Opinion: Jeep Made A Massive Mistake By Giving Up On The Gladiator 4xe

[ShadowsPapa]

Nah, totally disagree respectfully of course. It wasnt time tested and proved .

The 4xe concept and as implemented in the Grand Cherokee, Wrangler, was tested and proven.
But - those weren't rated to tow 7,000 pounds and the payload numbers of the JT.
The transmission technology is now there, ZF's newest rendition of the transmission used in the 4xe is amazing, efficient as heck as far as current technology and materials and manufacturing methods.
However, the battery capacity to handle prolonged towing and loads just wasn't working out.
But the 4xe itself? Amazing and over-all, quite reliable. And the 2.0 that goes along with it in the JLU - a proven engine, even all by itself without the help of electric. There's a lot of turbo 2's out there in Jeeps doing quite well.

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[Jrgunn5150]

I can only reiterate this so many times.

The 4xE DID NOT WORK WHEN TOWING.

That's it, full stop.

Couldn't maintain battery charge uphill with 7k behind it.

Imagine how angry people would be when they go from 470 ft/lbs to 280, mid trip.

The next gen platform, I'm sure, will address all that. That's the whole point of the Ramcharger/REV.

 

[Stan H]

I can only reiterate this so many times.

The 4xE DID NOT WORK WHEN TOWING.

That's it, full stop.

Couldn't maintain battery charge uphill with 7k behind it.

Imagine how angry people would be when they go from 470 ft/lbs to 280, mid trip.

The next gen platform, I'm sure, will address all that. That's the whole point of the Ramcharger/REV.

Ramcharger they bringing those boat anchors back

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I can only reiterate this so many times.

The 4xE DID NOT WORK WHEN TOWING.

That's it, full stop.

Couldn't maintain battery charge uphill with 7k behind it.

Imagine how angry people would be when they go from 470 ft/lbs to 280, mid trip.

The next gen platform, I'm sure, will address all that. That's the whole point of the Ramcharger/REV.

Yeah, pretty much what I said........

However, the battery capacity to handle prolonged towing and loads just wasn't working out.

 

[JTdiRtyD]

I'll bite on this even though the diesel vs gasser debate never goes anywhere.

The only people who seem to feel this way are people who own a Jeep with a diesel.

Same as the only people who seem to like the 4xE are the ones who own them. People will usually always stand behind what they have.

The consequence was that the type of buyer who bought the diesel Gladiator was the same type of person who buys a 3/4 or 1 ton pickup with a diesel but has nothing to carry or tow.

Thats exactly why I bought the diesel, I DO have things to tow. Can it tow as much as the gasser, no, but I don't need to tow that much (and honestly no one should be towing that much regularly with a Gladi anyways), but what I do need to tow it does it without any complaints. 3k miles towing my 2k lb camper and I still saw 17.9 mpg average. That was mountains, that was flat lands, windy days, while on 35s and with added weight of a RTT and all of our other crap. No gasser will do that, not even a full sized. Put two 2k lbs behind my buddies 2024 6.6L GMC and he drops from ~19mpgs to 15... 15! Thats ridiculous!

That coupled with the fact that Stellantis chose an Italian-made diesel with a ton of issues only made matters worse, and the diesel Gladiator was short lived.

Most common issues aren't the fault of the choice of engine, but rather emissions or CP4 related and found across all modern diesels. The diesel was short lived because of the CP4 pump availability and the demand for direction change to hybrids and EV (which we are now seeing isn't panning out well), not because it was a problematic engine. Theres thousands of Ram EcoD's out there with well over 100k and 200k miles still going strong, and a lot with 300k and 400k. Same engine.

As someone who has owned diesel trucks and has done countless 4 gallon oil changes and fuel filter changes and encountered many DPF issues, I can say that the average Jeep owner really does not want to deal with all that mess.

Deal with what mess? You still have to change oil on a gasser. Sure, oil changes are more expensive, but even in my past gassers my oil changes were expensive because I won't run the cheapest oil or filter I can get like so many people do these days.

Yes you have to change out fuel filters. It's a 10 minute job every other oil change, not difficult and not bank account breaking.

