AEV 2.5" DualSport on Rubicon Diesel

[ThePhotoBus]

Just got the 2.5" AEV DualSport installed on my Rubicon Diesel (along with the AEV Steering Stabilizer and SteerSmarts Yeti Adjustable front track bar). What an upgrade!

Big thanks to Adventure Bound Off-road...it no longer feels like riding on one of these!

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[LOGS]

Hows it still going? Thinking of getting this lift. I do mostly beach riding so want something that eats up the bumps.

 

[ThePhotoBus]

Hows it still going? Thinking of getting this lift. I do mostly beach riding so want something that eats up the bumps.

I can't attest to beach riding specifically, but there's a big difference in the suspension. Instead of the springy back and forth I'd get with each bump, its a single rebound. It corners much better as well - an excellent balance on and off road. And of course it lifts that rear bumper up.

The disconnecting sway bar and suspension together really help it float over bumpy terrain much more smoothly. I guess it depends how fast you're planning on driving in the sand, but I imagine that combination would do pretty well at reasonably slower speeds.

The one negative feedback I've read has been that it's rough on washboards. I've got 37s that I'm airing down and I haven't noticed that yet, but I haven't been on really pronounced washboards yet either.

Hope that helps @LOGS

 

[Wolf Island Diver]

I got mine installed in December. First impression is that the lift and 37s redeems the truck. It’s as straight forward as that.

There’s a video of Dave Harriton from AEV at SEMA a few years ago talking about how awful the stock gladiator suspension is. I can attest to that. My Eco-Diesel routinely bottomed out its suspension on the road! While waiting for tires, I installed a bumper and winch. The added weight actually seemed to suppress the hobby horse motion a little bit but of course exacerbated the bottoming out. From the day I bought the truck I always thought that the handling was sketchy. I’ve owned 5 Jeeps and this one shocked me at how bad its road manners were. Keeping it in a lane where they’re doing road construction and avoiding the Jersey wall was nerve racking. Off road it bounced all over the place and I was constantly smashing into things underneath on trails that 25 years ago my Nissan D21 had no problems with. That’s sad.

I’ll put it this way, my father has a visceral hatred of modified vehicles. He and I drove up to Overland Expo East and within about 20 miles on the interstate he declared that I needed to go ahead and install this lift to fix the truck regardless of when I could find tires because he could tell it was awful from the passenger seat.

Upon completing the lift install, I basically have a totally different vehicle. On road the truck is actually enjoyable to drive on curvy back country roads, damn near sporty. It stays in its lane on the interstate. It’s no longer sketchy or scary. It’s smoother and it’s actually quieter. I went from the stock Falken 33 m/ts to 37 BFG KM3s. I think they ride better and are quieter. Having Sound Assassin floor liners is a plus too with the M/T tires.

Off road, it drives much better, articulates better and reacts to off camber and uneven terrain better. It no longer does the hobby horse wobble after every bump. Wash board fire roads are definitely rougher.

My personal view, having owned a TJ with a 5.5 inch long arm suspension system to accommodate 35s, is that this is superior. You can only achieve correct geometry with long arm suspension or drop brackets. With all due respect, short arm suspension systems are often a downgrade from stock as they don’t correct geometry enough, and they are often inferior quality to the stock control arms. I had two LCAs from a major well known manufacturer on my TJ fail. They refused to warranty them for no stated reason. Plastic on metal or metal on metal heim joints transmit shock loads to your vehicle that damage the frame, axles and other components and they require routine maintenance or they will fail, often on the trail. I never took replacement joints with my TJ. After a few years I went to rebuild them and realized that they had all disintegrated despite routine greasing. That Jeep had one of the most popular lifts at the time and it was a constant nightmare.

Rubberized joints that are now becoming popular are an improvement but the idea that there’s something inherently wrong with the stock control arms and that they need to be replaced with aftermarket ones of similar length is mostly marketing bs. If you’re worried about strength you can carry spare lower control arms for a lot less than the price of the lift kits out there. Stock ones are fairly short and cost about $120. The drop brackets on this truck look to be about the same height as the rear LCA mounts. I think they’re fine. The caster is correct via the drop brackets so there is no need use adjustable threaded control arms that will eventually develop cancer and fail. Post-lift, pre-alignment, toe in was out less than a percent.

