Suspension issues/begging for help

[In3briatedPanda]

Long time member. Multiple jeep owner. First time I legit have exhausted every thing I know.

I own a 2021 JT max tow freedom edition. Lift, wheels, and tires have been on the jeep before its first LOF. Steering kit added at 25k miles. I’m currently at 26k miles. I do not wheel my jeep besides some hill climbs and mud runs. No rock crawling. No visible damage to axles, bushings, arms, nothing I can see and no shop has mentioned anything in two months.

I have a metalcloak true dual 3.5 inch lift. I have adjustable lower control arms. I have the metacloak HD steering upgrade. I love me some MC btw.

I currently run a 315/70r17 112S BFG KO2.

I can not drive my jeep on the interstate. Any step up or step down like a bridge crossing or change in concrete, my jeep goes absolute ape shit. Doesn’t matter in a sweeping corner or a straight line. I had to pull over 8 times from Augusta, ga to Charleston,sc. and just as many on the way back.

my tire pressure was 35psi when it first happened. We were two hours into our trip, no problems. Running 75mph for two hours, no hiccups. We hit some road work an hour outside Charleston, traveling at 65mph and the first occurrence happens. Bridge transfer and the jeep goes nuts. Have to pull over. Get going again and a mile later it happens again. I pull over and drop psi to 30psi. This makes it worse it seems.

took back roads home and stayed 58 or lower and no issues. One time I thought it was going to get away from me but it stopped once I slowed to 40, but the vibrations and aggressive shaking we the same experience as the interstate occurrence. The interstate didn’t stop until I was almost stopped on the shoulder.

Got home and looking over the jeep everything is torqued. All my paint marks are still where they are supposed to be. I’ve had some balance issues with my tires so I take a tread depth gauge to them. Outside shoulders 3/4 on all tires. Middle is 5/6 all tires. Inner shoulder is 10/12 all tires. I’ve been battling this issue for two years so playing with alignment numbers, upgrades, and psi I was not that surprised by the uneven wear. I am surprised the local shop didn’t tell me when they did my alignment.
My caster is 6.2 currently and the shop said it was ‘perfect’.

I can pull my draglink on the passenger side and hear a clunk but I’m told it’s adjusted properly. It feels tight but at the start of turning the wheel or pulling the link, it clunks.

I don’t want to sell my jeep. I want my JT. I need help. I’m lost. I’m on mobile, sorry for typos.
I can provide photos or videos if needed. I’m begging for some guidance. I work at a shop and have access to anything needed.

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[JT1]

Ball joints are likely toast. Do you still have factory steering?

 

[rharr]

I can pull my draglink on the passenger side and hear a clunk but I’m told it’s adjusted properly. It feels tight but at the start of turning the wheel or pulling the link, it clunks.

Clunk is bad, i would start there and figure out why you have a clunk.

 

[In3briatedPanda]

Ball joints are likely toast. Do you still have factory steering?

if you mean the factory steering box, yes. I upgraded to the HD steering system a month or so ago. the drag link and tie rod are aftermarket.

I would agree if i could see movement. This will likely be my last upgrade before selling it. Ill either do mc's or teraflexs. new tires today, due to uneven ear and one being at a 3.

edit: even at 26k miles you would expect that to be a failure point? ive been looking at bc the internet says so but i can not see or feel play.

 

[Ordnanceman20]

I would start small first. I had a similar issue. Obviously, you checked PSI and torques. I would road force balance the tires. Makes a huge difference. While there, have them check your ball joints.

 

[JT1]

if you mean the factory steering box, yes. I upgraded to the HD steering system a month or so ago. the drag link and tie rod are aftermarket.

I would agree if i could see movement. This will likely be my last upgrade before selling it. Ill either do mc's or teraflexs. new tires today, due to uneven ear and one being at a 3.

edit: even at 26k miles you would expect that to be a failure point? ive been looking at bc the internet says so but i can not see or feel play.

I couldn't find any play with a pry bar, but when I pulled them apart to replace with Metal Cloak Baller joints, they were floppy with almost no resistance to them.

Also, check the 4 bolts that hold your steering box on. Mine were loose from the factory.

 

[James H]

When mine started to shudder on bumps (not as bad as yours sounds), I replaced all 4 ball joints. Only 1 felt loose when I pulled them out, but it fixed the problem. That was at 65k miles btw.

 

[Stinggrey 21 Rubi]

Steel knuckles and steersmart pitman shaft support, new ball joints in knuckles.
If everything else is good, those should fix. Sure did for me

 

[Stan H]

First let's start by jacking each front wheel off the garage floor now spin it .. is the rim warped or bent.? If bothe rotate without a wobble rotate tires in an X front to back. . Check ball joints each side while your check trueness of the rims. Also could have a broken belt in the tire with this uneven wear . Rotating the tires can be a tell tale if the tire and not the rim is the culprit.

