Why no max tow with the manual transmission?

[kd1yt]

The D478 specifically is a new derivative in the trans family. In marketing speak, "new" primarily means "new to Jeep". The Toyota versions are a few years older. The reason it's paired ONLY to the pentastar is because the 2L turbo doesn't have enough idle torque for good off-rad properties and the take rate with the diesel wouldn't be enough to warrant the engineering.

Any further details to connect the dots with what specific Aisin transmission "family"? Not doubting you, just interested in learning more

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[matt.firstlife]

Does it say MAX tow, or just "tow package". MAX tow is very different.
ALL tow packages, all of them have the bigger alternator and the brake pads are the same if you look up the actual pad part numbers.

Look again at the details. I have the largest alternator, I have the heavier fans, I have the HD brakes, but it's just a "tow package".
ALL Gladiators have the trailer wiring - all of them, even with no tow package. That means there's the connector for the trailer brake controller at the left kick panel even if you don't have a receiver under the bumper.

It says max tow. It has trailer brakes on it already as well.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

It says max tow. It has trailer brakes on it already as well.

The trailer brake controller doesn't mean anything at all - that's just what would be installed with any tow package so don't associate the brake controller with max tow - it's not.

If your JT has a manual, it doesn't have "max tow". Only automatics have that - here's the latest chart from a 2021 order guide right off the mopar site - and it mentions 80th anniversary being on the Sport S level - and Sport S can't have max tow on manual transmission.

Check the window sticker or build sheet - nothing else counts.

Note by the 6 speed manual transmission area only "Trailer Tow Package" is available.
By the 8 speed automatic section - that's where Trailer tow package and max tow are listed.

 

[matt.firstlife]

The trailer brake controller doesn't mean anything at all - that's just what would be installed with any tow package so don't associate the brake controller with max tow - it's not.

If your JT has a manual, it doesn't have "max tow". Only automatics have that - here's the latest chart from a 2021 order guide right off the mopar site - and it mentions 80th anniversary being on the Sport S level - and Sport S can't have max tow on manual transmission.

Check the window sticker or build sheet - nothing else counts.

Note by the 6 speed manual transmission area only "Trailer Tow Package" is available.
By the 8 speed automatic section - that's where Trailer tow package and max tow are listed.

You are right. So what makes the MaxTow difference? The gearing difference from 3.73 to 4.10? I have 4.88 gears in mine now. Other than gears I cant think of what could be different. This is interesting as to why they would offer setups with such drastic changes in towing capabilities.

 

[matt.firstlife]

You are right. So what makes the MaxTow difference? The gearing difference from 3.73 to 4.10? I have 4.88 gears in mine now. Other than gears I cant think of what could be different. This is interesting as to why they would offer setups with such drastic changes in towing capabilities.

Mine literally has everything except the 4.10 gearing from the factory.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

You are right. So what makes the MaxTow difference? The gearing difference from 3.73 to 4.10? I have 4.88 gears in mine now. Other than gears I cant think of what could be different. This is interesting as to why they would offer setups with such drastic changes in towing capabilities.

You likely missed the weeks or months long dozens of pages discussion.
There's a lot of really long threads and exhausting discussion on this very topic.
It's not a matter of parts, it's a system, a package. You can't throw parts on and easily build the max tow.
It's the axle width, the gearing, the automatic transmission, the SPRINGs, the weight of the vehicle, and more. These go through a rigorous SAE testing process to get their numbers.

The manual transmission is one big reason you won't get there, but it's more.

There's no one simple answer and you can't make changes to get there. Your truck is rated to tow what it's rated to tow. It's payload rating is what it is - you aren't going to change that sticker.

Bottom line - if you need the capabilities of the max tow - the 7500 pound towing, the 1600 pound payload, buy a max tow. (rounded numbers, folks! Rounded numbers, just making the point)

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Mine literally has everything except the 4.10 gearing from the factory.

No, you don't really if it's got the manual transmission.
The springs are also different - max tow springs are progressive springs rated for the much higher payload. Jeep used a lot of different springs under these.
You can't build a max tow that easily.