Jeep should be commended for making these trucks capable of running 37s without the extensive modifications the TJs and even JKs required. It’s left the aftermarket industry trying to justify $2500 - $5000 lift kits. I think for 37” tires and under this lift or ones like it is basically all you need including rocks. 37s are the new 35s and everyone’s eyeballing 40s or 42s.

If and when I go to 40s, along with Dynatrac axles, I will consider going aftermarket long arm suspension and then maybe go hog wild. Or maybe for that much money just buy a used buggy and tow it behind the Gladiator. For 37s and 35s I don’t think you’re going to reap any major benefits with a more complex lift and you will certainly have more problems with it.

Hype and nonsense has created the impression that the AEV lift in particular, isn’t really good for rock crawling, which goes hand in hand with the idea that you need to spend a lot more money and modify your vehicle a lot more. How convenient. For what a long wheelbase vehicle like this can actually get over on less than 40s, this is more than adequate.

I spent the last weekend on trails having less issues and navigating obstacles with less drama than other vehicles with bigger tires and more and more complex lifts. I never wanted for articulation going over the rocks and stair steps. For 95% of the off roading for
37s and less, this is all the lift you need. I’m going to take the money I saved not spending $2k more to get the same or even less lift and spend it on a diesel compatible full underbody skid from Next Venture Motorsports. I think that’s a much more useful investment than adjustable short arms or King coil-overs that will just rust out. I may spray paint my stock control arms gold so I can be cool.

I do think there are some characteristics and some minor issues with this lift and one of them actually addresses the articulation claim. This suspension is stiff. With a winch, winch bumper and Diamondback cover and a bed full of gear it’s still stiff. That’s great for overlanding. It means that a fully laden vehicle is still is well within the performance sweet spot of the suspension on and off road. It also means that it’s not as plush over obstacles especially when it’s minimally loaded. On the big rocks this didn’t translate to harshness. It crawled over big stuff fine. On washboard and cobble fire roads you will notice it. Maybe adjustable shocks would help that or you could just air down.

The second thing, and I think this is a legit gripe about this lift, is that the truck needs a longer front track bar. The stock track bar not only becomes a limiting factor for articulation but off road, drag link and track bar alignment becomes an issue and you begin to feel some minor bump steer. With more axle droop you also feel more driver side pulling than I’d like. This is to be expected with solid axle suspension but I think it’s excessive with this lift. In other words the off-center axle, some people have noticed looking at the truck in a driveway becomes more pronounced off road and it feeling like it pulls excessively. On road it’s very minimal which may be why AEV says an aftermarket track bar is unneeded.

I’ll let others debate whether AEV should have included an adjustable front track bar, but I’ll be giving Synergy some more money for a new drag link, track bar and track bar relocation bracket soon. Their steering box brace didn’t fit on the Eco-Diesel because of the frame reinforcements but they are working on an update to that.

I’ll also probably replace then rear sway bar. At the time, the Hellwig rear swaybar seemed like an unnecessary upsell, but after driving it off road I think it will help settle the rear end a little. It does feel weird going disconnect on the front and stiffer in the rear but pickups are different animals than wranglers and with gear in the back, I’d like to tame some side to side rocking.

I had no problems with the install. I used a calibrated impact wrench for the front LCA bolts that I know goes to 200 ft/lbs. I also didn’t torque the u-bolt on the rear axle. Based on the geometry of the bracket, bolt and nuts I tightened it to what felt reasonable. The install was otherwise uneventful beyond having to modify the OBDII port for the ProCal being goofy and it not working with the Uconnect with out several ignition cycles.

I chalked my tires and settled on 28 PSI cold. I may lower that a bit to closer to 28 warm in a few weeks. This last weekend I averaged 23 MPG by the computer running 76 MPH from the mountains back to the coast. That’s pretty good for a truck on 37inch mud tires and is covered in filth. I do notice a significant drop from the 30MPG I was getting above 62 MPH. Friction and wind resistance will eventually win out even against the diesel. I am seriously considering the GDE tune. I’m hoping it will improve engine braking off road and maybe bump the mileage back up a few points. I don’t like the off road cruise control and there seems to be no engine braking when I hold it in a lower gear. I have no complaints on power with the 37s and 3.73s and don’t feel the need to regear


Those are Borah beadlocks. I’ve written my view on those in another post

Those are adjustable nitrite-coated, flex joint short arm reindeer antlers.

