Aux Battery Charging?

[ShadowsPapa]

My observations. The aux battery is undersized IMO. It is expected to augment ESS running accessories. It has low reserve capacity so it takes a beating. It’s a motorcycle battery. When you take a battery and cycle it hard, and fast charge it, it won’t last long. It’s small lol. This is why I think we’re seeing early failures. I think the best thing is to disable ESS and if your Jeep sits long periods, keep a battery tender on it so the aux battery isn’t expected to recover from a mostly discharged state. Treat your Jeep like a motorcycle

These aren't your grandfathers basic batteries, though........... they'll handle a lot more than the battery that came in your 1995 Chevy truck ever would. That's one reason you see charging voltages upwards of 14.7 volts - enough to ruin standard batteries after a couple of years of that.
(standard batteries charge at 13.7-14.2 and more will not help them live a long life)

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[rubiusgladius]

I’m talking maintaining on a 1 to 2 amp smart charge. My last 14AH Yuasa battery went 8 years on a battery tender. That’s what I have as a backup. Whether AGM batteries are “better” than LA wet batteries remains an argument. If it was prepped right, quality of materials, etc. and climate. In our trucks, it’s like Davy and Goliath. They run in unison and have you ever taken out the aux battery? It’s not top shelf. I’m sure AGM battery technology is better in a good well thought application. Inn this instance, having it buried near the exhaust manifold, undersized and hell to get to is a poor design. For us anyway. They should have used a larger battery, easier access and allowed for a manual bypass of the PCR for emergencies. ESS is garbage

 

[rubiusgladius]

Not to mention the extents they had to go through with internal engine coatings to allow for excessive stop starts to meet their 150,000 mile engine longevity target. Toyota trucks don’t have stop start. I’m sure the guy who said, “hey let’s save .07% on cafe” with this trouble ridden system ESS. May not be popular. I’d rather pay more for the truck and not have it than deal with it

 

[Capricorn]

My Stop/Start is not activating since summer started with A/C on. I don't see battery charging but I get "cabin cooling/heating". And no, it is not on Max A/C.

 

[Delhux]

Well, I’m making a final attempt at dealer service on Monday. I think I’ll just ask to speak with the service manager before I let anyone near the truck.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Mine has been working perfectly since winter ended and as usual, I can still control whether or not it stops with the pressure or how I apply the brake pedal.

Jeep is far far from the only company to use ESS systems, but they seem to be the company with battery issues.

Like I've said before - some areas have laws and ordinances about idling and it's just going to get worse so expect more companies to put this on more models. I have a large PDF file of all of the places that have laws or rules about idling, the vehicles that are covered and other specifics. Not too bad now - but it will be. This ain't 100% about CAFE.

 

[yoda13]

It would be interesting to see the PDF about idling. I have never heard of that, outside of my time in Europe, but I do live in Texas…

 

[Trollboogie]

I got this message on wife's JL. It was the main battery. Jeep replaced it under warranty.

 

[Dqban]

I got this message on wife's JL. It was the main battery. Jeep replaced it under warranty.

did they check the smaller battery? Because of the way the car charges the batteries, a bad small battery will eventually damage the main one. Replacing the main one alone if the ESS battery is not working will eventually lead to the same issue.

 

[Trollboogie]

I think they did. I was shocked that it was the main battery and not the small one. So was my service guy too.

 

[Dan in Pasadena]

Wait....there's an auxiliary battery in my new-to-me Rubicon?

 

[Mr._Bill]

Wait....there's an auxiliary battery in my new-to-me Rubicon?

Yes, it's buried under the Fuse box. It keeps the voltage stable for all the computers during an ESS event.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Most locations have exemptions for "traffic conditions" and/or "traffic controls" meaning stop lights, or traffic jams. Some have no exemptions.


Missouri, St. Louis County
Max Idling Time: 3 consecutive minutes. Fines: Maximum $1,000 and/or 1 year imprisonment (612.390)
Exemptions: - Operating a loading, unloading, or processing device- Emergency vehicles


New York City
Max Idling Time: 3 minutes (1-minute if adjacent to a public school)Fines: Not <$50 nor >$500 and/or imprisonment for 20 days - 1st; Not<$100 nor >$1,000 and/or imprisonment for not >30 days - 2nd offense;Not <$400 nor >$5,000 and/or imprisonment for not >4 months -3rd & subsequent offenses. (NYCAC24-190(g))
Exemptions: - Emergency vehicles- Operate loading, unloading or processing device, Phone: (212) 639-9675


Pennsylvania, City of Philadelphia
Max Idling Time: 2 minutes or 0 minutes for layovers (5 minutes if less than 32 degrees F) (20 minutes if less than 20 degrees F). Fine: $300
Exemptions: None, Phone: (215) 685-7578


California, City of Sacramento
Max Idling Time: 5 minutes (prohibits refrigeration unit operation within 100' of residential or school unless loading/unloading). Fines: Not <$100 nor >$25,000 per violation(Title 1, Ch. 1.28.010)
Exemptions: - Traffic conditions/control- Traffic conditions- Vehicle safety inspection- Service or repair- Conform to manufacturer's specifications- Power takeoffs involving cargo or work functions- Prevent safety or health emergency- Hours of service compliance @ truck/rest stop- To recharge hybrid electric vehicles- California low-NOx idling label, Phone: (916) 264-5011

The thing is that many places have exceptions for traffic conditions and traffic controls - for now, but those are going to disappear as vehicle technology improves and car that have no ESS disappear through attrition.

