2022 model year M/T issues (clutch burnout smell and stall)

[DrJeep]

Hey 2022 M/T owners!

Upon delivery of my Gladiator, I stalled the truck the very first time. Driving manuals for almost a decade gave me the impression something is not quite right. Made it home, and in 2H, and once I wanted to climb my driveway (which is about 15 degrees slope), stalled again. Gave it more gas and finally made it, however, the clutch burnout smell was so significant that could not be ignored. I immediately emailed my salesman and put it in writing that something is wrong with the clutch. Note that I disabled the "hill assist" option to not activate the breaks on slopes.

After driving about 500 miles (mostly highway) in two weeks, the clutch in uphill conditions was consistent to either stall or barely climb with burnout smell. Finally got an appointment with the dealership, and the senior technician took the truck to a decent slope and wanted to climb in the second gear. I told him: not a chance. He stalled the truck 20 times and finally made it with revving up to 5-6000 RPM. The whole service department could smell the burnout. They took the truck in for further evaluation.

The truck has been with them for two days, and today they called and kind of tried to blame it on 35" tires, but I am glad I put it in writing on the first day (with stock tires) that clutch smells in any uphill condition or when you ride it a bit to accelerate fast upon start. We will see what they say next.

If you are having the same issues, please share your experience here. It's either I got a defective transmission (which is great after you spent $55K) or a recall will be announced soon for all MY22 M/T. @JeepCares

-Dr. Jeep

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[NachoRuby]

Fellow MT driver here. It's not the tires. I'm on 35's too (calibrated by the dealership with no issues) with the MT, and so are many others. I've done some very steep climbs offroad without that smell. I'm sure yours is defective, because there were no changes for '22. Hopefully they get you fixed up quick. It does it in first gear too? I saw you post about 2nd gear, but was a little confused about why they'd try to start in second gear on a hill and expect it not to stall.

Hopefully you get some other real MT owners here to share some experience. But sounds like something's wrong if it's stalling going up hills. Does it feel like the parking brake is locked or something?

I'm certain it is definitely not the tires.
Hopefully you get someone who can get passed the tires and find out what's really wrong. Regardless, if they smoked your clutch up at 5-6000 RPM, they at least owe you a clutch.
Ps: On most vehicles I've bought, I disable the hill assist too, because it doesn't work well. But on the jeep, it works perfectly every single time.

Also, it's not the tires!

 

[DrJeep]

Fellow MT driver here. It's not the tires. I'm on 35's too (calibrated by the dealership with no issues) with the MT, and so are many others. I'm sure yours is defective, because there were no changes for '22. Hopefully they get you fixed up quick. It does it in first gear too? I saw you post about 2nd gear, but was a little confused about why they'd try to start in second gear on a hill and expect it not to stall.

Hopefully you get some other real MT owners here to share some experience. But sounds like something's wrong if it's stalling going up hills. Does it feel like the parking brake is locked or something?

I'm certain it is definitely not the tires.
Hopefully you get someone who can get passed the tires and find out what's really wrong. Regardless, if they smoked your clutch up at 5-6000 RPM, they at least owe you a clutch.
Ps: On most vehicles I've bought, I disable the hill assist too, because it doesn't work well. But on the jeep, it works perfectly every single time.

Also, it's not the tires!

Thanks for your message. Of course, it does smell in the first gear if you pish it hard or alternatively stalls if not fighting it hard with more throttle input, but the technician was only testing the 2nd gear climb believing it should be able to climb even in the 2nd gear and riding the clutch. He literally stalled the car 20 times. He was apparently the senior master of M/T repairs in the shop.

Yes, I agree that it is obviously not related to tires size or software update, and it is a clutch issue. The clutch does not have a middle point, it either bites hard and stalls quickly or keeps slipping (if you give it extra gas) and causes the burnout smell.

Let's keep in mind, if you drive it super gently and do not try to start on hills, you may never notice that the clutch is faulty.

 

[NachoRuby]

but the technician was only testing the 2nd gear climb believing it should be able to climb even in the 2nd gear and riding the clutch. He literally stalled the car 20 times. He was apparently the senior master of M/T repairs in the shop.

That was not a good idea. These barely even start in 2nd gear unless you're already rolling (and that's even with the 4.1 final drive on my Rubicon). It definitely won't start in second going uphill in 2H. If your clutch wasn't bad before, it is now, after 20 uphill clutch riding second gear starts. Wow. They owe you a clutch my friend. I can't believe they smoked your clutch to 5000-6000 rpm (especially in front of you).

