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Wolf Island Diver

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Historically, the term “dual battery” meant a second battery under the hood of the same type as the starting battery that can provide additional power for the winch, welders or anything else. The overlanding community has broadened the term. With DC to DC chargers you can now run N number of additional batteries, mounted where convenient and of any chemistry and size for the purpose of running fridges, ac, powering appliances, etc. This is what I’ve done here. I think the original meaning of “dual battery” kept this solution off my radar until recently. But I think this is a better solution than the portable units from Goal Zero, Jackery, et al. Personally I’ve never needed additional batteries for the winch as I’ve never needed to winch for prolonged periods of time with the truck off. Believe it or not you can now buy battery powered TIG welders! So I’d go that route if I really wanted a portable welder.

I’ve been using a Goal Zero Yeti 500x (500Wh) with good success, but it requires me to keep it plugged in when not in use, I’ve got to find a place for it in the truck and it’s bulky. It and it’s wires are always in the way. All nitpicks but combined with its limited capacity, I decided to upgraded to a built in system based around a 100AH self heating LiFePO battery. This is the equivalent of a 1200Wh Goal Zero for a lot less money. It’s also easily upgradeable by buying additional or larger batteries.

For this project I used a Renogy DCC50S DC to DC MPPT charger. There’s some debate about these, but so far I’m happy with it. They will do 50A charging. Those settings supposedly require the app to activate. Mine was already set up at max amps. The Bluetooth module works fine. It even works from inside the house about 30 feet away. I’ve not had it disconnect. Personally I like the way this hooks up better than the competing RedArc and it’s cheaper. I’m using a Renogy self-heating 100Ah battery, which is both much smaller and much lighter than a typical AGM. In total, with the 4th of July sale, the charger, battery box, battery and BT module came to $800, $200 more than a GZ Yeti 500x.

All of this is mounted to my bed molle panels. I used circuit breakers instead of fuses so I can easily isolate stuff. These are mounted to 50lb capacity plastic pegboard. Wiring runs behind the pegboard. The molle panel can be unbolted to remove the whole thing as 1 piece. The battery box is pretty cheap and bulky but it works. It’s bolted to the bed with sheet metal screws sealed with RTV. The strap just holds the top on and adds additional protection to keep the battery from flying out but it’s woven through the molle panel. Everything is solid. The battery box is about 120% the size of the battery so I may be able to fit a 200Ah battery later on.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1872


Close up of the breakers. There’s a breaker for my outlets and one for the fridge port in addition to power from the starting battery, the solar port and an isolator between the Dcc50s and lithium house battery. I can easily disconnect Solar. I can easily isolate the battery itself and disconnect the system from the starting battery/alternator
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1875


I cut the bedliner from the plastic cap at the back of the bed. Three glands seal the 6AWG cable to the battery and to the ground which goes to the chassis above the spare tire. The third penetration is for a 2 conductor 10AWG cable that runs up under the Front Runner basket for a Anderson Powerport solar connector. I RTV sealed this cap back in place. The Renogy ignition detection wire runs through here as well with the hot cable.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1873


close up of the Anderson port. I sealed this to mounting plate made from scrap HDPE. The dedicated outlet for the fridge is done the same way. These connectors are run in parallel as the Renogy solar charger is limited to 25V. My panels are all around 20V
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1847

The solar port is well sealed but it’s also well protected by the overhang of the Front Runner basket/tray. I used a ring to secure the front of the outlet assembly so that I’d have something to secure plugged in cables to. That cable plugged in is the mounted solar panel. More on that below. By mounting this outlet outside I can avoid having cables from my solar panels cluttering up the back of the truck and posing a trip hazard. Also I often put the panels on the roof when parked.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1885


I left excess cable for the solar outlet so I can move is farther outboard if needed. That other cable is my WeBoost running to its mast at the back of the truck.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1864


The port for the fridge goes on the drivers side. My 63qt ARB just fits so I don’t really need a slider. Now I don’t have to deal with wires all over the place and this is a locking ARB type outlet so I don’t have to worry about it getting knocked out of the Yeti.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1884


I ran the same 10/2 AWG cable as the solar port over the center framing of the Diamondback, secured with 3M zip tie mounts. The Diamondback doors will still open with the wire in place.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1874