 

[Josh00333]

Start with torque every thing.

Start with the track bar bolt.

After my lift the truck didn't feel right. Then the dammed thing fell out. Literally fell out. Shop missed it on the install and the 500 mile check.

All your symptoms sound like track bar.

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/bolt-missing…-i-think-hmmmm.82534/

 

[Zachanadandy]

Steel knuckles and steersmart pitman shaft support, new ball joints in knuckles.
If everything else is good, those should fix. Sure did for me

Why jump to $1k steel knuckles right out the gate? I know it's easy to spend other people's money, but unless you've damaged one (which would be obvious) it is not the knuckles. Odds are it's just the ball joints. You threw an extra $1200 at it when you did those, but that didn't mean everyone needs to. We wheeled the hell out of our 2019 JLUR on 38s. 5.38 gears, heavy build with skids, winch, bumpers, etc (5380 lbs without camping gear or people). 63k miles, the Rubicon, Pritchett Canyon, john Bull just to name a few of the types of trails we ran it through. On aluminum knuckles. HD ball joints went in a 38k miles. The steering box never got a brace. I can count on 1 hand the number of actually damaged aluminum knuckles I've seen in 7 years of the JL/JT. Most were from hard impacts with immovable objects. 2 were wallowed out at the ball joint races but both had incredibly loose nuts that contributed to the wallowing more than the aluminum construction. Don't get me wrong, my mojave has steel knuckles and I certainly wouldn't trade them for aluminum. I also wouldn't drop $1k on knuckles if there was nothing wrong with the ones on the Jeep either.

 

[OldButStillJeeping]

Long time member. Multiple jeep owner. First time I legit have exhausted every thing I know.

I own a 2021 JT max tow freedom edition. Lift, wheels, and tires have been on the jeep before its first LOF. Steering kit added at 25k miles. I’m currently at 26k miles. I do not wheel my jeep besides some hill climbs and mud runs. No rock crawling. No visible damage to axles, bushings, arms, nothing I can see and no shop has mentioned anything in two months.

I have a metalcloak true dual 3.5 inch lift. I have adjustable lower control arms. I have the metacloak HD steering upgrade. I love me some MC btw.

I currently run a 315/70r17 112S BFG KO2.

I can not drive my jeep on the interstate. Any step up or step down like a bridge crossing or change in concrete, my jeep goes absolute ape shit. Doesn’t matter in a sweeping corner or a straight line. I had to pull over 8 times from Augusta, ga to Charleston,sc. and just as many on the way back.

my tire pressure was 35psi when it first happened. We were two hours into our trip, no problems. Running 75mph for two hours, no hiccups. We hit some road work an hour outside Charleston, traveling at 65mph and the first occurrence happens. Bridge transfer and the jeep goes nuts. Have to pull over. Get going again and a mile later it happens again. I pull over and drop psi to 30psi. This makes it worse it seems.

took back roads home and stayed 58 or lower and no issues. One time I thought it was going to get away from me but it stopped once I slowed to 40, but the vibrations and aggressive shaking we the same experience as the interstate occurrence. The interstate didn’t stop until I was almost stopped on the shoulder.

Got home and looking over the jeep everything is torqued. All my paint marks are still where they are supposed to be. I’ve had some balance issues with my tires so I take a tread depth gauge to them. Outside shoulders 3/4 on all tires. Middle is 5/6 all tires. Inner shoulder is 10/12 all tires. I’ve been battling this issue for two years so playing with alignment numbers, upgrades, and psi I was not that surprised by the uneven wear. I am surprised the local shop didn’t tell me when they did my alignment.
My caster is 6.2 currently and the shop said it was ‘perfect’.

I can pull my draglink on the passenger side and hear a clunk but I’m told it’s adjusted properly. It feels tight but at the start of turning the wheel or pulling the link, it clunks.

I don’t want to sell my jeep. I want my JT. I need help. I’m lost. I’m on mobile, sorry for typos.
I can provide photos or videos if needed. I’m begging for some guidance. I work at a shop and have access to anything needed.

It is called 'Death Wobble'. It is usually caused:

1st, by not regularly spin balancing your tires. Oversized tires need a routine spin balance. The bigger the tire the more it needs routine spin balancing. You NEED a good tire shop. A very good one. Friends and neighbors do not apply. Find a good tire shop.

2nd, because many do not regularly spin balance their oversized sized tires, the tires are constantly hammering your suspensions bushings, ball joints, etc. So then those joints fail. You don't feel it, the bushings and joints are taking the hit... until they can't.

3rd, your steering takes the same unbalanced tire abuse and it's bushings may fail.

4th, Poor lifted suspension geometry can increase Death Wobble. especially if it is misaligned.

5th, The truck being out of alignment.

6th, the more you 'wheel it' and flex the suspension, the faster all of the suspension and steering bushings and ball joints and Johnny Joints and ... of it all. All of it, wears out.

