The Duck of Earl
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While playing around with the current Build & Price (I know this isn't 100% accurate - but good enough for this discussion) I wanted to get reactions and thoughts to some observations and questions. Honestly, I am still trying to settle on the specs for a custom order and this post is not meant to be a bash on one trim over another. (*All prices listed below are as of the date of the original post per Jeep.com).
First, I want to start by framing that this comparison relates solely to the Sport S Trim and the Max Tow Package vs the other trim options that offer the 4.10 gearing (I am really between the Sport S Max Tow and Mojave, but will include the Rubicon here as well). All builds below are in the color white without any additional selections made other than noted.
Second, for my purposes, I am not interested in the base Sport trim and it is not part of the below run-down. I will acknowledge that a bare bones Gladiator Sport with the Max Tow package can be selected for $40,625 versus the cheapest, *low options Mojave and Rubicon (except automatic trans ,since that is a prerequisite of Max Tow, and the Trailer-Tow Package, since well... figure that one out on your own...) which starts at $51,515 for both Rubi and Mojave. Now, while I understand the argument of the Sport buyers that you would not want to be 'forced' to pay for options you don't want or need, it is not fair to even compare the price difference between the base Sport Max Tow and the Rubicon/Mojave given all of the missing kit, let alone basic comforts and features standard on a <$15k Mitsubishi Mirage.
Also, I understand that there is a reduction in 'legal' payload and towing capacity - but with the Rubicon at 7K towing and Mojave at 6k in these baseline configurations, we are in the ballpark of what should be done with these mid-sized trucks anyway, as well as the fact (as will be explained more below) the smallish tires and lower ride height are something that many (and certainly me) change out / upgrade which while it would not be reflected on the door sticker - would lower the theoretical max GVWR and towing/payload.
The other point I want to make before jumping in is that this comparison is not meant to consider the person who would truly tear down the gladiator for a 'fully built' monster with 37" + tires, etc. and all that would entail. I would consider the max of any future upgrades being that middle ground of no more than 35" tires and retaining normal/stock wheels, driveshafts, steering unit, gears, etc, - all of which should be reasonably supported by either of the 3 baseline options without substantial mods.
On to the actual value comparison. So the starting point here is a Sport S Max Tow - which starts at $44,025. The Rubicon/Mojave baselines (criteria explained above) are $51,515, but this is not an apples-to-apples comparison. The Rubicon/Mojave include the 8.4-inch screen and other things which are not in the Sport S without adding the 8.4-Inch Radio and Premium Audio Group, Convenience Group, and Technology Group (must add all in the configurator) which brings the true price of the baseline comparison to $47,910 for the Sport S Max Tow with those options checked. This is a $3,605 difference between the Rubicon/Mojave and the Sport S Max Tow in the baseline comparisons (more thoughts on more fully optioned comparisons below).
Now - the big question is what all extras do you get in the Rubicon/Mojave for that $3,605 difference and is it worth it?
Please chime in on what I am missing here, but lets add in all of the 'extras'. Also, I acknowledge that the Max Tow does come with the LSD which is sub'd for the lockers below and the difference in springs - is there anything else that you would get on a Max Tow but not the comparable baseline Rubicon/Mojave? (Also, I am leaving off some of the purely cosmetic stuff like the red dash in the rubicon, red/oranage accents and sticking, and stickers/badges are those are subjective and aside from the 'look at me factor' minimal 'true' value difference):
For Rubicon: Front & Rear Electronic Lockers, Off Road +, disconnecting sway bars, lift, better shocks, 33" Tires and better rims, high clearance fenders, metal rear bumper and extra recovery hooks, vented/bulged hood, better seats, soft touch dash and door cards, lighted footwells, rock rails & bed sliders, Molle setbacks.