 

[JTDay]

Fellow 2022 MT'er here. Have been driving manuals since 15y/o (now 31) including lightweight flywheels, unsprung racing clutches, clutches from the 1950s, 3 on the trees, etc. The stinky clutch smell on a new clutch is normal and should go away after a few hundred miles of stop and go but I will say the clutch in the JT is funky. I've stalled probably 7 or 8 times in 1st already 800 miles on the odo. I don't think I stalled that many times in 12 years in my previous manual vehicle. I have a moderately inclined driveway and if I'm not going fast enough, I can feel the truck getting close to wanting to stall out. There are several threads on this and the JL forum about pedal modulation in 1st and how these things just suck. All my other vehicles, I'd just let off the clutch, push the gas, and start moving from 700rpms or whatever regardless of incline. In the JT, if I'm on a hill, it requires 1500rpms and slipping the clutch to get moving. I don't regret getting the manual but it's probably the 1st manual I've ever had that I believe I'm not going to get the clutch to last more than 100k miles in which case, I'll be happy to upgrade to something like the centerforce.

If this is the same as your experience, sounds like you got a normal JT. If you're driving along and get to a hill and your JT just stalls out, or if you are pushing the gas in gear revving at 4000rpm with the clutch pedal all the way OUT and the truck is just going nowhere, that would indicate a problem.

 

[blau iii]

a tad over 10k miles here with 35's, no issues with clutch smell. If you're a seasoned 3 pedal pilot, I'd suggest turning off the hill hold. This clutch is one of the most bizarre that I've driven. It's not a hard clutch but the feel is really different than any other.

 

[NachoRuby]

Fellow 2022 MT'er here. Have been driving manuals since 15y/o (now 31) including lightweight flywheels, unsprung racing clutches, clutches from the 1950s, 3 on the trees, etc. The stinky clutch smell on a new clutch is normal and should go away after a few hundred miles of stop and go but I will say the clutch in the JT is funky. I've stalled probably 7 or 8 times in 1st already 800 miles on the odo. I don't think I stalled that many times in 12 years in my previous manual vehicle. I have a moderately inclined driveway and if I'm not going fast enough, I can feel the truck getting close to wanting to stall out. There are several threads on this and the JL forum about pedal modulation in 1st and how these things just suck. All my other vehicles, I'd just let off the clutch, push the gas, and start moving from 700rpms or whatever regardless of incline. In the JT, if I'm on a hill, it requires 1500rpms and slipping the clutch to get moving. I don't regret getting the manual but it's probably the 1st manual I've ever had that I believe I'm not going to get the clutch to last more than 100k miles in which case, I'll be happy to upgrade to something like the centerforce.

If this is the same as your experience, sounds like you got a normal JT. If you're driving along and get to a hill and your JT just stalls out, or if you are pushing the gas in gear revving at 4000rpm with the clutch pedal all the way OUT and the truck is just going nowhere, that would indicate a problem.

I'm more concerned about the dealership doing 20 consecutive uphill starts at 5-6k RPM in 2nd gear on the thing. That's straight up dumb. Anyone who's ever owned a manual knows not to do that. I don't have the stall problem many seem to have, so I'm wondering if the 4.1 Rubicon gearing really makes that big of a difference. I've probably stalled maybe twice? Since I got the JT, and zero times in the last several months. I'm at 17k now. But I probably just jinxed myself.

I find the clutch to be softer than most I've owned, but not difficult to drive. I'm about the same age as you (32), and I've never owned an automatic, or really even driven them other than rentals.

I think the feel is due to it being twin disk and dual mass flywheel. But it's also soft compared to others I've driven.

 

[JTDay]

Yeah I have the 3.73 gears so maybe? And I agree, I think it has something to do with the twin-disk clutch design.

IIRC, following the whole manual overheating fiasco, the service procedure to see if the clutch needed to be replaced was to put the trans in 2nd gear and dump the clutch. If it stalled immediately, clutch was good, if the engine ran for a moment, clutch needed replacement. They may have been trying to perform a modified version of this?

I'll say my last vehicle was a 4cyl turbo with around 400 wheel torque and I burnt the stock clutch (at around 150k miles on it) badly once trying to see how fast I could get the wheel speed by doing a rolling burnout on a wet road. Well I got to about 130mph on the speedo (probably only doing 45mph actual speed), shifted to 5th - went WOT, and the clutch decided it had enough and stopped propelling the car forward despite RPMs near redline. The clutch stunk for about 24 hours but held the 400tq just fine after that until I sold it around 180k miles.

I'm with you guys on the sentiment regarding the dealer test. I've had one dealer visit in my 15 years of driving. Can't stand them but at least for the OP, he has a paper trail now if anything goes awry. Its mind-blowing how often people have to take their car to "a different dealer" because dealer #1 or #2 was totally worthless i.e. blaming this issue on his 35s .

 

[JeepCares]

Hey 2022 M/T owners!

Upon delivery of my Gladiator, I stalled the truck the very first time. Driving manuals for almost a decade gave me the impression something is not quite right. Made it home, and in 2H, and once I wanted to climb my driveway (which is about 15 degrees slope), stalled again. Gave it more gas and finally made it, however, the clutch burnout smell was so significant that could not be ignored. I immediately emailed my salesman and put it in writing that something is wrong with the clutch. Note that I disabled the "hill assist" option to not activate the breaks on slopes.