I would get it aligned and have the tires balanced and rotated, First.

Then, if that doesn't solve the problem, it is a bushing by bushing replace. Or dump the lift and see what happens. Good luck, I have had it in a couple jeeps and I fixed it. It came down to routine tire balancing in my cases.... to never have it happen again.

Be well. Jeep on. You can fix it.

Eric

EDIT: Quote from the OP: " I’ve had some balance issues with my tires so I take a tread depth gauge to them. Outside shoulders 3/4 on all tires. Middle is 5/6 all tires. Inner shoulder is 10/12 all tires. I’ve been battling this issue for two years so playing with alignment numbers, upgrades, and psi I was not that surprised by the uneven wear. I am surprised the local shop didn’t tell me when they did my alignment. " You need another tire shop.

 

[Stinggrey 21 Rubi]

Every jeep is have seen with AL knuckles has lost torque on the tie rods after 25k miles unless retorqued regularly. Even with no four wheeling and small tires. Steel knuckles can be had for 800 now.
If you want a jeep to steer anything remotely like a car you can keep polishing the turd but to each his own.

 

[Andy29847]

If your wheels are aftermarket and lug nut centric (instead of hub centric), then this might help.

I follow death wobble threads and when they get to the point that there is no obvious solution, I like to suggest that the wheels of your Jeep may be mounted off-center. Also, if the wheels have been off-center for 10,000 miles or so, now the tires may be out of round. This issue shows up on Jeeps that have aftermarket wheels where the center hole of the wheel is bigger than the guiding edge of the hub (hub centric vs lug centric). Lug centric wheels will center if you use this procedure to mount them on your jeep.


https://wranglertjforum.com/threads/hub-centric-wheel-questions.26958/

Here is the procedure:

Here is how you should mount your aftermarket rims, after a rotation, new rims or tires, or a good old cleaning

1. Jack car up and secure it with a jack stand (Safety First )
2. Loosen all lug nuts and either put on rim, rotate or whatever the hell you need to do.
3. Thread on all the lug nuts, but DO NOT tighten to where you can not move them.
4. Rotate the tire/rim until one of the 5 lugs is at the 12 o clock position.
5. Tighten lug nut with thumb and forefinger to the point that you can not do it anymore.
6. Rotate the tire clockwise, skipping one lug nut.
7. After skipping the one nut, put the 3rd nut in the 12 o clock position. Tighten this one the same as Step 5
8. Skip one more nut, and repeat Step 5. This last nut will be right next to the first one.
9. Let the truck down to where the tires barely touch the ground. Use a wrench and tighten all bolts with about 25% of your strength. Just enough to grab.
10. I then let the truck down all the way and torqued the bolts to 90.
11. Repeat all steps above for the rest of the truck and throw a couple of beers in there

 

[FloridaAussie]

If your wheels are aftermarket and lug nut centric (instead of hub centric), then this might help.

I follow death wobble threads and when they get to the point that there is no obvious solution, I like to suggest that the wheels of your Jeep may be mounted off-center. Also, if the wheels have been off-center for 10,000 miles or so, now the tires may be out of round. This issue shows up on Jeeps that have aftermarket wheels where the center hole of the wheel is bigger than the guiding edge of the hub (hub centric vs lug centric). Lug centric wheels will center if you use this procedure to mount them on your jeep.


https://wranglertjforum.com/threads/hub-centric-wheel-questions.26958/

Here is the procedure:

Here is how you should mount your aftermarket rims, after a rotation, new rims or tires, or a good old cleaning

1. Jack car up and secure it with a jack stand (Safety First )
2. Loosen all lug nuts and either put on rim, rotate or whatever the hell you need to do.
3. Thread on all the lug nuts, but DO NOT tighten to where you can not move them.
4. Rotate the tire/rim until one of the 5 lugs is at the 12 o clock position.
5. Tighten lug nut with thumb and forefinger to the point that you can not do it anymore.
6. Rotate the tire clockwise, skipping one lug nut.
7. After skipping the one nut, put the 3rd nut in the 12 o clock position. Tighten this one the same as Step 5
8. Skip one more nut, and repeat Step 5. This last nut will be right next to the first one.
9. Let the truck down to where the tires barely touch the ground. Use a wrench and tighten all bolts with about 25% of your strength. Just enough to grab.
10. I then let the truck down all the way and torqued the bolts to 90.
11. Repeat all steps above for the rest of the truck and throw a couple of beers in there

I've been doing this almost to a T all my life. The only thing I did different was
1. not skip a lug nut
2. tighten them finger tight first, rotating the wheel several times
3. lastly use the lug nut wrench to tighten them again before lowering to the ground and finally torquing them.

I think my grandad taught me that around 1980. I despise tire shops torquing them and won't let a shop rotate my tires ever.

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