 

[21WhiteRubi]

Just finished up installing my AEV 2.5" DualSport on my 21 Rubicon Gas model last night. Fairly straightforward on the install, but the torque on all the lower control arms was not so fun. The most I could get out of the front LCAs was 150 ft lbs and maybe a little more. Any thoughts or ideas on how to get those to 190 ft lbs? I have a 300 ft lb impact, but I am wary to just run them down tight with that. Also, I am running the front correction brackets, and I did not see a torque value specifically for those mounting bolts. I assumed from what I could gather, they have the same torque value as the stock values (80 upper, 190 lower)?

I agree that I also did not torque down the rear track bar relocation bracket U bolt. I can only get to the one side with an open end wrench. I just snugged them up tight and called it good.

I installed a steer smarts front track bar and will be adjusting that today. I am about 1 1/4" out with the stock track bar length on the new track bar.

I also installed the steering stabilizer from AEV as well. I feel that the steering is a decent bit stiffer, but I don't think return to center is as good as it was. I installed this a few days before the lift on the stock setup and feel the return to center was not as good as the stock stabilizer. Anyone else experience the same?

Had a chance to drive it just a little last night and was happy with the ride quality. Interested to see how it does on the highway.

I am running the AEV borahs designed for the JT in galaxy black with 315/70/17 BFG Mud Terrains. Will post some pictures in a bit now that it is light out. Think I finished everything up last night around 10:30 pm. I am tired of crawling around on the concrete floor, lol.

 

[CerOf]

Just finished up installing my AEV 2.5" DualSport on my 21 Rubicon Gas model last night. Fairly straightforward on the install, but the torque on all the lower control arms was not so fun. The most I could get out of the front LCAs was 150 ft lbs and maybe a little more. Any thoughts or ideas on how to get those to 190 ft lbs? I have a 300 ft lb impact, but I am wary to just run them down tight with that. Also, I am running the front correction brackets, and I did not see a torque value specifically for those mounting bolts. I assumed from what I could gather, they have the same torque value as the stock values (80 upper, 190 lower)?

I agree that I also did not torque down the rear track bar relocation bracket U bolt. I can only get to the one side with an open end wrench. I just snugged them up tight and called it good.

I installed a steer smarts front track bar and will be adjusting that today. I am about 1 1/4" out with the stock track bar length on the new track bar.

I also installed the steering stabilizer from AEV as well. I feel that the steering is a decent bit stiffer, but I don't think return to center is as good as it was. I installed this a few days before the lift on the stock setup and feel the return to center was not as good as the stock stabilizer. Anyone else experience the same?

Had a chance to drive it just a little last night and was happy with the ride quality. Interested to see how it does on the highway.

I am running the AEV borahs designed for the JT in galaxy black with 315/70/17 BFG Mud Terrains. Will post some pictures in a bit now that it is light out. Think I finished everything up last night around 10:30 pm. I am tired of crawling around on the concrete floor, lol.

Go buy a metal fence post that slips over your torque wrenches handle

cut it down to ~3’
Use that.

Or, eat a lot of cheeseburgers like me, grow to about 6’3” and 270lbs, then let your body weight help your muscles do the trick. :D

 

[21WhiteRubi]

Also, when I did the rear springs, I did remove the rear calipers via the two bolts that bolt to the hub flange. I have looked online, but can't seem to find a torque value for those two bolts. The closest thing I have found is one for the JL called the Brake Capital Adapter Bracket bolt (74 ft lbs). I am hesitant to torque these down to this value without knowing that it is the one I need. I am not sure if the JT and JL share the same rear braking system etc. I snugged them down to the "that shouldn't back out" torque, but does anyone have a real spec for these?

 

[Rubiman]

I got mine installed in December. First impression is that the lift and 37s redeems the truck. It’s as straight forward as that.

