’d say

This is a joke, right?

 

[spazzyfry123]

Looks like one of those cheap B movies where they show someone in a car driving and they simply move the wheel back and forth to look like they are driving - and keep looking over at their passenger, not the road....... yikes!
Heck, I can rest my arm on the arm rest and unless it's WINDY, my hand hardly moves. Wind - now that's another matter but then I'm driving a billboard or a huge sailing ship down the highway - it's bound to get shoved around and need to be corrected. Trim the sails boys.

This is a joke, right?

Let me clarify and say this isn't the level of input needed to keep the Jeep straight constantly. I took this quick video to show just how much play I have before the Jeep will react to my input. So no, unfortunately, not a joke. This is how much I am able to turn the wheel left to right without the Jeep making any movement left to right going down the road. Can't tell in the video, but I've got about 2900 miles on it. Bone stock Rubicon I ordered and took delivery in October. Ironic thing is I took the video on my way to the dealer to show them to discuss. Said they are loaded up and have an appointment next Tuesday.

Curious how this level of play compares to others that are complaining of loose steering.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Let me clarify and say this isn't the level of input needed to keep the Jeep straight constantly. I took this quick video to show just how much play I have before the Jeep will react to my input. So no, unfortunately, not a joke. This is how much I am able to turn the wheel left to right without the Jeep making any movement left to right going down the road. Can't tell in the video, but I've got about 2900 miles on it. Bone stock Rubicon I ordered and took delivery in October. Ironic thing is I took the video on my way to the dealer to show them to discuss. Said they are loaded up and have an appointment next Tuesday.

Curious how this level of play compares to others that are complaining of loose steering.

If I moved my wheel that much left to right it would make people behind me think I was drunk as it would react. Maybe not like a tight ratio sector in a sports car, but still, it would take the truck back and forth quite a bit.
It would be interesting to compare - that's why I suggested anyone in my area come over and compare and we'd check things out.
You did double-check tire pressure and it's not at some nasty factory setting over 38 is it? You said it's stock so I didn't know if anything was checked over yet or not.
There are simple things you can do - have someone "wiggle" the wheel back and forth while you look for flex or anything loose - watch the linkage and see if things respond right away or there is lag before the wheels respond.
Run your hands across the face of the tires - from inside to outside then from outside to inside, both front tires. If either feels "sawtooth" or rough one direction and smoother the other, you do have a toe issue. If that's not correct it will cause tire wear (and you have enough miles it may show already) and no matter what else, it needs corrected. If that's wrong it can cause SHIMMY as well. With the larger tires on these it might feel unstable rather than a fast shake.
Poor alignment (and alignment includes caster, camber, as well as other angles and concepts) MAY show a pattern on the tire you can see - if you drive on dirty concrete - say small gravel, sand, dirt, etc as the wheels turn they won't move in a perfectly straight line - look at the dirt and pattern on the front tires. If anything is skewed - like something was wiped across the tire instead of the tire rolling straight over it, something may be off.
IF you are going to check toe yourself - use a good stiff tape measure, not a cheap narrow Harbor Freight version - something that will stay straight when you have 10 feet rolled out. OR, use a long flat stick and make marks after checking the rear and then place it on the front and compare to the mark you made at the rear.
My point is that a tape measure can flex enough to throw your reading off by 1/8" or more so whatever you use to measure, keep it perfectly straight.
You want the front end to be "relaxed" when doing that check, no stress, so flat ground, come to a slow stop - hitting the brakes tends to move the fronts of the wheels out and could give a false toe reading. We would work the steering wheel back and forth a bit, then center it, then read toe.
A while back I commented that there may be more than one thing going on - some symptoms may match more than one cause.
It's harder to resolve things if there is more than one cause as something can mask other things.
Check the basics, get someone to wiggle the wheel (engine running) while you look under the front and watch things closely.
If you check all of the basics, you go from there - because we don't know for a fact ALL people are seeing the exact same thing. Of 100 people, 20 could be a defect or problem while 40 can be resolved by checks and adjustments.
Some things are free to do and you sure don't need a shop to do them for you.

 

[Onebigyoshi]

A video I made of my steering on a drive today. Looks like crappy quality converting it to a gif, but a decent amount of play I’d say

This is pretty much exactly the same amount of play I have on my bone stock rubicon as well. If this is an issue then I need to get mine fixed.

Also, my tire pressure is set at 38 cold.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

This is pretty much exactly the same amount of play I have on my bone stock rubicon as well. If this is an issue then I need to get mine fixed.

Also, my tire pressure is set at 38 cold.