For Mojave: Rear Electronic Locker, Off Road +, lift, 33" Tires and better rims; high clearance fenders, different bumpers with extra recovery hooks, hood scoop hood, THAT SUSPENSION, cast iron knuckles, better seats, better steering wheel, soft touch dash and door cards, lighted footwells, rock rails, Molle setbacks.
Adding the stuff above up to me seems like well more than $3,605 worth of value. And judging by the seemingly majority of Max Tow owners on this forum who immediately (or shortly thereafter) replace at least the existing tires (which are puny and look awkward on the Gladiator period) and add something to at least cover the unsightly pinch seams under the doors, the delta is really far less...
Now apart from even the baseline comparisons outlined above, when you more fully option up the baseline Gladiators, a similar story unfolds, but the price difference grows a little bit. There are also some odd Jeep packaging idioms - like the fact that on the Sport S Max Tow - you can only get body colored fender flares when you add the LED light package (which really bothers me) and keep in mind you can only order the forward facing trail cam with the Rubi/Mojave (just not with the gloss black grill for whatever reason).
Curiously, when more fully optioning up the baselines (adding the following: Black Freedom 3-Piece Hard Top; Adaptive Cruise; Aux Switches; Cold Weather Group; Active Safety Group; LED Headlights; Trail Rail Management; Spray in Bedliner; Selec-Trac/Rock-Trac Full time) the price difference grows to $5,100 with $55,550 for the Sport S Max Tow and $60,450 for Rubi/Mojave (think this is due to the Popular Equipment Package on the Sport S which cuts a brake on the hard top given that we already added the Radio, Tech, and Convenience packages to the initial example).
The question would still remain, whether all of the 'extra' kit is worth it on the Rubi/Mojave? Clearly, it would be cost prohibitive from a value perspective to add all the features of Rubi/Mojave on a part-for-part basis to the Sport S Max Tow (for these purposes we have to include applicable labor charges as not everyone can DIY and even wrenching-it-yourself has lost opportunity costs that would need to factor in) - but what about just a Mopar lift, larger tires, and simple rock rails/sliders?
Even there just using example numbers, I think we are talking about $4k in 'upgrades' to the Sport S Max Tow to just get the stance of the truck similar.
Appreciate the thoughts.
First, I want to start by framing that this comparison relates solely to the Sport S Trim and the Max Tow Package vs the other trim options that offer the 4.10 gearing (I am really between the Sport S Max Tow and Mojave, but will include the Rubicon here as well). All builds below are in the color white without any additional selections made other than noted.
Second, for my purposes, I am not interested in the base Sport trim and it is not part of the below run-down. I will acknowledge that a bare bones Gladiator Sport with the Max Tow package can be selected for $40,625 versus the cheapest, *low options Mojave and Rubicon (except automatic trans ,since that is a prerequisite of Max Tow, and the Trailer-Tow Package, since well... figure that one out on your own...) which starts at $51,515 for both Rubi and Mojave. Now, while I understand the argument of the Sport buyers that you would not want to be 'forced' to pay for options you don't want or need, it is not fair to even compare the price difference between the base Sport Max Tow and the Rubicon/Mojave given all of the missing kit, let alone basic comforts and features standard on a <$15k Mitsubishi Mirage.
Also, I understand that there is a reduction in 'legal' payload and towing capacity - but with the Rubicon at 7K towing and Mojave at 6k in these baseline configurations, we are in the ballpark of what should be done with these mid-sized trucks anyway, as well as the fact (as will be explained more below) the smallish tires and lower ride height are something that many (and certainly me) change out / upgrade which while it would not be reflected on the door sticker - would lower the theoretical max GVWR and towing/payload.
The other point I want to make before jumping in is that this comparison is not meant to consider the person who would truly tear down the gladiator for a 'fully built' monster with 37" + tires, etc. and all that would entail. I would consider the max of any future upgrades being that middle ground of no more than 35" tires and retaining normal/stock wheels, driveshafts, steering unit, gears, etc, - all of which should be reasonably supported by either of the 3 baseline options without substantial mods.
