Dealer overfilled oil

[Sandevino]

LOL - lack of tools isn't the problem, places to put them all is - or wondering if it's in my shop, if so, upstairs or main floor, or in the garage, or among the tools in the house.

Next time I’m in the shop I’ll snap a picture of what $800k of heavy diesel tools looks like. Everything from run of the mill kit to Cummins and Detroit proprietary tools.

Tools and access to the, aren’t the issue as every tool truck will sell you whatever you need, want and lust after for 48 easy monthly payments.

The issue is proper training, mentorship and attention to detail.

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[ShadowsPapa]

The issue is proper training, mentorship and attention to detail.

Got that right. My father was made head inspector in the factory where he worked, they got the contract from Sears to build equipment on the condition that he be the inspector for that line.
My grandfather liked all things mechanical and turned me loose with stuff.
My HS shop teachers were well-known and respected among their peers.
But I've found over time that even with "proper training" there's some just not cut out for certain things. My college class started with 30 - some of them real hot-shots, supposedly knew their stuff.
We graduated 18. One by one the hot-shots who knew their stuff couldn't handle it (and as one prof told it - they only thought they knew, couldn't actually do the work)

That translates to all sorts of things. I asked my then B-I-L about a computer for my farm in the 80s. He had a business building and selling computers and programming for business.
After a while he asked me to help out with his business. One day after he let go his 3rd employee, he said he was done hiring comp sci grads from his favorite college. They read the books, they passed the tests, but when put at a keyboard to solve a problem, they couldn't do it.
He was the sort of guy who could look at the hex address of a memory area, and figuring in his head while acting as if looking at a blackboard, tell you which chip had the issue.

 

[Rusty PW]

Next time I’m in the shop I’ll snap a picture of what $800k of heavy diesel tools looks like. Everything from run of the mill kit to Cummins and Detroit proprietary tools.

Tools and access to the, aren’t the issue as every tool truck will sell you whatever you need, want and lust after for 48 easy monthly payments.

The issue is proper training, mentorship and attention to detail.

When I was spinning wrenches. The joke was, The Snap-On guy owned your soul for $40 a week for the rest of your life.

 

[Sandevino]

When I was spinning wrenches. The joke was, The Snap-On guy owned your soul for $40 a week for the rest of your life.

 

[Rusty PW]

Truth.

I only got about $40,000 of Snap-On tools that I bought back in the early 80's. If I had to buy the same tools now. Think I would be looking at $120K. I have a Rick Mears Special Edition box that I bought in '83 that is packed. Hate to see what you got.

 

[Sandevino]

Truth.

I only got about $40,000 of Snap-On tools that I bought back in the early 80's. If I had to buy the same tools now. Think I would be looking at $120K. I have a Rick Mears Special Edition box that I bought in '83 that is packed. Hate to see what you got.

When I got out of heavy diesel repair I had about $800k in tools, boxes and specialty equipment. I had to pick up a counter bore tool for a rebuild job on a Cummins that ran $2200 used. Stuff you buy for one job and never use again got sold for today’s prices.

 

[ReverendZ]

Okay, for anyone watching this thread here is the new update. 23654mi, brought it in for the dealer to drop the pan and inspect. The oil came out like a glitter bomb, chock full of metal. Supposedly there is a TSB on this exact concern and they are ordering parts to do a full top end.... so, not just replace the engine that is full of metal in the bearings and everything else, no we will slap a top end on it and send it. Suffice to say I am more annoyed now than when they originally overfilled it. Of course they don't have a loaner so they are slapping the pan back on and sending it home with me. Hey @JeepCares what's your take? Are they running the clock out on my warranty? Pretty f ING upset.

 

[CrazyCooter]

Lemme guess.........The overfill ruined the engine?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Lemme guess.........The overfill ruined the engine?

