Clayton 3.5 Kit & 37s... is this normal?

[CaptNkllm]

For fun... Center steering wheel.. Rotate Clockwise and count rotations then center and do counter clockwise.. Make sure they are the same. Mine was off one rotation and had issues similar.

Never trust its correct.

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[jwoz]

Did not expect to get so many suggestions and people sharing experiences, again appreciate everyone who took time out of their day to try and help. There's too many posts to respond to everyone individually, so I'll let everyone know where I'm at with this.

I did try and stiffen up the shocks and it just made the shimmying/shaking worse. I'm still considering whether or not to drop the tire pressure a bit more, but based on the conflicting responses here I'm leaning towards leaving them at 28 cold. As for adjusting the castor I did crawl under the truck and debated about messing around with it but being as I'm a bit inexperienced with making adjustments and dont have a tool to measure it I'm not sure I want to try that on my own. My biggest fear would be making it worse than it already is...

(rant on wheels/tires)
I know there's a good amount of people in this thread who seem convinced its just the wheel weight and offset, and I don't dispute that it probably impacts the handling and it probably will wear a bunch of parts out quicker, and maybe if I had went with a lighter wheel with less offset I wouldn't have as much shaking in the steering, but I'm not the first person to run heavy wheels and tires, and even in this thread there are others who have the same lift with less offset and lighter wheels who experienced similar issues. I'd love for anyone saying thats its probably just the wheel weight and offset to come and drive it and feel the steering wheel going over small bumps in the road and say the same thing after.

Look I'm not expecting this to drive like a cadillac, as I mentioned in my original post I had a lifted liberty with big tires and an offset and while it handled and drove like a complete dog, had no turn radius, but the only problem I ever had with it was ripping the drive shaft off. The factory ball joints did just fine for the amount of wheeling and 40k miles I put on it post lift. Was I just lucky? who knows... I'm not expecting to be riding on a cloud; I dont think thats reasonable, but this feeling is even worse than how that drove, the steering wheel shouldnt shake to this degree over bumps in a paved road.
(end of rant)

Regardless next week I'm going to take it back to the shop that put it on. I'm on the fence about asking them to try and fix the problem first leaving all the parts as is to see if its just a case of out of balance tires, something loose, or a bad alignment, or just go straight to changing things. If I had more time to deal with i'd definitely lean towards piecemealing it, but I would like to get this solved relatively soon as it is my daily.

Here's what I've decided to swap out/add to help address the issue.

TeraFlex 1938125 JL/JLU Drop Bracket Kit for 2.5"-4"
RockJock Currectlync Heavy Duty Steering System
Fox 2.0 Factory Series ATS Steering Stabilizer

I'll keep this thread up to date with progress/end results to help anyone else in the future.

 

[Burghardphotography]

Did not expect to get so many suggestions and people sharing experiences, again appreciate everyone who took time out of their day to try and help. There's too many posts to respond to everyone individually, so I'll let everyone know where I'm at with this.

I did try and stiffen up the shocks and it just made the shimmying/shaking worse. I'm still considering whether or not to drop the tire pressure a bit more, but based on the conflicting responses here I'm leaning towards leaving them at 28 cold. As for adjusting the castor I did crawl under the truck and debated about messing around with it but being as I'm a bit inexperienced with making adjustments and dont have a tool to measure it I'm not sure I want to try that on my own. My biggest fear would be making it worse than it already is...

(rant on wheels/tires)
I know there's a good amount of people in this thread who seem convinced its just the wheel weight and offset, and I don't dispute that it probably impacts the handling and it probably will wear a bunch of parts out quicker, and maybe if I had went with a lighter wheel with less offset I wouldn't have as much shaking in the steering, but I'm not the first person to run heavy wheels and tires, and even in this thread there are others who have the same lift with less offset and lighter wheels who experienced similar issues. I'd love for anyone saying thats its probably just the wheel weight and offset to come and drive it and feel the steering wheel going over small bumps in the road and say the same thing after.

Look I'm not expecting this to drive like a cadillac, as I mentioned in my original post I had a lifted liberty with big tires and an offset and while it handled and drove like a complete dog, had no turn radius, but the only problem I ever had with it was ripping the drive shaft off. The factory ball joints did just fine for the amount of wheeling and 40k miles I put on it post lift. Was I just lucky? who knows... I'm not expecting to be riding on a cloud; I dont think thats reasonable, but this feeling is even worse than how that drove, the steering wheel shouldnt shake to this degree over bumps in a paved road.
(end of rant)

Regardless next week I'm going to take it back to the shop that put it on. I'm on the fence about asking them to try and fix the problem first leaving all the parts as is to see if its just a case of out of balance tires, something loose, or a bad alignment, or just go straight to changing things. If I had more time to deal with i'd definitely lean towards piecemealing it, but I would like to get this solved relatively soon as it is my daily.

