My JT came in, not buying it

[JTguy2020]

Got a call from dealer your Jeep is here, I turned it down as we have decided to wait on the diesel, Dealer knew that way back and decided to go forward with it anyhow. One great looking Jeep.

IF you are looking for a JT Rubicon this Jeep can be had on a great deal. It is at Ancira Jeep, the sales guy is Jay, every one knows him, been there for over 20 years. Bought several Jeeps from him, great guy.

gorgeous!

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[Ole Cowboy]

Actually I'm at Ancira right now for the emissions flash for my WK2 ecodiesl...
I spoke with a sales guy and he said he had a silver in the back lot. Must have been your order.
I'm waiting for the gator though (fingers crossed the order banks open on time).
Unfortunately they won't match the 4-5% below invoice that mak haik is offering

SIT DOWN with Jay, no one at the dealer can make a better deal.

I tried to buy a truck from McHaik, after devoting almost 3 mo to it and driving over there numerous times (OVER 1 1/2 hr from my place) I still did not have a firm price nor did I have a good order. I asked REPEATEDLY to sit down with the order guy at the computer and PLACE the damn order! Ended up I just found another dealer.

Yea MacHaik makes big offers...suggest you tell them put the deal in writing and to show you your OUT THE DOOR price.

I got a deal from a dealer once on a Jeep: Employee pricing - holdback + TT&L only. So how did they do it? GREED, I walked in the door with a check from my bank to pay full cash out the door price. But they did not want that and offered the deal...AT 28% for 72 mo.

LOL, there was no early pay off clause and I called up the finance company, sent them a check and only paid 3 days interest.

Got a call from the Sales guy, GM, Fiance guy, and the Sales manager screaming at me...lol finance guy said he was going to lose his job.



LOTS of talk on here about 4, 5 and even 7% off invoice...ANY dealer can do that as long as you don't mind paying for lifetime window tint, chrome muffler bearings, an 78% Nitrogen filled tires or finance it at 28% for longer than the car will even last.

Or the OLD trick of burying the shipping charges on the sales contract. Often they use terms like: Shipping and handling, make ready, etc and it is the same exact amount as the shipping charge on the window sticker, yes Virginia you were double-billed for shipping, read the sales contract closely!!!!

This deal is HARD to beat: Invoice - any applicable incentives + TT&L ONLY!

 

[5JeepsAz]

For all of its drawbacks the Jeep I6 ah la TJ is still the best engine that has ever been under the hood...if you like to play in the rocks. 4:88's, 4:1 transfer case and 4:1 1st gear behind that I 6 and it need very little go pedal to run anything in Moab or any other places.

^^^ love that thing. If my 64 Tornado dies I6 is my one and only replacement plan. Might even mate it with it's manual transmission to get four on the floor and granny if it came that way and add it's air conditioning too... What are the drawbacks?

 

[Ole Cowboy]

^^^ love that thing. If my 64 Tornado dies I6 is my one and only replacement plan. Might even mate it with it's manual transmission to get four on the floor and granny if it came that way and add it's air conditioning too... What are the drawbacks?

Poor mpg for a 6, low hp, strains at anything over 55 mph.

That said it is a bulletproof engine, will run forever and burn just about anything you can pour in the tank. Compression was so low that you can just about turn the engine over by hand.

Find one in a junkyard from an old Jeep that has the fuel-injected engine. Grab a wrecked one but good engine.

Jeep used to sell an improved cam for it can prob find one, toss in some better pistons or get some thinner head gaskets and add a SC giving about 6-7 lbs of boost and WAKE that engine UP! Ask me how I know!!

 

[Klutch]

Less towing capacity with the diesel? Color me skeptical. Sounds like propaganda from dealers trying encourage more Gladiator sales NOW rather than LATER because LATER there will be plenty of takers for the diesel. Less towing capacity with the diesel makes NO sense. Sure, manufacturers have certainly done stupid things in the past. But releasing a diesel-powered Gladiator with less towing capacity than the gasoline engine would be beyond stupid. FCA would be the laughing stock of the industry. They would never live it down. Furthermore, nobody would buy a diesel Gladiator with less towing capacity than the gasoline version.

Also, if you want to significantly reduce the cost of maintaining a diesel truck, change your own oil.

 

[rvillano8188]

Less towing capacity with the diesel? Color me skeptical. Sounds like propaganda from dealers trying encourage more Gladiator sales NOW rather than LATER because LATER there will be plenty of takers for the diesel. Less towing capacity with the diesel makes NO sense. Sure, manufacturers have certainly done stupid things in the past. But releasing a diesel-powered Gladiator with less towing capacity than the gasoline engine would be beyond stupid. FCA would be the laughing stock of the industry. They would never live it down. Furthermore, nobody would buy a diesel Gladiator with less towing capacity than the gasoline version.

Also, if you want to significantly reduce the cost of maintaining a diesel truck, change your own oil.