Renogy makes a cheap ($120) flexible 100W Solar panel. I’ve temporarily zip tied it in place. I’m going to make some HDPE mounting plates for it. But the CONOPS are that I’ll leave this on the truck. When I’m carrying gear, I’ll just move the panel up on top of my gear and strap it down. It’s super light and flexible. The Renogy DCC50s will trickle charge the starting battery off of solar when the house battery is full. It does prioritize solar, but I can easily disconnect this via the circuit breaker, if I’m not getting enough amperage into the batteries when driving. But I suspect that this will be more than adequate to power things while underway. This is a much cheaper panel than the Cascadia Systems hood mount panel and 3 times the wattage. I’ve got 2 other folding 100W panels for at total of 300W at about 20V. Ideally the battery in a system like this should mostly be a buffer/storage for solar. Solar is really what’s important. At this wattage I’m getting pretty close to the threshold of running everything off of solar and only using battery power at night. The 200 watts of panel already changes the Yeti 500x from 20% to 100% in a few hours. This really reduces if not eliminates my fridge anxiety.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1880


I don’t like the idea of USB and 12V power ports mounted inside the bed where they’re inconvenient. I mounted 2 65W PD USB-C, USB-A combo ports and 2 150/300W 12-24V power ports inside this box. Also, inside is a fuse distribution block that takes regular ATC/ATO fuses instead of those goofy glass tubes. This is attached to the panel with a 10 foot cable. I think this will be much more useful and I can secure it in various places with Velcro. It will reach into my tent when parked in camp sites like Ocracoke or Hatteras where the tent is close. It velcros to the battery box when not in use and is run through its own circuit breaker for safety and isolation. I limited this 10Ft due to the 10AWG wire assuming full draw

Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1879


Sitting upright on the battery box. It also rides flat. That extinguisher has been mounted there for a while. It’s on a quick release. It’s not a reflection of my confidence in my wiring but rather a reflection of my tendency to use accelerants when starting camp fires
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1876

Velcroed to the underside of the Diamondback.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1881


I don’t have a big inverter mounted yet. I currently have one or two devices that I take that require 120v, a Dewalt battery charger and a JBL Boombox3, but I have the truck’s bed inverter which is still accessible. I will probably add a 1000W sine-wave one at some point but it’s not a priority.

Building this was actually a major PITA. I went through a few designs. I had to figure out what parts I needed. I had to get the pegboard mounted with stand-offs. I had to cut out the panels to fit the space and the battery box with a dremel. Getting these pegboard panels right was a pain as holes didn’t line up. I used 3d printed metal molle panel plates on the backside but their holes were in weird places and ended up being more like big nuts than recessing nicely into the molle. I used Loctite or nylar nuts for everything. Almost all of the hardware is stainless and metric. I went through multiple iterations of the battery box. It nests in the pegboard up against the molle panel to be more secure but without bolting it down, it was impossible to get it secured without wobbling. I really didn’t want to drill into the bed but I wasn’t happy with how secure the box was. I mounted most everything to the panel removed from the truck but had to compete the wiring while lying in the bed. You have to be good with working in a hot confined space for hours. I used to work on nuclear submarines and this felt a lot like that, working blindly behind panels on my back, in a tight space I had to crawl into, working by flashlight in the heat. You could certainly do this in a more simple way but I didn’t want to use wood or shove it all in a box. I wanted to have quick access to the circuit breakers and I had to figure out where the battery was going to go. There’s also lots of airspace around everything. There’s also room for placing a cover over the whole thing. I’m thinking about a combination positive pressure and air exchange system for the bed anyway but honestly with the ARB the Yeti and it’s 120W charger, even in hot weather it surprisingly doesn’t get that hot in the bed. We’ll see how temps go with this additional equipment. Side to side there’s still plenty of room for my fridge and a kitchen slide out I’m going to build next. The battery extends very little past the wheel arch.
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Free2roam

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Quite the write up! Nice job, looks great
 

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Nice power setup - do you have any pictures of your overall configuration? From what I can see in these pictures, you have quite a cool build going. Appears to be for ground based camping, which I think I may head back toward.
 