That's where I run my Overland tires - try lowering by 2s - meaning 36. Seems to me that in those tires 38 cold would translate to 40 warm - sounds high to me. I run 36 in the tires on my wife's Jeep - and ran 40 in my Chevy truck's tires. Both performed perfectly with totally even wear across the tread.
My overland is good at 38 but you have slightly wider tires, more footprint, so that 38 may be harsh.

From where I sit - you may or may not have an issue - but we have seen that in most cases what these are delivered with is really dumb tire inflation numbers.

 

[Onebigyoshi]

That's where I run my Overland tires - try lowering by 2s - meaning 36. Seems to me that in those tires 38 cold would translate to 40 warm - sounds high to me. I run 36 in the tires on my wife's Jeep - and ran 40 in my Chevy truck's tires. Both performed perfectly with totally even wear across the tread.
My overland is good at 38 but you have slightly wider tires, more footprint, so that 38 may be harsh.

From where I sit - you may or may not have an issue - but we have seen that in most cases what these are delivered with is really dumb tire inflation numbers.

Thanks for the advice. I'll lower it to 36 tonight and report back tomorrow morning to see if it improves the amount of play in the steering wheel. When I first got it at the dealership it was set at 42 and it wandered like crazy at highway speeds. When I lowered it to 38 the wandering was pretty much gone.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Thanks for the advice. I'll lower it to 36 tonight and report back tomorrow morning to see if it improves the amount of play in the steering wheel. When I first got it at the dealership it was set at 42 and it wandered like crazy at highway speeds. When I lowered it to 38 the wandering was pretty much gone.

42 - wow. Mine was 39 when I got it - and it was a cold night when I got it. I lowered it and it now runs 38 and is fine - actually mine was fine anyway at their pressure but it was too high no matter how it drove.

Page 331 of the owners manual has an interesting paragraph........ about over-inflation and under-inflation possibly causing a sluggish response or over-response in steering.
But before assuming a problem - there's no reason for people to not check what they have the ability to check.

 

[BeeYoBe]

Another step in my dealer/steering issue: Jeep Wave followed up with my original appointment and I told them that the problem is still there and that I was told that there was no fix at this time. So JW is now going to schedule another appointment at the same dealer with a 3rd Party Tech to see if they can then find anything wrong. Anyone else have this happen? Did it yield any promising results?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Another step in my dealer/steering issue: Jeep Wave followed up with my original appointment and I told them that the problem is still there and that I was told that there was no fix at this time. So JW is now going to schedule another appointment at the same dealer with a 3rd Party Tech to see if they can then find anything wrong. Anyone else have this happen? Did it yield any promising results?

That alone is promising - they haven't let it go or closed your case yet and are pulling in another party. Very interesting.

 

[Reasons]

A video I made of my steering on a drive today. Looks like crappy quality converting it to a gif, but a decent amount of play I’d say

Hard to tell from the GIF but it appears to me that you have about 1" of play from left to right. I have about 0.5" of play from left to right before my Rubicon reacts. I have my stock 33" Falkens set at 32 PSI cold. I've learned to live with it as I thought this amount of play is normal for solid axle vehicles. If not, then... Let's all complain and get a recall started.

 

[BeeYoBe]

That alone is promising - they haven't let it go or closed your case yet and are pulling in another party. Very interesting.

That just turned around very quickly. The dealer basically denied that idea stating that the others on their lot do the same thing so we are going to get the same result. Called a Second nearby dealer and they have had complaints, but same result. All the others drive the same. (hard to believe that 15 others on the lot do the same thing). Now waiting to hear from dealer number 3. So, this is going nowhere I'm afraid.

 

[spazzyfry123]

This is pretty much exactly the same amount of play I have on my bone stock rubicon as well. If this is an issue then I need to get mine fixed.

Also, my tire pressure is set at 38 cold.

This video was with 37 psi warm. But I've tried multiple different pressures with the same result. Only significant change was going from as-delivered tire pressures (42 psi cold I think it was?) down to about 35 psi cold after I took delivery. Any other changes I've done as low as into the 20s hasn't provided any positive result and is similar to video.

 

[spazzyfry123]

Hard to tell from the GIF but it appears to me that you have about 1" of play from left to right. I have about 0.5" of play from left to right before my Rubicon reacts. I have my stock 33" Falkens set at 32 PSI cold. I've learned to live with it as I thought this amount of play is normal for solid axle vehicles. If not, then... Let's all complain and get a recall started.

I'd say roughly between 1.25" and 1.50" in either direction. It feels like it's about 2.5" to 3" from left to right.

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