Recall: Manual Transmission / Clutch Recall for 2020-2021 Jeep Gladiator (Notice: 21V-028)

[jimbom]

... The vagueness of the two plate design ...

What do you know about it being of "two plate design?" I was aware that it had a dual mass flywheel, but was not aware it had two clutch plates. Do you know that to be the case?

There is something different about this clutch (or gearbox,) especially in reverse. I cannot back up in 4H over any kind of impediment (hill, rock, steering near full lock) without either stalling it or slipping/smoking the clutch. My go-around is to always drop it down to 4L when backing up off-road. I've driven manuals continuously for the past 45 years.

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[ShadowsPapa]

What do you know about it being of "two plate design?" I was aware that it had a dual mass flywheel, but was not aware it had two clutch plates. Do you know that to be the case?

There is something different about this clutch (or gearbox,) especially in reverse. I cannot back up in 4H over any kind of impediment (hill, rock, steering near full lock) without either stalling it or slipping/smoking the clutch. My go-around is to always drop it down to 4L when backing up off-road. I've driven manuals continuously for the past 45 years.

My first car at age 14 was a stick. For years that's all the family could afford was older stick cars, including my grand parents with their old 1960 Ramblers. My first truck at age 18 was a 3/4 ton Chevy with the huge manual transmission with the "granny low" - I swear you could pull a house off it's foundation with that thing.

IMO, these have a high reverse. It's like the T5 in my car - it's easier to turn it around than to back over or through something because reverse is so bloody high. I have to pull it forward into the back end of the garage addition where I park it because the hill is gravel and really really steep. Even forward I put it in 4 wheel mode to not throw gravel while pulling into the garage.

 

[2004blackwrx]

My biggest issue with the recall is Jeep is admitting that at least some of the transmissions are faulty and slip. We all know slip wears a clutch. They came up with a solution that addresses the slip. However they dont come ul with a remedy for all the extra wear that occurred to your clutch before the repair. As a result any vehicle with the issue that then got fixed has a shortened clutch life with no word from jeep about compensating them for that. To me it makes more sense to get the recall once you notice clutch issues that way Jeep will do what they should have in the first place and replace the clutch as part of the recall.

 

[SelfmodJT]

My biggest issue with the recall is Jeep is admitting that at least some of the transmissions are faulty and slip. We all know slip wears a clutch. They came up with a solution that addresses the slip. However they dont come ul with a remedy for all the extra wear that occurred to your clutch before the repair. As a result any vehicle with the issue that then got fixed has a shortened clutch life with no word from jeep about compensating them for that. To me it makes more sense to get the recall once you notice clutch issues that way Jeep will do what they should have in the first place and replace the clutch as part of the recall.

To my knowledge the clutch is only warrantied for 12k miles or 12 months, am i wrong?

 

[jimbom]

To my knowledge the clutch is only warrantied for 12k miles or 12 months, am i wrong?

The clutch is mentioned in the 12k/12 month portion, but later they pretty much absolve themselves from covering a fried clutch at all.,

The warranties do not cover the costs of your vehicle’s normal or scheduled maintenance, the parts and services that all vehicles routinely need. Some of these parts and services, which your warranties do not cover, include:
•Lubrication
•Engine tune-ups
•Replacing filters, coolant, spark plugs, or fuses (unless those costs result from a covered repair)
•Cleaning and polishing
•Replacing worn wiper blades, worn brake pads and linings, or clutch linings

 

[jimbom]

I have a conspiracy theory (emphasis on "theory") about this recall ... maybe this software "fix" is simply a way for Jeep to log just how much slipping a driver has put his clutch through, perhaps in effort to understand why pressure plates are exploding or, litigiously, a way to defer any liability.

I don't want to (nor do I really) believe this, but conspiracy theories seem to be in vogue these days.

 

[seven30]

What do you know about it being of "two plate design?" I was aware that it had a dual mass flywheel, but was not aware it had two clutch plates. Do you know that to be the case?

There is something different about this clutch (or gearbox,) especially in reverse. I cannot back up in 4H over any kind of impediment (hill, rock, steering near full lock) without either stalling it or slipping/smoking the clutch. My go-around is to always drop it down to 4L when backing up off-road. I've driven manuals continuously for the past 45 years.

You might be right. I based that on this pic
https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/clutch-recall-new-clutch-pics.52128/
Maybe that piggy back thing in the pressure plate is the "dual mass" contraption. Pedal is so light in this truck I'm amazed its single plate.

When I first got the truck it was hard to back without stalling or revving. For what ever reason this clutch took a long time to bed in. But now its a piece of cake. And I back a trailer frequently too. (4:10 axle)

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The clutch is mentioned in the 12k/12 month portion, but later they pretty much absolve themselves from covering a fried clutch at all.,

The warranties do not cover the costs of your vehicle’s normal or scheduled maintenance, the parts and services that all vehicles routinely need. Some of these parts and services, which your warranties do not cover, include:
•Lubrication
•Engine tune-ups
•Replacing filters, coolant, spark plugs, or fuses (unless those costs result from a covered repair)
•Cleaning and polishing
•Replacing worn wiper blades, worn brake pads and linings, or clutch linings

Clutch lining isn't covered, and rightly so - I've seen kids fry them in less than a week. The rest of it - open to interpretation????

