Diesel Engine issue tracking thread... also please post if NO issues!

[Almost]

Yikes....I was just asking because I'm trying to determine if fuel additives alone are enough to solve the issue. Which is also why I brought up the fuel differences in the EU as it infers it's simply a lubricity issue vs design issue. If something works 99% of the time and has less than a 1% failure rate I would say the design isn't the issue and its a fuel issue. The government doesn't have our best interest at heart here or else we wouldn't have ULSD or ethanol in our gas.

Sponsored

 

[woffman5]

Yikes....I was just asking because I'm trying to determine if fuel additives alone are enough to solve the issue. Which is also why I brought up the fuel differences in the EU as it infers it's simply a lubricity issue vs design issue. If something works 99% of the time and has less than a 1% failure rate I would say the design isn't the issue and its a fuel issue. The government doesn't have our best interest at heart here or else we wouldn't have ULSD or ethanol in our gas.

Sorry, I'm a little passionate regarding this issue! I stand by a manufacturing issue. I say that because the CP4 and ULSD have been around for about the same amount of time, 12 years give or take. One would think that in that amount of time a manufacturer would figure out a way to build a more reliable component that works with the fluid it is designed to pump, i.e. ULSD. It's a chicken and egg thing. Is it the pump or the fuel? Reality is ULSD isn't going away, so the pump design needs to change. FCA has already recognized it's the pump and are either back-fitting the Cummins motors with the CP3 as a recall, or building new truck with the CP3.

Are additives alone enough, I'm not sure. The list of measures taken to prevent these kinds of failures are miles long. I've seen (on the bigger trucks at least) additional fuel/water separators, purifiers, fuel put in secondary tanks and pumped through a moisture separator, fuel additives, etc. used to try to prevent failure. Do they work, maybe. Will they void your warranty, maybe. Are they expensive, some are. One risk with additives is DPF clogging if they don't fully combust. That stupid thing already causes/caused enough issues with just DEF and diesel exhaust, throw in an additive that doesn't fully combust and you're just asking for problems. When you play whack-a-mole with these kinds of issues, other, unintended, side effects can arise. Having owned a Gen 1 EcoDiesel, I'm well aware of what happened when FCA played whack-a-mole in regards to emissions. The "fix" caused all kinds of other issues, including a massive amount of turbo lag that almost got my wife and I hit a couple times when trying to accelerate to highway speeds, that weren't even considered. So play it forward, and you can understand my hesitation.

Sorry to jump on you, I just hate the "did you use additives" question because it's not an end all, be all fix. It's a band-aid that we as owners/lessees shouldn't have to use.

 

[Bananaman]

Sorry, I'm a little passionate regarding this issue! I stand by a manufacturing issue. I say that because the CP4 and ULSD have been around for about the same amount of time, 12 years give or take. One would think that in that amount of time a manufacturer would figure out a way to build a more reliable component that works with the fluid it is designed to pump, i.e. ULSD. It's a chicken and egg thing. Is it the pump or the fuel? Reality is ULSD isn't going away, so the pump design needs to change. FCA has already recognized it's the pump and are either back-fitting the Cummins motors with the CP3 as a recall, or building new truck with the CP3.

Are additives alone enough, I'm not sure. The list of measures taken to prevent these kinds of failures are miles long. I've seen (on the bigger trucks at least) additional fuel/water separators, purifiers, fuel put in secondary tanks and pumped through a moisture separator, fuel additives, etc. used to try to prevent failure. Do they work, maybe. Will they void your warranty, maybe. Are they expensive, some are. One risk with additives is DPF clogging if they don't fully combust. That stupid thing already causes/caused enough issues with just DEF and diesel exhaust, throw in an additive that doesn't fully combust and you're just asking for problems. When you play whack-a-mole with these kinds of issues, other, unintended, side effects can arise. Having owned a Gen 1 EcoDiesel, I'm well aware of what happened when FCA played whack-a-mole in regards to emissions. The "fix" caused all kinds of other issues, including a massive amount of turbo lag that almost got my wife and I hit a couple times when trying to accelerate to highway speeds, that weren't even considered. So play it forward, and you can understand my hesitation.

Sorry to jump on you, I just hate the "did you use additives" question because it's not an end all, be all fix. It's a band-aid that we as owners/lessees shouldn't have to use.

I feel you. I think it's BS that some of us feel we need to use an additive.
I'm also curious as to what the failure rate is vs. mileage. Do most failures happen early on? If one gets above a certain mileage mark do the failures drop?
Funny thing is, I own a 2002 F250 with 269,000 miles on the 7.3 Powerstroke and think nothing about the diesel I put in it.