 

[Blade1668]

These aren't your grandfathers basic batteries, though........... they'll handle a lot more than the battery that came in your 1995 Chevy truck ever would. That's one reason you see charging voltages upwards of 14.7 volts - enough to ruin standard batteries after a couple of years of that.
(standard batteries charge at 13.7-14.2 and more will not help them live a long life)

Kinda interesting that you mentioned charging at 14.7 v my LJ has been charging at that rate since I got it in 05... better battery life and headlights too. Not quite a JT thing but otherwise about the only batteries I have bought is AGM batteries. I started with Optima red and blue tops, but have used a few other brands since the move to Mexico in fact I've got a few that are still in use after 20 plus years. Two of them sat in one of my Jeeps un-used for more than 4 years and still working, my XJ sat for over 2 years with out charging and started up.

On the Cascade Solar system I'm one of the "beta testers" aka early adopters of one before the price drop. It's been on my JT for over a year now I've had no problems with the batteries and I'm running a fridge freezer constantly in my JT about 35-39° F or close to 6°c I'm thinking about getting a second model for hooking on hardtop to charge a house battery or something close to it.
I'm not a fan of the ESS for more than a few reasons, maybe not a good ones but my own pre conceived notions extra wear on starter and engine. Does it save me fuel possible when I forget to deactivate it on some of my driving. If I can't time my driving with traffic lights. I've seen a improvement of .1-.2 MPG's depending on traffic some days but normally not.
The ESS battery is about the size of my 4Wheeler battery it's been replaced 3 times in the same time I've had my LJ 16 years. I do try to take care of my stuff and not trade or change with out needing to.

 

[Delhux]

Well, I’m making a final attempt at dealer service on Monday. I think I’ll just ask to speak with the service manager before I let anyone near the truck.

I went in this morning and explained that my ESS system was reporting “not ready - battery charging” from late October through mid-May.

I explained that in that period I made several visits to two dealerships as well as calls to @JeepCares, but no one ever went any further than replacing my battery sensor.

I explained that I went away for a three week trip in early May while the ESS was still reporting “battery charging” and since the dealership technicians told me I need to drive it “more frequently” to maintain the batteries, I fully assumed my truck would not start after sitting for three weeks. I told them, I thought it was a miracle that it unlocked and started, and I was even more shocked that ESS kicked in at the first intersection after less than a minute of driving (after sitting for three weeks and it reporting “battery charging” for nearly six months).

I told them I think the batteries just won’t work properly in “light jacket weather” (around here, late October to mid-May is always below 50-degrees).

I told them that I had already completely given up on any idea that the dealership or @JeepCares would assist, since I spent the better part of six months on the phone and at dealerships, doing their GR8 battery diagnostics and charging via battery tenders. I told them I had already ordered a Cascadia 4x4 solar panel and would be installing it soon. If the system hadn’t just started working, making me believe these batteries just have some sort of ambient temperature issue, I wouldn’t have bothered coming in for another visit.

I told them I really just want my batteries replaced.

The service manager said he couldn’t replace anything without a failure code from GR8.

I asked if he would do a load test, he said that is what their GR8 test always does.

I told him I would not repeat the same tests because I do not expect different results, particularly now that the weather is warm and the ESS system is not reporting “battery charging”.

I asked him how I can just get my batteries replaced.

He said to contact @JeepCares.

I told him I had, and that they are very pleasant people with very pleasant voices and seem to care, but do not seem to be able to simply get my batteries replaced.

I told him I expected @JeepCares to be able to assist with warranty service as I was in a predicament in which I had ongoing symptoms which should be covered by one of my warranties, but did not yield a failure code for the technicians to use; I told him I was surprised to be wrong about that.

I shared with him that I previously had brand confidence in Jeep/FCA, but as this is my first attempt at warranty service on a Jeep/FCA brand vehicle, I no longer have brand confidence that they will support their products or services.

He offered again to check it in for GR8 testing. I told him I would not engage in the loop of wasting my time with tests that can’t determine my batteries won’t work in “light jacket weather”.

I don’t mean to criticize @JeepCares, but they have been given ample opportunity to address my concerns, and have done nothing for my battery issues other than attempt to make me a service visit (but provide no contextual information to the dealership)—my Jeep app can do that. If the dealership needs some sort of code approval to replace parts, I don’t see why Jeep/FCA can’t just issue them some sort of customer service code in my behalf to assist.

Oh well, I’m officially done with hoping FCA would just support the spirit of their warranty and address a warrantable symptom I’ve been experiencing. I really can’t believe how much time I have wasted to get absolutely nowhere. I hope the Cascadia 4x4 solar thing works—if it doesn’t play well with my faulty batteries, that’ll just be more wasted $$$.

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