Clayton 3.5 Kit & 37s... is this normal?

[jwolfejt]

The same exact thing happens in my Gladiator on a 2" BDS lift and stock tires... if you've driven an older solid axle truck they do the same thing (worse even) - it doesn't help that we have ball joints that are internally plastic and tie rods with a bit of play in them straight from the factory.

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[jwoz]

Sorry for the delay on the update. Here's the latest:

1. Brake line is fixed, had to order a new pair. Clayton did send me an extra set free of charge despite them technically being out of warranty from purchase date. (Again really unsure why they broke in the first place...), so big ups to them on standing by their product(s).
2. I chalk tested the tires and ended up airing down to about 26/25psi, which did make an improvement. Technically it seemed like the tread still wasn't wearing completely even but I didn't want to go lower than that because I know some tires aren't supposed to wear that way. The steering shimmy still occured though
3. Finally I adjusted the fox stabilizer a few more clicks and that along with the tire pressure has completely eliminated the problem for me. From what I've read in this thread, and elsewhere its probably not the right thing to do, and maybe it will cause me issues down the road as I'm probably just masking the real issue? But I guess I'll wait and see, and for now I'm more than pleased with the ride and handling.

Again really appreciate all the feedback and advise. I will Update again if I add any parts related to this or if anything changes.

 

[Lunentucker]

I'm a firm believer that longer control arms alone are incapable of fully fixing the negative effects of lifting.
They roll caster angle back into spec, but they do not level the control arms and insure that impacts are directed upwards and into the suspension components designed to mitigate them, instead of rearward and partially into the frame.
Geometry correction brackets are worth their weight in gold.

 

[Clayton Off Road]

??

What are your thoughts on the 2 inch Mopar system? I just priced out a JL Mopar system for my buddy with JKS quicker Disco’s, front and rear Clayton track bars and a taser mini for $2,343.65. While a comparable system for my JTRD is a couple hundred dollars more expensive I don’t need the JKS quick disconnects so they’re pretty close to being even. The Clayton system is $2699 with no shocks or taser, so it’s reasonable to think I’d be 1500 to 1800 over before tires and wheels. Just following along with what’s going on with the economy and how I think things will continue to get worse for the for the foreseeable future, I may just be trying to talk myself out of doing anything.

Our Ride Right kit would probably be a more direct comparison to something like the Mopar kit, as this is our entry-level style and priced kit coming in at $1479 for the 2.5" lift. This kit is basically what we consider to be all of the essential components necessary when lifting the vehicle, (adjustable front upper control arms, adjustable track bars, etc.) and is fully upgradeable to the complete Overland Plus kit if you want to add on as you go!

 

[Clayton Off Road]

Sorry for the delay on the update. Here's the latest:

1. Brake line is fixed, had to order a new pair. Clayton did send me an extra set free of charge despite them technically being out of warranty from purchase date. (Again really unsure why they broke in the first place...), so big ups to them on standing by their product(s).
2. I chalk tested the tires and ended up airing down to about 26/25psi, which did make an improvement. Technically it seemed like the tread still wasn't wearing completely even but I didn't want to go lower than that because I know some tires aren't supposed to wear that way. The steering shimmy still occured though
3. Finally I adjusted the fox stabilizer a few more clicks and that along with the tire pressure has completely eliminated the problem for me. From what I've read in this thread, and elsewhere its probably not the right thing to do, and maybe it will cause me issues down the road as I'm probably just masking the real issue? But I guess I'll wait and see, and for now I'm more than pleased with the ride and handling.

Again really appreciate all the feedback and advise. I will Update again if I add any parts related to this or if anything changes.

Glad we were able to help you out with this! Brake lines are not something we typically ever have any issues with, occasionally if a line had a manufacturing defect there would be some sort of leaking at the time of install, but this is very rare. Sometimes they can leak due to damage from being out on a trail, over stretching, or other wear, but again this really isn't a part you should have any issues with. If you need anything else from us in the future just reach out and we'll do what we can to help!

 

[Wet Willys]

I'm a firm believer that longer control arms alone are incapable of fully fixing the negative effects of lifting.
They roll caster angle back into spec, but they do not level the control arms and insure that impacts are directed upwards and into the suspension components designed to mitigate them, instead of rearward and partially into the frame.
Geometry correction brackets are worth their weight in gold.

I'm thinking of adding some geometry correction brackets to my Clayton 2.5" Overland Plus lift for this exact reason.

 

[ICE4EVER]

Can you add the brackets to the longer control arms or is it best to go back to OEM with the brackets?

 

[Clayton Off Road]

I'm thinking of adding some geometry correction brackets to my Clayton 2.5" Overland Plus lift for this exact reason.

Adjustable control arms are best for actually correcting geometry in terms of caster, pinion, wheelbase, etc. but of course cannot flatten the angles of the arms back to stock specs, which is what correction brackets are great for! For most, adjustable control arms take care of 90% of the problems lifted vehicles face, but if you're looking for just that little bit extra then adding a set of correction brackets to your adjustable arms is never a bad idea!

The main downside to correction brackets is if you take the vehicle off-road at all, or are into more difficult trails then correction brackets will negatively impact your ground clearance due to how low the brackets hang down which get in the way of rocks and other obstacles out on the trail.

Hope this helps!

 

[Clayton Off Road]

Can you add the brackets to the longer control arms or is it best to go back to OEM with the brackets?