There’s a video of Dave Harriton from AEV at SEMA a few years ago talking about how awful the stock gladiator suspension is. I can attest to that. My Eco-Diesel routinely bottomed out its suspension on the road! While waiting for tires, I installed a bumper and winch. The added weight actually seemed to suppress the hobby horse motion a little bit but of course exacerbated the bottoming out. From the day I bought the truck I always thought that the handling was sketchy. I’ve owned 5 Jeeps and this one shocked me at how bad its road manners were. Keeping it in a lane where they’re doing road construction and avoiding the Jersey wall was nerve racking. Off road it bounced all over the place and I was constantly smashing into things underneath on trails that 25 years ago my Nissan D21 had no problems with. That’s sad.

I’ll put it this way, my father has a visceral hatred of modified vehicles. He and I drove up to Overland Expo East and within about 20 miles on the interstate he declared that I needed to go ahead and install this lift to fix the truck regardless of when I could find tires because he could tell it was awful from the passenger seat.

Upon completing the lift install, I basically have a totally different vehicle. On road the truck is actually enjoyable to drive on curvy back country roads, damn near sporty. It stays in its lane on the interstate. It’s no longer sketchy or scary. It’s smoother and it’s actually quieter. I went from the stock Falken 33 m/ts to 37 BFG KM3s. I think they ride better and are quieter. Having Sound Assassin floor liners is a plus too with the M/T tires.

Off road, it drives much better, articulates better and reacts to off camber and uneven terrain better. It no longer does the hobby horse wobble after every bump. Wash board fire roads are definitely rougher.

My personal view, having owned a TJ with a 5.5 inch long arm suspension system to accommodate 35s, is that this is superior. You can only achieve correct geometry with long arm suspension or drop brackets. With all due respect, short arm suspension systems are often a downgrade from stock as they don’t correct geometry enough, and they are often inferior quality to the stock control arms. I had two LCAs from a major well known manufacturer on my TJ fail. They refused to warranty them for no stated reason. Plastic on metal or metal on metal heim joints transmit shock loads to your vehicle that damage the frame, axles and other components and they require routine maintenance or they will fail, often on the trail. I never took replacement joints with my TJ. After a few years I went to rebuild them and realized that they had all disintegrated despite routine greasing. That Jeep had one of the most popular lifts at the time and it was a constant nightmare.

Rubberized joints that are now becoming popular are an improvement but the idea that there’s something inherently wrong with the stock control arms and that they need to be replaced with aftermarket ones of similar length is mostly marketing bs. If you’re worried about strength you can carry spare lower control arms for a lot less than the price of the lift kits out there. Stock ones are fairly short and cost about $120. The drop brackets on this truck look to be about the same height as the rear LCA mounts. I think they’re fine. The caster is correct via the drop brackets so there is no need use adjustable threaded control arms that will eventually develop cancer and fail. Post-lift, pre-alignment, toe in was out less than a percent.

Jeep should be commended for making these trucks capable of running 37s without the extensive modifications the TJs and even JKs required. It’s left the aftermarket industry trying to justify $2500 - $5000 lift kits. I think for 37” tires and under this lift or ones like it is basically all you need including rocks. 37s are the new 35s and everyone’s eyeballing 40s or 42s.

If and when I go to 40s, along with Dynatrac axles, I will consider going aftermarket long arm suspension and then maybe go hog wild. Or maybe for that much money just buy a used buggy and tow it behind the Gladiator. For 37s and 35s I don’t think you’re going to reap any major benefits with a more complex lift and you will certainly have more problems with it.

Hype and nonsense has created the impression that the AEV lift in particular, isn’t really good for rock crawling, which goes hand in hand with the idea that you need to spend a lot more money and modify your vehicle a lot more. How convenient. For what a long wheelbase vehicle like this can actually get over on less than 40s, this is more than adequate.

I spent the last weekend on trails having less issues and navigating obstacles with less drama than other vehicles with bigger tires and more and more complex lifts. I never wanted for articulation going over the rocks and stair steps. For 95% of the off roading for
37s and less, this is all the lift you need. I’m going to take the money I saved not spending $2k more to get the same or even less lift and spend it on a diesel compatible full underbody skid from Next Venture Motorsports. I think that’s a much more useful investment than adjustable short arms or King coil-overs that will just rust out. I may spray paint my stock control arms gold so I can be cool.