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Wolf Island Diver

Wolf Island Diver

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Nice power setup - do you have any pictures of your overall configuration? From what I can see in these pictures, you have quite a cool build going. Appears to be for ground based camping, which I think I may head back toward.
The truck is a 21 JTRD, with a 3” AEV lift with 37’s on beadlocks, AEV front bumper, warn EVO, Baja designs and AEV lights, ARB sliders. I’ve still yet to get a full belly skid but it needs it. That’s probably next.

I don’t have a picture of the tent (Gazelle T4, plus) set up at Ocracoke. It was pulled right up to the awning behind the truck which isn’t always possible. The 270 OVS awning is mounted to a Front Runner rack with aluminum granite countertop brackets. This is on top of a Diamondback HD. I have 2 large ROAM boxes that mount on top of the Diamondback but I’ve started only carrying one box and leaving the other side open for the tent and chairs. ROAM redesigned the boxes to prevent warping and sent me two warranty replacements. I took one of the old ones (I have 4 now 😳) and mounted rod holders on it which I just leave on the truck. There’s a WaterPort mounted to the right side under the awning along with an OVS shower awning. I’ve enclosed the space between the Diamondback and Front Runner which I use for additional gear like NATO jerry cans, the awning walls, etc. I’ve added both yellow and white LEDs to each awning arm controlled with a rheostat

I don’t like open adventure racks where everything gets wet and people can steal your stuff. I’ve done the camper shell thing before and I’d rather have something lower for bikes and more modular. I also feel like they end up having a lot of open wasted space. I can fill this from the bottom with zero wasted open space. Everything I carry other than my tent and chairs strapped on top of the rack is locked up. Most everything is away from the elements. I can fairly easily reconfigure this with multiple boxes, one box, just the Diamondback, etc. I could even throw an RTT on if I wanted.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1462

Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1444

Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_3078


I prefer ground tents, since I can leave them to go explore, my dog doesn’t have to do circus tricks to get in, and I can keep the rack lower, and carry more gear like bikes. I don’t carry the Ooni pizza oven in the picture below anymore. I bought a Trailfire grill and it actually cooks pizza pretty well and still works as a disk cooker and fire pit. I don’t have good pictures of the tent but it’s huge. I use Helinox cots with leg extensions and Born Badger bed rolls. It’s probably over $1000 per person, but I guarantee this is a more comfortable set up than any roof top tent and everyone has their own personal space. I have mixed feelings about the Gazelle. It’s huge and very comfortable and airy but they don’t like wind at all. This is true for most hub tents. You have to guy it out, more so than a dome tent. I’m actually going to try another hack to further stabilize the walls using some tarp polls.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_3304


As much as I like this setup I’m planning on buying an off-road camper next year. Probably an Opus OP4 so I can carry kayaks or a small catamaran and run off grid AC
 

smlobx

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Nice set up!
I’ll take dibs on the cots if you sell them!
 

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The truck is a 21 JTRD, with a 3” AEV lift with 37’s on beadlocks, AEV front bumper, warn EVO, Baja designs and AEV lights, ARB sliders. I’ve still yet to get a full belly skid but it needs it. That’s probably next.

I don’t have a picture of the tent (Gazelle T4, plus) set up at Ocracoke. It was pulled right up to the awning behind the truck which isn’t always possible. The 270 OVS awning is mounted to a Front Runner rack with aluminum granite countertop brackets. This is on top of a Diamondback HD. I have 2 large ROAM boxes that mount on top of the Diamondback but I’ve started only carrying one box and leaving the other side open for the tent and chairs. ROAM redesigned the boxes to prevent warping and sent me two warranty replacements. I took one of the old ones (I have 4 now 😳) and mounted rod holders on it which I just leave on the truck. There’s a WaterPort mounted to the right side under the awning along with an OVS shower awning. I’ve enclosed the space between the Diamondback and Front Runner which I use for additional gear like NATO jerry cans, the awning walls, etc. I’ve added both yellow and white LEDs to each awning arm controlled with a rheostat

I don’t like open adventure racks where everything gets wet and people can steal your stuff. I’ve done the camper shell thing before and I’d rather have something lower for bikes and more modular. I also feel like they end up having a lot of open wasted space. I can fill this from the bottom with zero wasted open space. Everything I carry other than my tent and chairs strapped on top of the rack is locked up. Most everything is away from the elements. I can fairly easily reconfigure this with multiple boxes, one box, just the Diamondback, etc. I could even throw an RTT on if I wanted.