I've done a lot of clutch work as a former mechanic - but one such job comes to mind because of what my boss said.
I worked on a Ford for a guy - wasn't a Mustang or another Ford you'd expect to be hot-rodded around, but it had a fried clutch. The flywheel was also blued. Got another flywheel and surfaced it, replaced all the usual clutch parts, good to go (not the insurance company that covers those with horrible driving records - just a phrase)
A week later the owner came in saying the clutch was slipping badly. I pulled things apart, laid the pressure plate and disk out on the bench and called the boss over to look at things.
The owner came in to check on his car and my boss said it was going to cost $xxxx. The guy blew a gasket.
My boss said that he could take the car out right now and burn up a new clutch before the night was over - asked who drove the car. Well, f course his son............
Nope, no warranty.
Also saw a Mustang C4 automatic fried by a woman moving from PA to CO - pulling a large u-haul backed so there wasn't a molecule of air left in the thing. The back of the car was also loaded with her stuff in the back seat and trunk.. She was a teacher......... but had no logic at all.
She fried the thing pulling that trailer through Colorado. And she got mad because the transmission didn't last. Good grief - it was a C4 in a 60s Mustang. I'm shocked anyone let her pull out of the lot with that trailer!

Then there was the lady who lived next to our shop - Ford, V8 stick. You could tell when she backed the car out of the garage - throttle about 2,000 RPM and she used the clutch to control the speed backing out holding the throttle steady.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

You might be right. I based that on this pic
https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/clutch-recall-new-clutch-pics.52128/
Maybe that piggy back thing in the pressure plate is the "dual mass" contraption. Pedal is so light in this truck I'm amazed its single plate.

When I first got the truck it was hard to back without stalling or revving. For what ever reason this clutch took a long time to bed in. But now its a piece of cake. And I back a trailer frequently too. (4:10 axle)

I recall the "centrifugal" pressure plates of yester-year. The higher the RPM, the more those weights flung out and tightened that clutch. Wasn't a heavy pedal but those things clamped tighter than hell at higher RPM.

 

[2004blackwrx]

I understand a clutch isnt covered in the warranty. I do believe Jeep is at fault to a clutch pre maturely wearing caused from slippage as a result of whatever the actually issue is that caused the recall.

 

[jimbom]

I understand a clutch isnt covered in the warranty. I do believe Jeep is at fault to a clutch pre maturely wearing caused from slippage as a result of whatever the actually issue is that caused the recall.

I guess so since some clutches were replaced as part of the first recall.

Had something similar with my wife's first Infiniti. One brake liner wore out prematurely, like within a year. One pad was down to metal and it tore up the rotor. The dealer told us such wear wasn't covered and the bill would be on us. I had him show us the pads -- one liner was completely gone, the other side (same wheel) was like new, in fact that good liner was the one with the squeal bar so she never got the audible warning that a pad was getting thin. I had to explain to him that the pads weren't floating correctly and one had to have been dragging all the time for it to be like that. They finally conceded and replace the caliper, pads and rotor under warranty.

 

[jimbom]

You might be right. I based that on this pic
https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/clutch-recall-new-clutch-pics.52128/
Maybe that piggy back thing in the pressure plate is the "dual mass" contraption. Pedal is so light in this truck I'm amazed its single plate.

When I first got the truck it was hard to back without stalling or revving. For what ever reason this clutch took a long time to bed in. But now its a piece of cake. And I back a trailer frequently too. (4:10 axle)

I can't be right, cause I don't know. I've heard reference to its "twin disc," but I don't know what that means and haven't found anything definitive on it. I'm thinking its not like a two disc clutch I've seen advertised for muscle cars and such, but again, I do not know.

edit: It does look like a dual mass flywheel. Bad news when that needs to be replaced. I've got one in the garage off a G37 that cost ~$1k. I was told they can't be resurfaced like a solid flywheel can. I *think* the Centerforce clutch does away with the dual mass.

edit edit: Just looked up the dual mass flywheel on a mopar parts site. Only $207-not bad!!

 

[kd1yt]

What do you know about it being of "two plate design?" I was aware that it had a dual mass flywheel, but was not aware it had two clutch plates. Do you know that to be the case?

There is something different about this clutch (or gearbox,) especially in reverse. I cannot back up in 4H over any kind of impediment (hill, rock, steering near full lock) without either stalling it or slipping/smoking the clutch. My go-around is to always drop it down to 4L when backing up off-road. I've driven manuals continuously for the past 45 years.

Somewhere else in our various lengthy clutch discussions on here, someone else had mentioned that it was a dual plate clutch and at the time I disputed it. That person then showed some more detailed pics and design details and it was pretty clear that the OEM clutch is indeed a dual plate clutch.

So it is both a dual mass and two plate.

More complex than I would prefer and more vague than I would prefer, but mine is getting less vague over time as it accumulates more miles.

I consider this overall set of clutch issues to be a design deficiency but not a conspiracy. Most vehicles I have owned or worked on have some kind of design deficiency, some minor, some vast. A friend of mine in the industry likes to say that all makes are flawed, just pick the trade-offs you personally prefer.

The JL/JT situations with catastrophic outcomes seem to be extremely small but of course that risk needs to be mitigated.

With the small and shrinking market for manual transmissions, and nearly all manufacturers having abandoned manuals entirely, I remain glad that I had the option to get a manual, and that I have a manual.

 

[2004blackwrx]

Its not the cost of parts for a clutch replacement that concerns me. It is the overpriced labor or in my case the days into weeks of me doing the labor myself to save from the highway robbery mechanics charge.

 

[JeepCares]

I got this 2nd recall notice probably 6 months ago, but the fix was TBD. I *just* recently got the notice that a fix was available. In light of that, I'm not too worried that it will burst into flames if I put it off a couple more months.

Hi jimbom,
We suggest getting the recall performed for your safety and convenience. If you would like assistance while at the dealer, we are happy to help via private messages.

Rob
Jeep Cares

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