They can always be added to after-market short arm kits!

 

[Kristian13]

Sorry for my irritated tone........You gotta understand my point of view to get where I'm coming from. I should probably just step away from the forums if I cant filter the idiocracy of what I read. I've lived this business and hobby for 30+ years when all of this stuff had to be hand built and engineered by the installer.....Not like today where spoiled rich kids stack stuff on that just looks cool, but doesn't play well together.

Sorry the brodozer thing offended, but how else do you describe a super heavy wheel combo that was moved away from the spindle 2.5-3.5"? Its a recipe for disaster except for smooth roads so long as you aren't trying to stop fast......

Ever heard of a load inflation chart? Every manufacturer has one that you can determine the correct tire pressure for the axles weight. You can then dial in to your likes from there. You also have a 9.5" wide wheel, so that width adds additional air volume that would require less pressure too. This will probably be your biggest single improvement and its FREE!

I'm guessing you land at 23-27psi. I personally run 25 front and 24 rear with my unloaded heavier diesel and add more out back as I add weight from towing or motorcycle.

Turn your front shock clickers all the way in and see if it helps. A couple of clicks at a time you won't probably notice if you aren't sensitive to what you are looking for. My rule for adjustment is 3 clicks at a time till it feels like I went too far, then dial it back 1 or 2.

I know this is the internet, so opinions are worth what you pay for them. A person can learn a lot when they just listen to the guys that really know wtf they are doing. Don't take it all for the gospel....trust, but verify.

You have a lot invested here, so it would be nice if you could smile when you are driving your truck.

Back from the grave.. This MF knows what he is talking about.. I like is stubborn old school way.. “Sometimes” we just have to go back to the basics! PO how’s everything year down the the line? Enjoying your truck?

 

[MrClortho]

Hi All,

Not sure if this is just a "Jeep thing" or if I have a bigger problem that should be addressed...

So I've had my gladiator just over a month and the first 200 miles I drove it stock with zero complaints. It didn't feel as smooth as other midsize trucks I test drove, but compared to my lifted Liberty it was a massive improvement in ride quality.

A couple weeks back I had the following installed by a local shop:

• Clayton 3.5 Overland kit
• Fox 2.5 adjustable shocks front and rear (set to the softest setting)
• Mickey Thompson Baja Boss A/T All-Season 37X12.50R17LT (aired at around 29 cold psi)
• BLACK RHINO Arsenal Rim 17X9.5 5X127 Offset -18

The truck looks awesome, and on smooth roads and highway it still drives prretty great, but now whenever I hit any decent size bump in the road im getting quite a bit of feedback in the steering wheel; best described as a shimmying or shaking... video of the described shaking

I've done some reading and research but i'm not sure if this is just a reality of the modifications made? The problem seems similar to this video by [Banned Site] Jeep JL Wrangler Steering Wobble Fix with Rancho Front Track Bar or this post https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/death-wobble.52908/

I know Clayton sells a kit with a steering stabilizer and beefier tie rod and drag link, which I'm currently considering to add as upgrades to address my "problem"... but I don't want to go spending a ton of money on things if it isnt the best solution. I am going to take it back to the shop that installed it in another couple hundred miles for their standard check over of the install not sure if I should mention anything specific? They are a speciality shop, but I don't think they normally do Clayton lifts.

Appreciate any suggestions/perspectives.

A bit of a resurrection here, but maybe it can help. See my sig for my setup and it is very similar to yours. I would not say it was a 'problem' but on a rough road, it was two hands firmly on the steering wheel for sure. On the highway, at 80mph, it took some effort to keep the Jeep inline, which I expected with about 5" of lift and 37s.

Two weeks ago I installed the Apex 2.5 ton steering kit and Fox stabilizer with the power steering booster pump. Talk about a night and day difference in drivability and serious beef. 80 mph with one hand on the steering wheel, parking lots are much easier, backing my trailer and maneuvering is much better and the Jeep is noticeably more stable in all driving situations. Overall, I would stack it against a stock JT"s driveability or better.

 

[Jeep~N~Jay]

I am running the same Clayton combo with 37’s. I did not upgrade my tie rod or drag link, wheeled a JL for 70,000 miles on 37‘s with stock parts and no issues, the issue is most likely something is over inflated under inflated, not torqued correctly, not aligned? I can do 80 mph no problem with mine.

 

[HooliganActual]

I know this an old resurrected thread and I hope the OP has resolved his issues.

The one thing I'd add for others that stumble onto this thread with a similar issue, and I don't believe it was ever mentioned in this thread, is to check the angle of the draglink. When you start getting into those bigger lifts, it can really mess with the steering geometry. And while I know this thread talked about beefier steering components several times, it may be that a draglink flip is in order to bring the draglink back to more parallel with the tie rod.

If the OP @jwoz is still watching this thread, maybe you could post a pic of that angle...

 

[TheTrailGeek]

They can always be added to after-market short arm kits!

Do you have recommended control arm lengths for your 3.5" Overland+ lift kit on the Gladiator Rubicon with the AEV Geometry correction brackets?

 

[Clayton Off Road]

Do you have recommended control arm lengths for your 3.5" Overland+ lift kit on the Gladiator Rubicon with the AEV Geometry correction brackets?

No adjustment lengths with brackets installed, but the main goal is always to keep the wheelbase centered, axles centered, and a caster angle around 5.5-6 degrees!

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