Extremely doubtful on these. There's be thousands of them otherwise.
There is a TSB that I know of - it simply reminds shops that these take 5 and not 6, quarts.
Many have driven around with 6 quarts never realizing it. Think of the tens of thousands of Gladiator owners who have the dealership shop do things, take it home and just drive it, not even checking oil for say 1,000 miles. I've seen no signs of foaming or oil pressure with 6 quarts.
With the 2015 redesign of the 3.6 the windage "tray" was redesigned to further reduce issues - drag, etc. caused by windage in the crankcase.

and they are ordering parts to do a full top end.... so, not just replace the engine that is full of metal in the bearings and everything else,

Top end - you mean cams, followers (rockers) and lash adjusters (some still call lifters), ? or heads as well? (why heads, I wouldn't know)
I would insist they write up that there was metal found in the oil and they need to extend the engine warranty to cover the lower end.

Are they running the clock out on my warranty? Pretty f ING upset.

Doesn't work that way. Once a problem is reported and recorded and any work is done, the clock stops. It's like a time out. If it's on record, then the problem existed while in warranty. Besides, you have this under the drive train warranty, not just 36 months/36,000 miles.

 

[ReverendZ]

Well

Lemme guess.........The overfill ruined the engine?

, the glitter bomb was the service writers words so pretty much

 

[ReverendZ]

The

Extremely doubtful on these. There's be thousands of them otherwise.
There is a TSB that I know of - it simply reminds shops that these take 5 and not 6, quarts.
Many have driven around with 6 quarts never realizing it. Think of the tens of thousands of Gladiator owners who have the dealership shop do things, take it home and just drive it, not even checking oil for say 1,000 miles. I've seen no signs of foaming or oil pressure with 6 quarts.
With the 2015 redesign of the 3.6 the windage "tray" was redesigned to further reduce issues - drag, etc. caused by windage in the crankcase.



Top end - you mean cams, followers (rockers) and lash adjusters (some still call lifters), ? or heads as well? (why heads, I wouldn't know)
I would insist they write up that there was metal found in the oil and they need to extend the engine warranty to cover the lower end.


Doesn't work that way. Once a problem is reported and recorded and any work is done, the clock stops. It's like a time out. If it's on record, then the problem existed while in warranty. Besides, you have this under the drive train warranty, not just 36 months/36,000 miles.
[/QUOT

They are ordering headgaskets and all above.

 

[CrazyCooter]

I gotta wonder how much of these failures is the 0W20 oil combined with the reduction in anti-wear compounds in the oils today?

 

[ReverendZ]

I gotta wonder how much of these failures is the 0W20 oil combined with the reduction in anti-wear compounds in the oils today?

I don't know that the oil itself is the issue. The antifriction additives in modern oils are pretty darn amazing for what they do. The issue I see is that the oil being grossly overfull getting whipped by the crank into foam, even with a windage tray, would cause a breakdown in the hydrodynamic wedge that keeps the spinning metal parts from touching leading to premature failure of components with very tight tolerances, hence the 0w20 (and gas mileage). My bigger issue at this point is that instead of ordering in a crate engine, MSRP about 4500, they are going to go through "21" hours labor to teardown and replace I don't even know what and effectively kick the failure can down the road.

 

[CrazyCooter]

I don't know that the oil itself is the issue. The antifriction additives in modern oils are pretty darn amazing for what they do. The issue I see is that the oil being grossly overfull getting whipped by the crank into foam, even with a windage tray, would cause a breakdown in the hydrodynamic wedge that keeps the spinning metal parts from touching leading to premature failure of components with very tight tolerances, hence the 0w20 (and gas mileage). My bigger issue at this point is that instead of ordering in a crate engine, MSRP about 4500, they are going to go through "21" hours labor to teardown and replace I don't even know what and effectively kick the failure can down the road.

My first thought when I saw pan full of glitter.......Ummm...new engine?

 

[ReverendZ]

My first thought when I saw pan full of glitter.......Ummm...new engine?

That's what I would have expected instead of the goat roping escapade.

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