 

[Zybane]

I just hate the "did you use additives" question because it's not an end all, be all fix.

Whoa; slow down here. No one is saying that you are wrong for not using fuel additives. It's only a data point to see if it helps, nor an end-all-be-all fix. And if a lack of ULSD lubricity is a root cause.

Of course in a perfect world a perfect pump for our fuel should have been used. But as someone who has ordered a diesel JT, I would like to know if additive lubricity would assist with the issue. If I'm out on some remote mountain top and stranded because my fuel pump gave away when I wasn't using any fuel additives... me screaming "oh Jeep should have done X isn't going to get me off that remote mountain.

Like I ordered the Gorilla Glass windshield as a preventative measure. Yes it's not a cure-all, plenty of GG windshields have cracked. But if it cuts my windshield replacements by 2/3rds, I'm going to do it. And on top of it, I'm putting on the 3-layer peel off windshield film. I want the vehicle to be as reliable as possible. And really, diesel fuel additives are pretty darn cheap, especially when bought in larger container sizes.

 

[Pwntiac]

-600 miles CEL, both nox sensors replaced and bad connector fixed
-1300 miles, smog test failing as “not ready”

Am starting to feel a little bad about this motor

 

[Pwntiac]

if a lack of ULSD lubricity is a root cause.

Might be worth noting that our manual recommends not using B20; biodiesel is known to be dry. If I see B20 at the pump I drive away now

 

[Zybane]

Might be worth noting that our manual recommends not using B20; biodiesel is known to be dry. If I see B20 at the pump I drive away now

Biodiesel actually has more lubrication properties than ULSD.

https://www.fleetequipmentmag.com/how-biodiesel-solve-fleet-lubricity-problems/#:~:text=Biodiesel has great lubricity characteristics,help add even more lubrication.

B5 is fine, but B20 isn't that recommended not because it's "dry", but because it's harder for the fuel filter to filter (can get clogged, especially after B20 "cleans the lines"), can cause corrosion in the fuel system (you don't want it sitting idle in the lines etc), and has worse cold weather capability.

 

[woffman5]

If I'm out on some remote mountain top and stranded because my fuel pump gave away when I wasn't using any fuel additives... me screaming "oh Jeep should have done X isn't going to get me off that remote mountain.

Hence the reason I’m so pissed man! Because I was stranded on some remote mountain top!

Additives might help, and I will be using them on a go forward basis. It’s not always the lack of lubrication that causes the failures though. Moisture in the fuel causes corrosion on the fuel pump components. The corrosion in turn will eventually cause a failure. It has become more common with ULSD, because of the lack of lubricity. Corrosion causes friction, friction causes heat, heat causes failures. So, theoretically, the fuel additives should help with the friction if there is corrosion, and some will help “pull” moisture out of the fuel. As for mileage, I don’t think it really makes any difference. Some go early, some go at higher mileage, some never go. It just really depends.

 

[Zybane]

Almost to 100 voters!

 

[ChimeraJT]

Just over 5000 miles, using 0.75-1oz of Hot Shots EDT per fill up. Moved up to 37's + 3.5 inch lift about 300 miles ago. The diesel handles it like a dream. No towing yet. Going in for my first service this month. No major issues thus far, other than my Gorilla Glass™ windshield taking a rock 3 months after pickup, which by now has split another 6 inches LOL. Luckily I got the extended windshield warranty on that one... Other than that no complaints about the powertrain whatsoever! Assembly date 7/21.

Thanks for putting together this survey for the diesel club.

 

[Zybane]

I found a thread on another Jeep forum stating quite a bit of people with the Wrangler and the EcoDiesel having oil leaks from timing cover seal and oil cooler housing seal. I take it since the last vote check box isn't checked, no one has had any oil leaks?

 

[jc99]

I have oil leaks. Dealer thinks it's the engine side oil filter housing seal. Will be getting that seal replaced soon and will update if it solves it.

 

[Rusty PW]

I oil leaks. Dealer thinks it's the engine side oil filter housing seal. Will be getting that seal replaced soon and will update if it solves it.

If possible. See if you can get pictures of the oil filter housing when it's off?

 

[BigG]

10,000 miles no issues, still haven’t taken care of the DEF recall.

 

[@californiajeeping]

-600 miles CEL, both nox sensors replaced and bad connector fixed
-1300 miles, smog test failing as “not ready”

Am starting to feel a little bad about this motor

I had this issue. Put around 3500 miles on it and it smogged. Honestly i just drove the F out of the thing and the monitors kicked over. If you are conservative with the throttle some of them wont meet parameters to turn on.

Sponsored