On to the actual value comparison. So the starting point here is a Sport S Max Tow - which starts at $44,025. The Rubicon/Mojave baselines (criteria explained above) are $51,515, but this is not an apples-to-apples comparison. The Rubicon/Mojave include the 8.4-inch screen and other things which are not in the Sport S without adding the 8.4-Inch Radio and Premium Audio Group, Convenience Group, and Technology Group (must add all in the configurator) which brings the true price of the baseline comparison to $47,910 for the Sport S Max Tow with those options checked. This is a $3,605 difference between the Rubicon/Mojave and the Sport S Max Tow in the baseline comparisons (more thoughts on more fully optioned comparisons below).
Now - the big question is what all extras do you get in the Rubicon/Mojave for that $3,605 difference and is it worth it?
Please chime in on what I am missing here, but lets add in all of the 'extras'. Also, I acknowledge that the Max Tow does come with the LSD which is sub'd for the lockers below and the difference in springs - is there anything else that you would get on a Max Tow but not the comparable baseline Rubicon/Mojave? (Also, I am leaving off some of the purely cosmetic stuff like the red dash in the rubicon, red/oranage accents and sticking, and stickers/badges are those are subjective and aside from the 'look at me factor' minimal 'true' value difference):
For Rubicon: Front & Rear Electronic Lockers, Off Road +, disconnecting sway bars, lift, better shocks, 33" Tires and better rims, high clearance fenders, metal rear bumper and extra recovery hooks, vented/bulged hood, better seats, soft touch dash and door cards, lighted footwells, rock rails & bed sliders, Molle setbacks.
For Mojave: Rear Electronic Locker, Off Road +, lift, 33" Tires and better rims; high clearance fenders, different bumpers with extra recovery hooks, hood scoop hood, THAT SUSPENSION, cast iron knuckles, better seats, better steering wheel, soft touch dash and door cards, lighted footwells, rock rails, Molle setbacks.
Adding the stuff above up to me seems like well more than $3,605 worth of value. And judging by the seemingly majority of Max Tow owners on this forum who immediately (or shortly thereafter) replace at least the existing tires (which are puny and look awkward on the Gladiator period) and add something to at least cover the unsightly pinch seams under the doors, the delta is really far less...
Now apart from even the baseline comparisons outlined above, when you more fully option up the baseline Gladiators, a similar story unfolds, but the price difference grows a little bit. There are also some odd Jeep packaging idioms - like the fact that on the Sport S Max Tow - you can only get body colored fender flares when you add the LED light package (which really bothers me) and keep in mind you can only order the forward facing trail cam with the Rubi/Mojave (just not with the gloss black grill for whatever reason).
Curiously, when more fully optioning up the baselines (adding the following: Black Freedom 3-Piece Hard Top; Adaptive Cruise; Aux Switches; Cold Weather Group; Active Safety Group; LED Headlights; Trail Rail Management; Spray in Bedliner; Selec-Trac/Rock-Trac Full time) the price difference grows to $5,100 with $55,550 for the Sport S Max Tow and $60,450 for Rubi/Mojave (think this is due to the Popular Equipment Package on the Sport S which cuts a brake on the hard top given that we already added the Radio, Tech, and Convenience packages to the initial example).
The question would still remain, whether all of the 'extra' kit is worth it on the Rubi/Mojave? Clearly, it would be cost prohibitive from a value perspective to add all the features of Rubi/Mojave on a part-for-part basis to the Sport S Max Tow (for these purposes we have to include applicable labor charges as not everyone can DIY and even wrenching-it-yourself has lost opportunity costs that would need to factor in) - but what about just a Mopar lift, larger tires, and simple rock rails/sliders?
Even there just using example numbers, I think we are talking about $4k in 'upgrades' to the Sport S Max Tow to just get the stance of the truck similar.
Appreciate the thoughts.
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