After driving about 500 miles (mostly highway) in two weeks, the clutch in uphill conditions was consistent to either stall or barely climb with burnout smell. Finally got an appointment with the dealership, and the senior technician took the truck to a decent slope and wanted to climb in the second gear. I told him: not a chance. He stalled the truck 20 times and finally made it with revving up to 5-6000 RPM. The whole service department could smell the burnout. They took the truck in for further evaluation.

The truck has been with them for two days, and today they called and kind of tried to blame it on 35" tires, but I am glad I put it in writing on the first day (with stock tires) that clutch smells in any uphill condition or when you ride it a bit to accelerate fast upon start. We will see what they say next.

If you are having the same issues, please share your experience here. It's either I got a defective transmission (which is great after you spent $55K) or a recall will be announced soon for all MY22 M/T. @JeepCares

-Dr. Jeep

Thanks for the tag here. If you need assistance while your Jeep is with a dealer for repairs or to discuss further, send us a private message.

Kate
Jeep Cares

 

[NachoRuby]

Thanks for all of your comments. IMHO and as a doctor of mechanical engineering with a decade of +200,000 miles of M/T driving - in general - I, too, believe that the clutch design is very poor and not adquate for an offroad truck that is supposed to tow +4000 lbs! You think you bought a mountain goat, but it can't even climb to your driveway in 2H.

For 22MY M/T fellows who believe their clutch is in perfect working condition, you could do this test:

Go to a hill that is 15-20 degrees (+27% grade) and make a full stop. Have your hill assist off, and climb in the first gear in 2H mode. If you could not climb without a burnout smell, welcome to my club. Even a 2WD 1995 Kia, 1.6 L should be able to do that.

I do this pretty much every day (have to climb a mountain from a stop sign on the way to work). No burning clutch smell, at all. I also off-road it with some climbs, and no issues. I've done one badge trail so far, and a few other trails that were harder than the badge trail. I don't hardcore offroad, but I have left the pavement often enough to have put the jeep through its paces. I agree the clutch is soft. It's definitely the weak point in the design. But it's not that bad. It's sounds like something is seriously wrong with yours. I've legitimately never had any concerns with mine, other than the soft pedal feel. If/when mine starts to slip, I'll give south bend or centerforce my money, though.

 

[redriderjf87]

From the sound of it your clutch was messed up from the beginning, but I'd consider the technician finishing it off as a blessing in disguise. There should be no problem getting you a new clutch for free at least.

I agree with others generally though, even when working correctly it's a little bit of an acquired taste. Nothing that a Centerforce can't fix later.

 

[OHJeeper]

I also have a MY22 6MT and I have 37" tires. My driveway is roughly 11° and I can run it with no issues. On flat ground I can also get moving with zero throttle input and just releasing the clutch (slowly!). I did this all the time in my JL with 33's and was surprised I could still do it with the 37's in my JT... same in reverse unless I'm on a hill.

Agree with others that a burning smell on delivery is common, but mine went away pretty quickly. Sounds like you have a bad clutch, not sure it's a wholesale recall situation.

I did have leaking ATF from my transfer case and they had to replace a few seals, so I chalked it up to being one of the few unlucky ones. When you make this many vehicles, you're bound to have a few issues.

When my warranty is over, I will be switching to the Centerforce clutch, though!

 

[NachoRuby]

When my warranty is over, I will be switching to the Centerforce clutch, though!

Centerforce is I'm sure great, but I'm really excited about the South Bend setup, only because I ran a south bend in my WRX STi and in my VW GLI, each with 400+ ft lbs of torque, and each held great. I love their stuff. I'm also a cheap b*stard though, so I'm going to wait until/if the stock one starts slipping before I change anything.

 

[MyJeepShawn]

MY22 w/6MT here and no problems tackling the hill at the bottom of my driveway. HOWEVER…. Backing up, up a hill, that’s a different story. I’ve been driving MT vehicles for 22 years and this is the first one I stall just about every other time. For what it’s worth, I’m still on stock sport tires.

 

[NachoRuby]

MY22 w/6MT here and no problems tackling the hill at the bottom of my driveway. HOWEVER…. Backing up, up a hill, that’s a different story. I’ve been driving MT vehicles for 22 years and this is the first one I stall just about every other time. For what it’s worth, I’m still on stock sport tires.

I will never understand why they gear reverse the way they do now on modern manuals (all makes). They are so high. I had the same complaint in my Jeep compass and in my VW. The Subarus I've owned still seem to be geared fine in reverse. Anyway, this is one area where the Mojave/Rubicon 4.1 FD gearing definitely helps. It's still a little tall in reverse, but not awful, and definitely doable. Off-road in reverse, the jeep is great, as long as you use the low range for low speed reverse, especially up hill.

I'll drop into low range for a second even on-road if I'm parked somewhere on an EXTREMELY steep hill and need to go backwards uphill to get out. That's something I obviously couldn't do on the compass or the VW, so I'm glad I have that option.

I met a guy with a YJ that had a 2-wheel drive low option on the transfer case (not sure if it was stock). I wish we had that on ours.

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