Or, before saying it's dealer propaganda, we can do some reading. Also, oil changes aren't going to help the cost significantly, especially when you get all the oil changes from Jeep Wave (Plus from the dealer? I got an additional 4). The price of maintenance is related to the durability of FCA ecodiesel engines, specifically in the newer RAM's:

https://www.allpar.com/forums/threads/ecodiesel-engine-failures-anecdotal-and-reviews.171433/page-11

The cooling needs presented a challenge: The 3.o-liter EcoDiesel V6 engine, available on the Gladiator at a later date, will be a powerhouse, cranking out 442 lb-ft of torque. But it won't achieve the full 7650-lb towing capacity of the base Gladiator engine, the 3.6-liter Pentastar V6. Simply put, the turbodiesel's charge-air cooler eats up some of the airflow coming through the grille, slightly reducing the effective cooling area. Towing numbers are still being finalized for the diesel Gladiator, but expect its towing capacity to be about 500 pounds lower than the gasser.

 

[Klutch]

Or, before saying it's dealer propaganda, we can do some reading. Also, oil changes aren't going to help the cost significantly, especially when you get all the oil changes from Jeep Wave (Plus from the dealer? I got an additional 4). The price of maintenance is related to the durability of FCA ecodiesel engines, specifically in the newer RAM's:

https://www.allpar.com/forums/threads/ecodiesel-engine-failures-anecdotal-and-reviews.171433/page-11

The cooling needs presented a challenge: The 3.o-liter EcoDiesel V6 engine, available on the Gladiator at a later date, will be a powerhouse, cranking out 442 lb-ft of torque. But it won't achieve the full 7650-lb towing capacity of the base Gladiator engine, the 3.6-liter Pentastar V6. Simply put, the turbodiesel's charge-air cooler eats up some of the airflow coming through the grille, slightly reducing the effective cooling area. Towing numbers are still being finalized for the diesel Gladiator, but expect its towing capacity to be about 500 pounds lower than the gasser.

Thanks for the link. All those posts are about problems with the FCA V6 diesel. We could find thousands of posts about problems with the V8 diesels from Ford, GM and FCA. Paying to fix engine FAILURES is not maintenance. Over years of ownership, buying synthetic diesel oil and filters at Walmart and changing the oil myself is going to save a lot of money over paying a dealer or other shop to do it.

I have done some reading. I'm not an automotive engineer, nor do I play one on TV. Shoot, I didn't even stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night. But I do know something about internal combustion engines. The only way to get less towing capacity from a V6 diesel engine than from a V6 gasoline engine is to unplug two fuel injectors on the diesel.

An intercooler can be located in many places. If it tends to overtax the radiator, you either relocate the intercooler or increase the capacity of the radiator. Again, reducing towing capacity for the diesel makes NO sense. If in fact FCA can't produce a diesel Gladiator with more towing capacity than the gasoline engine, there's no reason to bother with the diesel. Nobody is going to pay a premium for a diesel with less towing capacity.

In a few months, we shall see. If in fact the diesel-powered Gladiator has less towing capacity than the gasoline-powered Gladiator, you will have every right to shout, "I told you so!".

 

[kayakmike]

Thanks for the link. All those posts are about problems with the FCA V6 diesel. We could find thousands of posts about problems with the V8 diesels from Ford, GM and FCA. Paying to fix engine FAILURES is not maintenance. Over years of ownership, buying synthetic diesel oil and filters at Walmart and changing the oil myself is going to save a lot of money over paying a dealer or other shop to do it.

I have done some reading. I'm not an automotive engineer, nor do I play one on TV. Shoot, I didn't even stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night. But I do know something about internal combustion engines. The only way to get less towing capacity from a V6 diesel engine than from a V6 gasoline engine is to unplug two fuel injectors on the diesel.

An intercooler can be located in many places. If it tends to overtax the radiator, you either relocate the intercooler or increase the capacity of the radiator. Again, reducing towing capacity for the diesel makes NO sense. If in fact FCA can't produce a diesel Gladiator with more towing capacity than the gasoline engine, there's no reason to bother with the diesel. Nobody is going to pay a premium for a diesel with less towing capacity.

In a few months, we shall see. If in fact the diesel-powered Gladiator has less towing capacity than the gasoline-powered Gladiator, you will have every right to shout, "I told you so!".

Well, Jeep admitted that the diesel towing would be less when they rolled out the Gladiator. Expect ~500 lb less towing capacity. A quick google search will show the many articles and interviews that discussed this when they were rolled out.
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-sh...5880/jeep-gladiator-pickup-diesel-tow-rating/
https://jalopnik.com/the-engineering-behind-the-jeep-gladiators-tow-rating-1833657453

I have the Grand Cherokee Ecodiesel. Made sense on that vehicle since it had higher towing that the V6 (similar to the V8), and higher fuel economy. But with all the diesel emissions problems I've had with it, I won't touch another Ecodiesel, especially with lower towing capacity on the JT.