 

[Gatorized]

You are right. So what makes the MaxTow difference? The gearing difference from 3.73 to 4.10? I have 4.88 gears in mine now. Other than gears I cant think of what could be different. This is interesting as to why they would offer setups with such drastic changes in towing capabilities.

Mine literally has everything except the 4.10 gearing from the factory.

Only one way to know for sure- post a copy of your build and window sticker using these links
Build Status (add VIN # to the end - all caps):

https://www.chrysler.com/webselfservice/BuildSheetServlet?vin=



Window sticker (add VIN to the end):

https://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=

Take a picture of both and post them.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Only one way to know for sure- post a copy of your build and window sticker using these links
Build Statusadd VIN to the end - all caps):

https://www.chrysler.com/webselfservice/BuildSheetServlet?vin=



Window stickeradd VIN to the end):

https://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=

Take a picture of both and post them.

He's got a manual transmission......... that lets out max tow

 

[Gvsukids]

You are right. So what makes the MaxTow difference? The gearing difference from 3.73 to 4.10? I have 4.88 gears in mine now. Other than gears I cant think of what could be different. This is interesting as to why they would offer setups with such drastic changes in towing capabilities.

Some reading...

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/max-tow-max-tow-max-tow.38754/

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/max-tow-package.34860/

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...letely-enamored-with-the-max-tow-stock.42250/

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...w-to-tell-if-it’s-a-max-tow-or-regular.41166/

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/max-tow-confused-overland-trim-package.39570/

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/diesel-vs-max-tow.35539/

 

[Gatorized]

He's got a manual transmission......... that lets out max tow

Oh - I know it. I have the MT and 4.10 rear, but no max tow! Speculation will disappear when the sheets are posted! And maybe a pic of the door jamb sticker...

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Oh - I know it. I have the MT and 4.10 rear, but no max tow! Speculation will disappear when the sheets are posted!

Yup. Build sheet and window sticker.

 

[NachoRuby]

Mine literally has everything except the 4.10 gearing from the factory.

The manual is great, I like it. I have it too. But we do not have max tows. But you can tow 4000 lbs. on a Freedom w/Manual. Mojaves and Rubicons get slight more towing capacity with the manual (4500 lbs) than the sport/Freedom, but also a LOT less payload capacity than you do with the freedom. You have the highest payload of all Gladiators, at 1700 lbs on a Freedom (or Sport) with Manual Transmission and regular tow package. However, I don't think you have the wide axles without the max tow package. I think that's just on Max Tow, Rubicon and Mojave, but steer me in the right direction if you found otherwise.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The manual is great, I like it. I have it too. But we do not have max tows. But you can tow 4000 lbs. on a Freedom w/Manual. Mojaves and Rubicons get slight more towing capacity with the manual (4500 lbs) than the sport/Freedom ,but also a LOT less payload capacity than you do with the freedom. You have the highest payload of all Gladiators, at 1700 lbs on a Freedom (or Sport) with Manual Transmission and regular tow package. However, I don't think you have the wide axles without the max tow package. I think that's just on Max Tow, Rubicon and Mojave, but steer me in the right direction if you found otherwise.

The trailer tow package reduces that payload - based on Jeep's chart.
That 1700 is for Sport S, no tow package.
With tow package, Sport and Sport S are 1225

 

[NachoRuby]

Oh - I know it. I have the MT and 4.10 rear, but no max tow! Speculation will disappear when the sheets are posted! And maybe a pic of the door jamb sticker...

Only thing is towing capacity is not on the door jamb. Just axle capacity and GVWR.

The trailer tow package reduces that payload - based on Jeep's chart.
That 1700 is for Sport S, no tow package.
With tow package, Sport and Sport S are 1225

I just built a freedom on jeep.com with tow package, and it said 1700. Strange. If jeep doesn't know, where are we supposed to get out info from! One of their charts is wrong. Could have changed for '21 though, because my manual says my max payload is 1200, but I think '20s got 1300 lbs.

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