I prefer ground tents, since I can leave them to go explore, my dog doesn’t have to do circus tricks to get in, and I can keep the rack lower, and carry more gear like bikes. I don’t carry the Ooni pizza oven in the picture below anymore. I bought a Trailfire grill and it actually cooks pizza pretty well and still works as a disk cooker and fire pit. I don’t have good pictures of the tent but it’s huge. I use Helinox cots with leg extensions and Born Badger bed rolls. It’s probably over $1000 per person, but I guarantee this is a more comfortable set up than any roof top tent and everyone has their own personal space. I have mixed feelings about the Gazelle. It’s huge and very comfortable and airy but they don’t like wind at all. This is true for most hub tents. You have to guy it out, more so than a dome tent. I’m actually going to try another hack to further stabilize the walls using some tarp polls.

As much as I like this setup I’m planning on buying an off-road camper next year. Probably an Opus OP4 so I can carry kayaks or a small catamaran and run off grid AC
Thanks for all of the info - I really like what you're going for. It seems to be very tailored to your needs and not just 'stuff from the catalog thrown on the truck the same as everyone else does it'. I saved this to look at later for ideas.

I currently run an 18" Max Mod rack with a basic 6.5' awning on the side and I have one Pelican Vault case on the top - but I am probably going to add an additional case on the driver side and a trough in the middle for my Gazelle T3 to lay in.

My bed typically stays completely empty with no bed cover. This being a daily driver and tending to maintenance on up to three houses, I really need all the space I can have for the chores of life, so when camping I typically carry my gear in Magellan water/dust tight cases and everything just goes in the bed and I snake a 3/8" steel cable through it all and lock it down, then its all covered with a Gladiator brand cargo net to keep it secured. Not completely theft proof - but considering you have to cut out a cargo net then start looking for my locks and cables - it becomes a chore.

I did buy a small RTT second hand to try out and while I do enjoy it - I also enjoy being able to leave camp behind and having a place to stand. A lot of my camping is coming back to the same place every night. There isn't such a thing as overlanding from place to place down here and while we do a trip like that now and then, it's the exception - not the rule.
 

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Do you have a write up on this? I mean.... some of us don't have the room for all of that back there because we use our JTs for other stuff. But, we might be able to find other locations for the equipment.

You did a very good job!!!! Two thumbs up!!!👍👍
 

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For this project I used a Renogy DCC50S DC to DC MPPT charger. There’s some debate about these, but so far I’m happy with it. They will do 50A charging. Those settings supposedly require the app to activate. Mine was already set up at max amps. The Bluetooth module works fine. It even works from inside the house about 30 feet away. I’ve not had it disconnect. Personally I like the way this hooks up better than the competing RedArc and it’s cheaper. I’m using a Renogy self-heating 100Ah battery, which is both much smaller and much lighter than a typical AGM. In total, with the 4th of July sale, the charger, battery box, battery and BT module came to $800, $200 more than a GZ Yeti 500x.
Preach!

I've said it before on this site but Renogy doesn't get much love in general (in truth I've seen/heard more hate from places other than this forum) but I've been running a similar setup for about a year without any issues.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install 32_100aHBattery_2


It sounds like you aren't terribly fond of the Renogy Flexible 100W panels but I must admit mine have been doing very well. In May when I went to Overland Expo West, I caught them pumping out just under 12A to the House battery; which is what the spec sheet says they should be doing.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install 14_NewSolarPlatform_6


Hopefully, your Renogy setup serves you well. Mine has!
 
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Wolf Island Diver

Wolf Island Diver

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Preach!