 

[Klutch]

Thanks for those links. OK, this still makes no sense from a marketing or engineering perspective. The only explanation is FC corporate forced the engineers to virtually unplug two fuel injectors from the diesel. It would not be difficult to build a diesel-powered Gladiator with an amazing towing capacity, but that might cut into Ram truck sales, so what we get is lame. The explanation of, "... the turbodiesel's charge-air cooler eats up some of the airflow coming through the grille, slightly reducing the effective cooling area" is crap. Cooling challenges are easy to solve.

I see this case as similar to the new (Yawn...) Ford Ranger. A Ranger with a V6 Ecoboost would be a great truck and lots of people would buy it. But no, that might cut into F-150 sales so all we can get a puny turbo 4-cylinder, and NOTHING else, in the Ranger.

 

[LongTimeListener]

Cooling challenges are easy to solve.

That's just not true. Cooling is one of the most complex parts of any modern vehicle, particularly those that will be required to perform heavy service from time to time.

 

[MadMax]

Less towing capacity with the diesel? Color me skeptical. Sounds like propaganda from dealers trying encourage more Gladiator sales NOW rather than LATER because LATER there will be plenty of takers for the diesel. Less towing capacity with the diesel makes NO sense. Sure, manufacturers have certainly done stupid things in the past. But releasing a diesel-powered Gladiator with less towing capacity than the gasoline engine would be beyond stupid. FCA would be the laughing stock of the industry. They would never live it down. Furthermore, nobody would buy a diesel Gladiator with less towing capacity than the gasoline version.

Also, if you want to significantly reduce the cost of maintaining a diesel truck, change your own oil.

According to news, the diesel will tow less than V6 with max tow package because of cooling issues and the turbo using more air that would otherwise be used to cool the engine. And no they wouldn't wait cause some people want the diesel. Not everyone is towing with their jeep. And it's more than JUST oil changes that cost more to maintain a diesel.

 

[SleepyJeep]

LOTS of talk on here about 4, 5 and even 7% off invoice...ANY dealer can do that as long as you don't mind paying for lifetime window tint, chrome muffler bearings, an 78% Nitrogen filled tires or finance it at 28% for longer than the car will even last.

Or the OLD trick of burying the shipping charges on the sales contract. Often they use terms like: Shipping and handling, make ready, etc and it is the same exact amount as the shipping charge on the window sticker, yes Virginia you were double-billed for shipping, read the sales contract closely!!!!

This deal is HARD to beat: Invoice - any applicable incentives + TT&L ONLY!

I do have to say about the dealers who have helped forum members with 5-7% less than invoice here don't have any hidden agendas and costs as a lot of people have already purchased from them and the OTD price along with fair financing or your own financing as well... Didn't want people to think that the dealers here were somehow masking some profits in hidden items...

 

[Klutch]

That's just not true. Cooling is one of the most complex parts of any modern vehicle, particularly those that will be required to perform heavy service from time to time.

What makes you say this? I build classic cars. While they're not trucks, people install 427 cubic inch "stroker" engines into cars which came with a 302. Builders install larger radiators, twin electric fans, shrouds and other mods to keep everything cool; even with air conditioning. I've seen 1960s cars with twin turbo V8s and supercharged V8s. Those mods require some serious cooling, but home builders are able to make it happen. I don't see why it would be so hard with a Gladiator.

Here's an example of a home-built, 2011 Ford Ranger with a Cummins Diesel swap. Note he simply installed the intercooler in the bumper, below the radiator. It appears the main bearings did not melt.

http://www.trucktrend.com/features/1511-2011-ford-ranger-diesel-swap/

 

[Klutch]

Not everyone is towing with their jeep. And it's more than JUST oil changes that cost more to maintain a diesel.

While not everyone tows with a Wrangler, a big selling point for a truck is towing capacity.

Sure, diesel maintenance is more than oil changes. But oil changes are a big part of diesel maintenance and expense; lots of oil that MUST be changed regularly to protect the engine. By changing your own oil, you're eliminating a big part of the expense, but certainly not all of it.

 

[hawkijon]

Actually I'm at Ancira right now for the emissions flash for my WK2 ecodiesl...
I spoke with a sales guy and he said he had a silver in the back lot. Must have been your order.
I'm waiting for the gator though (fingers crossed the order banks open on time).
Unfortunately they won't match the 4-5% below invoice that mak haik is offering

(waving) another Texas hand here. I'm patiently awaiting the Gator as well. Hopefully 9/16/19 is the true date of order availability. I went to Winnie C/J/D to prep my order and Gator is still not available, but the blue and orange are now available as scheduled. Super nice folks over there Scott and Daron. Im not sure if you're going Rubicon, but they quoted me a price well below my 54K Jeep website build (Rubicon,Gator w/ Black Freedom top & fenders, 6spd manual, Winch bumper, Front/Rear Camera, Brown Leather, Headliner, Floor Mats, Premium Alpine w/ 8.4"screen, AUX. Switch Group, Trailer Package, LED ligths and Bed Rail System),. The only thing i worry about between now an a 9/16/19 is the invoice price changing for the marketing of 2020 actual year builds vs. early 2019 builds that are on lots currently. The dealer said September to October is a possibility, but im sure we can work something out. I will have my build projects posted here and on Texas Overland facebook group.

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