The savings at the pump more than makes up for the added costs of regular maintenance.

Most of your emissions systems issues are folks driving a diesel in the city with short commutes, not getting to operating temp, not getting a full regen, etc.

Sure, the Gladi has some specific issues with the diesel, but any issues outside the common emissions crap is entirely because of the platform they tried to cram everything into and not because it's a diesel. Diesels aren't for everyone, plain and simple. Just the same as EV aren't for everyone. I tried going back to a gasser after owning a BMW diesel, and I absolutely hated it. Granted it was a Tacoma that I probably would have hated even if I hadn't been coming from a diesel, but even the gasser Jeeps I test drove just didn't do it for me. Really anything N/A these days is lacking IMO. Poor power and/or poor economy.

 

[Jrgunn5150]

I put 445,000 miles on an Ecodiesel Ram, and took my gas Gladiator off the lot directly next to a diesel unit lol.

Given the choice, I chose not to do it again.

Since it's my wifes vehicle, and I explained to her the extra effort needed, she refused, nope, don't want to do it.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The savings at the pump more than makes up for the added costs of regular maintenance.

Sorry, no. I did a cost comparison of fuel/mile my JT vs. real world reports from JTD owners here as far as mileage, and the costs at the pump here.
It costs me the same in fuel for every mile as it does a diesel JT owner. So there's no cost savings at all. The differences in fuel prices in most locations, most of the time, make it a total wash.

No one needs to run those $10/quart oils - the fancy colors or boutique brands - a good quality Pennzoil, Mobil 1, Valvoline, etc. are just as good. So that argument falls flat as well. The oil changes for the diesel are a whole lot more expensive. I've never used anything but recommended oils, and I won't pay higher prices because of a fancy or funky name or "it's the cool thing to do".
So there's that argument failing.

Fuel costs - a wash.
Oil changes for the diesel - way more expensive.

the only real benefit is towing and low-end grunt under loads and how it makes the driver feel warm and fuzzy.
But don't talk about the fuel "savings" - it doesn't exist, and it certainly can't possibly offset other maintenance items.

 

[biodiesel]

I do agree. The motors are solid. Its the emissions that cause engine failure. But thats why you delete that nonsense.

Even in stock form, the EcoDiesel is pretty reliable. All three of my EcoDiesels are bone stock. In 10 years, I've only been broke down twice while traveling. Both times I was still able to drive the truck (limp mode) to the nearest dealer for a repair. The first was a MAP sensor and the second time was a failed EGR. That's not too bad considering we have 200,000 miles between all three EcoDiesels and we've towed all over the United States. We haven't owned a gasoline powered vehicle in 10 years, so our diesels are our daily drivers.

 

[D_JT]

The only people who seem to feel this way are people who own a Jeep with a diesel. I think most truck buyers know that the diesel was a bit silly. The average truck owner who buys a 3/4 or 1 ton pickup with a diesel sees it as a tool. Those vehicles have payload and tow ratings that far exceed the 1/2 ton trucks, so the extra costs and complexity associated with buying a diesel are negated by the benefits of owning a diesel. In the case of the Gladiator, the diesel engine was so much heavier that payload and towing limits were actually less. The consequence was that the type of buyer who bought the diesel Gladiator was the same type of person who buys a 3/4 or 1 ton pickup with a diesel but has nothing to carry or tow. It's just a toy. That coupled with the fact that Stellantis chose an Italian-made diesel with a ton of issues only made matters worse, and the diesel Gladiator was short lived. As someone who has owned diesel trucks and has done countless 4 gallon oil changes and fuel filter changes and encountered many DPF issues, I can say that the average Jeep owner really does not want to deal with all that mess.

See, this was my first diesel. I ordered for two reasons. One. A diesel Jeep truck just sounded awesome (which it is). and Two. Because of my long commute. I wanted the better fuel mileage. As far as issues. The Gen3 seems to be pretty solid. I know the first and second gens had issues. The def is annoying. But that can be deleted. As far as towing. The gas does have a higher rating but the diesel can handle towing better. Even if you "exceed" its "rating".