I've said it before on this site but Renogy doesn't get much love in general (in truth I've seen/heard more hate from places other than this forum) but I've been running a similar setup for about a year without any issues.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install 14_NewSolarPlatform_6


It sounds like you aren't terribly fond of the Renogy Flexible 100W panels but I must admit mine have been doing very well. In May when I went to Overland Expo West, I caught them pumping out just under 12A to the House battery; which is what the spec sheet says they should be doing.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install 14_NewSolarPlatform_6


Hopefully, your Renogy setup serves you well. Mine has!
No, I do like the Renogy panel! I’ve got a 100w panel mounted on my truck. It’s got air flow underneath it so cooling isn’t an issue. I can bungee it to my tent and chairs when underway (it can fold almost in half). Its all black and looks nice. It’s snow and waterproof. It trickle charges the house and starting battery and it’s not even visible from outside the truck unless you crawl up onto the Front Runner. It was $120. Compare that to one of the hood mounted ones that cost 2-3 times more and are only 30w. This Renogy stuff is a no brainer to me. I’m probably going to just start leaving the ARB fridge in the truck and use it for grocery shopping and Costco runs and I’ve always got the system charging. I doubt I’ll ever have to use my shore power port with this solar system.

The one thing that RedArc has that I’d spring for is the RedVision system if and when I get a camper since it can control and monitor everything. But for just running a Solar/DC-DC system I don’t think you can beat this Renogy setup for the price. Also there’s probably a lot more van people running these than overlanders running RedArc. Renogy seems to be very popular with the van crowd. Their battery was a no brainer too.
 
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Wolf Island Diver

Wolf Island Diver

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Thought I’d take a picture showing this from the back. The battery sticks out 1/4 inch onto the first bed stiffener hump which is less than my propane tank when it was mounted in-bed. I’ve since, sensibly moved that out of the confined space an onto the Front Runner. In this picture you can see the ARB outlet on the drivers side under my PowerTank. That big bag is all my recovery gear and a spill kit. When you have a real snatch strap you need a huge bag.

Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1887


The propane tank mount. Unfortunately I now have to stop for inspections around here when carrying the tank.
Jeep Gladiator Renogy LiFePO House (Dual) Battery Install IMG_1888
 

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No, I do like the Renogy panel!
Solid copy. I misunderstood. I love my panels (they are the different style Renogy 100W flexible) and I agree that the hood mount Cascadia and such just aren't the same bang for the buck; however, I suppose it could be great for someone who doesn't have the same "real estate" to mount the panels on.

I do the same with my Dometic fridge. I just leave it on. I'm retired so sometimes I just pick up and wander off into the woods; so it's nice having the fridge ready to go. I have yet to have my fridge pull the battery down in that manner, but I'm also in Arizona and getting sunlight onto the photovoltaic panels just isn't a problem.

I'm not too familiar with the RedVision system...what is it capable of that the DC Home app isn't doing. I suppose DC home just monitors and can't actually control anything...

EDIT: I do thing however that when my panels finally fade, I will go with the rigid style panels. I really don't need the flexibility aspect for my current mounting configuration.
 

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Following. Love the build.

Since you do a lot of beach camping and mentioned the Gazelle isn't great in wind... care to elaborate? Looking to replace our tent and not at the point where I want to spend $3K on an iKamper- yet.
 
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Wolf Island Diver

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I realized something last night…You don’t get battery monitoring plugging the Renogy Bluetooth doohickey into the DCDC MPPT. Well, you do actually. You get amperage in/out, voltage of both the starting and house battery. So you actually get another starting battery monitor which is cool. But you don’t get the equivalent of a gauge on how much time or “fullness” is left on the house battery.

All of Renogys (new) stuff uses RJ-45 jacks for monitoring including my battery. In fact you can daisy chain the monitoring of these smart batteries via these jacks. But, like an idiot, it didn’t even occur to me that I needed to specifically monitor this battery separately from the DCC50S.

Now the problem with Renogy is that documentation is terrible and confusing and apparently if you talk to them, they don’t know their own project. Renogy is basically an English Speaking portal into the Chinese solar industry. This doesn’t really concern me since almost every American solar product is a packaging or direct rebranding of a Chinese solar industry product. It does make it difficult to figure out what to do.

So I did a bunch of research (basically watching vantubers) and see that there are two options: the Bluetooth module I already have that’s being used by the DCC50S or a wired monitor with its own dedicated display and shunt. I suspect that battery already has the equivalent of a shunt and monitoring internally feeding data to one of its two ports. So I decided to buy a Renogy RJ-45 hub, which they call the Bluetooth hub despite it having no Bluetooth. Then I plug my single Bluetooth doohickey into that along with both the battery and DCC50S. Apparently the app will recognize both devices. I can even add the inverter, assuming it’s also Renogy to this same hub later and have remote monitoring and control of everything. I should have my Bluetooth battery monitoring later this week.