Here's what I've decided to swap out/add to help address the issue.

TeraFlex 1938125 JL/JLU Drop Bracket Kit for 2.5"-4"
RockJock Currectlync Heavy Duty Steering System
Fox 2.0 Factory Series ATS Steering Stabilizer

I'll keep this thread up to date with progress/end results to help anyone else in the future.

I’ll be getting mine set up Monday, now my wheels and tires are a quite a bit lighter than yours (93lbs per wheel/tire), I’m going to be running an offset of -25. If I don’t develop the same issue, I doubt it’s your offset. My money is on steering parts.

 

[RaiderGladiator]

I am going to +1 on your steering stabilizer. Let us know how it drives ones that’s installed!
I’ve got the Clayton lift , full adjustable control arms / drive shafts and 37x13.50r18 -12 bfg km3s at 35 psi. Fox 2.0 ats adjustsble steering stabilizer and 100% honest.. it drives amazing.

 

[Jems007]

Fwiw, I have the Clayton 3.5 on falcons with 25mm offset wheels on 37” grabber atx tires and it’s smooth as butter. Make sure everything is torqued down. I also have Clayton rear track bar with track bar relocation bracket from RK, steersmarts front track bar, falcon stabilizer, and metal cloak control arms at 6.8 caster.

 

[Vtur]

A steering stabilizer cannot fix bumpsteer.

I think you have the term confused with the condition......Bumpsteer is caused by the steering linkage not swinging the same arc as the axle leading to the steering wheel changing position in relationship to the axle's vertical location.

What I see in the OP's video is the axle/tires probably flopping around due to them leaving the ground because of poor shock damping amplified by the added weight, leverage, and air pressure of the heavy wheel combo. A good steering stabilizer "would" likely damp this condition. Think about how hard a 160lb basket ball would be to control should it go off course from a controlled dribble.

I should've mentioned that my bumpsteer was while in turn, like while getting off an offramp. Driving in a straight line were no issues with the stock steering damper.

 

[Vtur]

A steering damper isn’t going to solve any issues- it will mask the real problem. All of my previous jeeps on 37’s-40’s when first setup are ram without a dampener for that reason- they mask loose bolts/issues….. a well setup lift should be able to track straight and not have any shimmy’s, shakes etc….

don’t get me wrong- hydro assist has always been added so the masking in my experience still takes place… but I run them with nothing first to make sure everything is set.

Steering damper shouldn't helps much in a straight line, but it's really benefit when hitting bumps while turning.

 

[Vtur]

My money is on the negative offset wheels. Keep this in mind. Nothing good happens if your offset is too wide.
1. Wear out ball joints quicker due to increased leverage. With the stock joints it’s only a question of when, not if. With -18, you’ll visit that expense quicker.
2. Increase your scrub radius
3. At highway speeds the drag from your tires can cause a toe out condition. Dynatrac or Eddie with [Banned Site] has a great video on this.

Agreed. Physic don't lie. Goes with the most positive offset as possible without rubbing. Picturing doing push up with the the elbows and arms extended to the side.

 

[CrazyCooter]

Steering damper shouldn't helps much in a straight line, but it's really benefit when hitting bumps while turning.

Steering damper helps in all situations where terrain is uneven and can cause oscillations in moving parts.

 

[3VOLVE]

I am going to +1 on your steering stabilizer. Let us know how it drives ones that’s installed!
I’ve got the Clayton lift , full adjustable control arms / drive shafts and 37x13.50r18 -12 bfg km3s at 35 psi. Fox 2.0 ats adjustsble steering stabilizer and 100% honest.. it drives amazing.

how tall are your bump stops?

 

[jwoz]

So update on this:

I took it back to the shop on Tuesday, and they looked it over. They didn't say anything was loose and didn't offer to adjust anything on the caster/toe end... They did offer to install the parts and do an alignment for over $900 labor... which I passed on. The steering felt a little tighter after I left though; not sure if it was just my imagination, but definitely not the improvement or changes I was hoping for.

After that experience I decided since doing the stabilizer doesn't require an alignment I'd throw that on to see where it got me. Definitely is noticeable and I'm pretty happy with where it's at now. I do still have the steering system sitting in the box, debating on whether or not I should do that and get another alignment, not sure if it will improve it further or if it will be pretty negligible.

 

[CrazyCooter]

Why don't you stack a bunch more parts on it? Maybe ram assist/big bore gear, dual stabilizers, ball joint delete, geometry correction brackets, bypass shocks..........

Did you try the free stuff I suggested yet?