I do think there are some characteristics and some minor issues with this lift and one of them actually addresses the articulation claim. This suspension is stiff. With a winch, winch bumper and Diamondback cover and a bed full of gear it’s still stiff. That’s great for overlanding. It means that a fully laden vehicle is still is well within the performance sweet spot of the suspension on and off road. It also means that it’s not as plush over obstacles especially when it’s minimally loaded. On the big rocks this didn’t translate to harshness. It crawled over big stuff fine. On washboard and cobble fire roads you will notice it. Maybe adjustable shocks would help that or you could just air down.

The second thing, and I think this is a legit gripe about this lift, is that the truck needs a longer front track bar. The stock track bar not only becomes a limiting factor for articulation but off road, drag link and track bar alignment becomes an issue and you begin to feel some minor bump steer. With more axle droop you also feel more driver side pulling than I’d like. This is to be expected with solid axle suspension but I think it’s excessive with this lift. In other words the off-center axle, some people have noticed looking at the truck in a driveway becomes more pronounced off road and it feeling like it pulls excessively. On road it’s very minimal which may be why AEV says an aftermarket track bar is unneeded.

I’ll let others debate whether AEV should have included an adjustable front track bar, but I’ll be giving Synergy some more money for a new drag link, track bar and track bar relocation bracket soon. Their steering box brace didn’t fit on the Eco-Diesel because of the frame reinforcements but they are working on an update to that.

I’ll also probably replace then rear sway bar. At the time, the Hellwig rear swaybar seemed like an unnecessary upsell, but after driving it off road I think it will help settle the rear end a little. It does feel weird going disconnect on the front and stiffer in the rear but pickups are different animals than wranglers and with gear in the back, I’d like to tame some side to side rocking.

I had no problems with the install. I used a calibrated impact wrench for the front LCA bolts that I know goes to 200 ft/lbs. I also didn’t torque the u-bolt on the rear axle. Based on the geometry of the bracket, bolt and nuts I tightened it to what felt reasonable. The install was otherwise uneventful beyond having to modify the OBDII port for the ProCal being goofy and it not working with the Uconnect with out several ignition cycles.

I chalked my tires and settled on 28 PSI cold. I may lower that a bit to closer to 28 warm in a few weeks. This last weekend I averaged 23 MPG by the computer running 76 MPH from the mountains back to the coast. That’s pretty good for a truck on 37inch mud tires and is covered in filth. I do notice a significant drop from the 30MPG I was getting above 62 MPH. Friction and wind resistance will eventually win out even against the diesel. I am seriously considering the GDE tune. I’m hoping it will improve engine braking off road and maybe bump the mileage back up a few points. I don’t like the off road cruise control and there seems to be no engine braking when I hold it in a lower gear. I have no complaints on power with the 37s and 3.73s and don’t feel the need to regear


Those are Borah beadlocks. I’ve written my view on those in another post

Those are adjustable nitrite-coated, flex joint short arm reindeer antlers.

Awesome, Jeep.

 

[Wolf Island Diver]

Awesome, Jeep.

Thank you ?. I’ve got a lot more mods I’m doing. I’m probably going to post some write ups.

 

[Rubiman]

KM3's on the way. Your rig was the deciding factor. I had many options, but that was an easy decision at $337 per tire!

 

[Wolf Island Diver]

KM3's on the way. Your rig was the deciding factor. I had many options, but that was an easy decision at $337 per tire!

Rotate them every 3000 miles. Mine seemed to start singing right after 3000. I love them. They’re pretty quietly, great off road. My beadlocks with these tires balanced with less weight than the stock wheels and tires.

 

[Rubiman]

Rotate them every 3000 miles. Mine seemed to start singing right after 3000. I love them. They’re pretty quietly, great off road. My beadlocks with these tires balanced with less weight than the stock wheels and tires.

What pressure are you running?

 

[Wolf Island Diver]

with 37s, I ran 28 psi cold. I chalk tested them and they seemed good. TPMS says 29-30 depending on speed/heat. I actually need to chalk test them again. 28-29 is a good start

 

[Rubiman]

with 37s, I ran 28 psi cold. I chalk tested them and they seemed good. TPMS says 29-30 depending on speed/heat. I actually need to chalk test them again. 28-29 is a good start

Great. Will post a pic after installation.

 

[IzzyO]

KM3's on the way. Your rig was the deciding factor. I had many options, but that was an easy decision at $337 per tire!

$337 per tire.. what a deal compared to today's prices.

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