I’m also going to make a frame to attach the panel to my awning uprights. Right now it sits in the shadow of the awning and my currently-attached storage box.

The adventure continues…..
 
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Wolf Island Diver

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Following. Love the build.

Since you do a lot of beach camping and mentioned the Gazelle isn't great in wind... care to elaborate? Looking to replace our tent and not at the point where I want to spend $3K on an iKamper- yet.
I created a thread on this a while ago:
https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/gazelle-t8-t4-plus-safety-psa.63794/

Basically, a hub tent is a top and N sides each consisting of 4 curved and captured poles meeting in the center. In storage these bow inward. When set up they’re popped outward and held under tension. The large gazelles like the T4 plus or T8 are like two small hub tents clued together in the middle. The poles from these two sections are abbreviated where they meet in the middle. In other words they meet at the top of the tent rather than following their normal arc down to the bottom.

I’ve noticed 2 problems with the Gazelle in the wind:

1. The roof can invert violently when wind catches the rain fly because the fly attaches to the extended ends of two of those crossed bowed poles. There’s a guy on YouTube that actually diagrams this. The solution is to guy out the ends of the tent where the fly attaches to the roof poles. This seems to work in my case.

2. The center of the T4/T8 (the big tents) tends to cave in. It doesn’t completely collapse and it doesn’t make the tent unusable. It’s just annoying. This is particularly a problem when wind blows in from the side. Partially zipping up the center dividing internal wall that separates the two sections helps. I’m going to try something else. The tent comes with three poles for the front flat door of the tent. This is Gazelle acknowledging that if you don’t allow the hub cross poles to complete their arc to the bottom of the tent it will be flimsy. Hub tents are actually pretty sturdy but you’ll see that they all have these weird triangular doors and windows. Gazelle made the doors on their tents big conventional squares for usability, but this compromises the structure. So they add 3 poles (2 vertical and 1 horizontal) which easily pop in after the tent is up and frame the front of the tent.
The center section has this same compromise because it’s two abbreviated hub tents attached together. But they don’t include poles to add structure to this section. Normally it’s not an issue but wind is a problem. Unfortunately guying out the tent doesn’t help this. It actually makes it a little worse. It needs internal support at the walls of the center right under these abbreviated poles. So I just bought some telescoping tarp poles with rubber ends two put on either side of this area inside the tent. I have a feeling this will fix it.

I’m going to try out this mod this weekend along with trying out a few other hacks: pre-attaching all the guy lines with loop aliens, pre attach some MPowered Luci string LEDs, color coding the front peg loop to make finding the front and thus setting up quicker. Additionally, with all the guy lines, the fly guy lines and the additional ones for the roof fix, it’s something like 15 guy lines. If you get a gazelle I recommend getting pegs that are essentially large lag bolts. I always carry my Dewalt automotive impact driver with me overlanding and I drive these screws into the ground with this. Throw the stock pegs away. I can make quick work setting up the tent with my driver so 15 pegs isn’t a big deal. Hammering all those in would be. For sand you obviously can’t do that. For any beach/sand camping get sand stakes and attach the guy lines to the center of the stake. I’ve had good luck with the Gazelle with these although they’re flimsy. It won’t matter once they’re buried.
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I really like this tent so I think these little tweaks are worth it. Another option would be a Dometic inflatable tent but I can’t find a US distributor and I’m not going to spend more on a tent now when I’m looking at getting a trailer.
 

BourbonRunner

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Thanks so much for the detailed response.

I have a ground blind that sets up on a similar principle although much smaller.

Generally speaking staked in I've been able to leave it up for an entire season and then some with no issues, in spite of high winds, nasty weather, etc. Might have had a lot to do with location protecting it somewhat.

Looking at the tents, maybe I'm wrong but what you're describing above sounds like a fundamental issue with the T4+, not the standard T4. I didn't see the T4+ listed on their site so maybe they've pulled production until they can sort the issues you mentioned?
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