This is why I would never "Let" a build like this into my shop EVER again.......The client screws it all up by ignoring my recomendations, then doesn't like the way it drives, asks the internet, drives me insane with all the questions and how can I fix it while ignoring the answers, then I'm married to the POS while the guy talks shit all around town......... NOPE I bow out a protect my rep.

 

[Eazye]

Looks like toe is too high, 1/8” toe in or about .125 is a good start and your caster is too low, 6.5* is also a good start. Do that before you go and buy any new expensive parts to throw at it in an attempt to fix it. I run the same tires but 17” and I run that 27 cold. You have less rubber so might be able to go a little bit lower.

 

[jwoz]

Why don't you stack a bunch more parts on it? Maybe ram assist/big bore gear, dual stabilizers, ball joint delete, geometry correction brackets, bypass shocks..........

Did you try the free stuff I suggested yet?

This is why I would never "Let" a build like this into my shop EVER again.......The client screws it all up by ignoring my recomendations, then doesn't like the way it drives, asks the internet, drives me insane with all the questions and how can I fix it while ignoring the answers, then I'm married to the POS while the guy talks shit all around town......... NOPE I bow out a protect my rep.

The free stuff you suggested? If you're refering to your original post, your first piece of advice was my tires and wheels are "brodozer" so not really helpful, the other two pieces; I did try adjusting the shocks and it didn't make much difference. As for airing down further I'm getting conflicting advice on that. The shop I went to didn't mention or suggest that. I did buy some chalk tonight to test them and see if It makes sense to go lower.

I'm sorry you've had some poor experiences with customers in the past. Not sure why you felt the need to air it in here. I'm not your customer, and never dragged anyone's name through the mud. I gave them a 5 star review and that stands. If you reread my post(s) I never said anything bad about them or named them. Do I agree with their pricing for installation of a tie rod, drag link, stabilizer and alignment? No. Do I wish that they would have taken a look at the alignment based on what others here said? Sure. I'm entitled to those opinions, I spent a good deal of money with them. I haven't been hounding them with questions or complaints, the last time I spoke to them prior to me bringing it for the check up was the day I left the shop with it originally. It was my parts and choices that I paid them to install. I can take responsibility for that, and do. They won't be hearing from me again unless I'm paying them to install something.

 

[CrazyCooter]

The free stuff you suggested? If you're refering to your original post, your first piece of advice was my tires and wheels are "brodozer" so not really helpful, the other two pieces; I did try adjusting the shocks and it didn't make much difference. As for airing down further I'm getting conflicting advice on that. The shop I went to didn't mention or suggest that. I did buy some chalk tonight to test them and see if It makes sense to go lower.

I'm sorry you've had some poor experiences with customers in the past. Not sure why you felt the need to air it in here. I'm not your customer, and never dragged anyone's name through the mud. I gave them a 5 star review and that stands. If you reread my post(s) I never said anything bad about them or named them. Do I agree with their pricing for installation of a tie rod, drag link, stabilizer and alignment? No. Do I wish that they would have taken a look at the alignment based on what others here said? Sure. I'm entitled to those opinions, I spent a good deal of money with them. I haven't been hounding them with questions or complaints, the last time I spoke to them prior to me bringing it for the check up was the day I left the shop with it originally. It was my parts and choices that I paid them to install. I can take responsibility for that, and do. They won't be hearing from me again unless I'm paying them to install something.

Sorry for my irritated tone........You gotta understand my point of view to get where I'm coming from. I should probably just step away from the forums if I cant filter the idiocracy of what I read. I've lived this business and hobby for 30+ years when all of this stuff had to be hand built and engineered by the installer.....Not like today where spoiled rich kids stack stuff on that just looks cool, but doesn't play well together.

Sorry the brodozer thing offended, but how else do you describe a super heavy wheel combo that was moved away from the spindle 2.5-3.5"? Its a recipe for disaster except for smooth roads so long as you aren't trying to stop fast......

Ever heard of a load inflation chart? Every manufacturer has one that you can determine the correct tire pressure for the axles weight. You can then dial in to your likes from there. You also have a 9.5" wide wheel, so that width adds additional air volume that would require less pressure too. This will probably be your biggest single improvement and its FREE!

I'm guessing you land at 23-27psi. I personally run 25 front and 24 rear with my unloaded heavier diesel and add more out back as I add weight from towing or motorcycle.

Turn your front shock clickers all the way in and see if it helps. A couple of clicks at a time you won't probably notice if you aren't sensitive to what you are looking for. My rule for adjustment is 3 clicks at a time till it feels like I went too far, then dial it back 1 or 2.

I know this is the internet, so opinions are worth what you pay for them. A person can learn a lot when they just listen to the guys that really know wtf they are doing. Don't take it all for the gospel....trust, but verify.

You have a lot invested here, so it would be nice if you could smile when you are driving your truck.

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