 

[Badunit]

Sorry, no. I did a cost comparison of fuel/mile my JT vs. real world reports from JTD owners here as far as mileage, and the costs at the pump here.
But don't talk about the fuel "savings" - it doesn't exist, and it certainly can't possibly offset other maintenance items.

Unfortunately that is true. There was a time (20 years ago) when diesel was cheap vs regular and it was easy to calculate when the diesel engine would pay itself off, even including the extra maintenance costs. But that fuel cost differential went away and went the opposite direction. Now a diesel is either a need to have (for heavy towing) or a want to have. It definitely does not pay for itself. Still my favorite engine, though. I love that torque and how it does everything effortlessly at low rpms.

 

[Sandman 4x4]

Usually, the low MPG is due to the owner, not the truck.
A stock Overland could do 22-23, with A/T tires, 19-21
Not bad for a brick.
But add a lift, bigger tires, more weight, and it goes down from there.
A very heavy Mojave X still does in the 17s, not bad for a very capable but brick-shaped truck. I've seen mid 17s on mine when I get out of our hills and drive the speed limits.
If I left it 100% stock, I bet that would climb a bit, but I needed the power steps and use it for snow plowing in the winter, so it's hard to leave it stock. Still, not bad for a really heavy small truck that has fenders that act like sails as you drive down the highway. Those are huge air scoops sticking up there, don't fool yourself. You want articulation and fenders to clear the tires - you lose mpg.

Now for the rest of it - I was hoping for the 4xe to be a real thing. Yes, I would have taken a serious look, but only if it could have kept the towing and payload numbers I'm used to.
Love our JLU 4xe, but my wife hates the range of only up to 25 miles on battery.

All true. My Sport S with stock 245/75-17 HT tires averages 17-24 depending upon how much highway, or red lights. If I try to get the best mileage possible, by manual shifting at 2,100 rpm in each gear, roll to a stop and up shift to an start off in second, using ACC, without lugging, I can get 20 city, 26 highway at 65, with tires at 40 psi.

 

[Stan H]

Theres thousands of Ram EcoD's out there with well over 100k and 200k miles still going strong, and a lot with 300k and 400k. Same engine.

And if they never bring it back all those Power Plants will have to be rebuilt. Buying a Dinasour is not my cup of tea

absolutely hated it. Granted it was a Tacoma

Hatred totally Justified. Tacomas Totally Suck !!

makes the driver feel warm and fuzzy.

Thats how I feel in my JTR with its 3.6L all warm and fuzzy

People will usually always stand behind what they have.

Bwahahaha thats is the truth % see I just did it above to lay validity to your claim

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Unfortunately that is true. There was a time (20 years ago) when diesel was cheap vs regular and it was easy to calculate when the diesel engine would pay itself off, even including the extra maintenance costs. But that fuel cost differential went away and went the opposite direction. Now a diesel is either a need to have (for heavy towing) or a want to have. It definitely does not pay for itself. Still my favorite engine, though. I love that torque and how it does everything effortlessly at low rpms.

Well said. And I get the allure of it, and how it's well, or even better, suited for some tasks.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

And if they never bring it back all those Power Plants will have to be rebuilt. Buying a Dinasour is not my cup of tea

Hatred totally Justified. Tacomas Totally Suck !!

Thats how I feel in my JTR with its 3.6L all warm and fuzzy

Bwahahaha thats is the truth % see I just did it above to lay validity to your claim

If the 4xe was problematic, I think some may know me, I'd be out there telling people of my mistake.
AFAIK, the leaky transmission was a problem clear up through the 24 model year. But once that was fixed for us............

 

[chaosjake]

Same as the only people who seem to like the 4xE are the ones who own them. People will usually always stand behind what they have.

I like the 4xe, and I've never owned one. Been wheeling with a couple of guys who had 4xe JLUs, and they were happy. My cousin has one as a summer fun car (must be nice) and he loves it.

Put two 2k lbs behind my buddies 2024 6.6L GMC and he drops from ~19mpgs to 15... 15! Thats ridiculous!

15mpg is better than I average with the 3.6 JTR when all I'm hauling is myself and my dog.

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