Pentastar power increase

[Mr._Bill]

I may beg to differ here. If one were to crack the programming nut on the spec-5 computer, would you not be interested in 50 more horsepower for $500-$1,000?

Like many, I would definitely be interested, if it were cheap and easy. The cost to the aftermarket developers is too high due to the upgraded security on the newer computers. There is not enough demand for the product for them to actively pursue development. There are many that will pay a lesser amount to get an available product, but very few that are willing to pay the development cost to obtain it.

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[Flyin6]

I'm ignorant on the Jeep VVT. Is there enough flexibility to mimic an old school rv cam?

Specifically, I cannot say. But in principle, you could but would not want to. Old-school cams are two-dimensional, per se. You get what is ground into the lobe, then you can install it where the manufacturer recommends or choose to advance it (Power comes on a bit earlier, or retard it, delivering power later on in the RPM band.
So why would you want to grind a cam strictly for torque down low, and throw away the top-end power this engine can make?
What you want are some lobe profiles that are more aggressive and would give you a lot more passing power, then work with the cam phasing units to be able to advance that cam enough to get things happening early.
But wait, there's more!
We have not one, but FOUR camshafts. We now have the ability to skip a three-dimensional cam and go to the fourth dimension in cam dynamics. We might advance the exhaust lobes but keep the intake portion the same which could net a bit more power at mid-range, or advance both, retard one and advance the other, and so forth.
A smart person could make a lot more happen with this Pentastar if he chose to simply because there are more tools in the kit for him to use.

 

[Flyin6]

Like many, I would definitely be interested, if it were cheap and easy. The cost to the aftermarket developers is too high due to the upgraded security on the newer computers. There is not enough demand for the product for them to actively pursue development. There are many that will pay a lesser amount to get an available product, but very few that are willing to pay the development cost to obtain it.

Well, here again, I disagree. You see the first lucky guy who cracks the code could then charge a license fee to sell that information. If our Livernois folks were to break the code, so to speak, I wonder what HP tuners and Diablo and SuperChips would be willing to pay for that information? I think millions because the industry is huge and these new Pentastars are used everywhere and aren't going away.

 

[Mr._Bill]

Well, here again, I disagree. You see the first lucky guy who cracks the code could then charge a license fee to sell that information. If our Livernois folks were to break the code, so to speak, I wonder what HP tuners and Diablo and SuperChips would be willing to pay for that information? I think millions because the industry is huge and these new Pentastars are used everywhere and aren't going away.

Everyone in development is willing to pay something, if they know they can turn a profit from it. As you can see from the current state of the market, nobody appears to believe their is a profit to be turned since they are not paying the development costs. If someone does manage to crack it, then the market will change.

This also brings up other issues that involve the government, since these vehicles are also sent to other countries. If you crack the security and try to sell it, are you now a hacker that is hounded by the FBI, or a terrorist that is hunted by Homeland Security?

 

[Flyin6]

Everyone in development is willing to pay something, if they know they can turn a profit from it. As you can see from the current state of the market, nobody appears to believe their is a profit to be turned since they are not paying the development costs. If someone does manage to crack it, then the market will change.

This also brings up other issues that involve the government, since these vehicles are also sent to other countries. If you crack the security and try to sell it, are you now a hacker that is hounded by the FBI, or a terrorist that is hunted by Homeland Security?

On that last point, you may well be right...Who knows. Since we are politically limited here, I will hit the bump stops and therefore, cannot comment further on the matter...

 

[Flyin6]

I do feel that a vibrant discussion by many might get noticed. The market research types are probably testing the barometer on the subject. Should they see an increase in interest through regular and well-attended discussions, perhaps they may turn up the wick in their R&D departments

 

[sharpsicle]

I too like to try and force square pegs into round holes.

Based on how you use your truck, I really can't track with the idea of modifying the engine and risking reliability just for a marginal at best increase in power. I mean, those who have modified theirs are accepting the new risk they carry, and there's enough failures to notice. Not that I'm talking bad about them, just that there is no free lunch on this. You seem to always want things the Gladiator just doesn't offer.

Oh, and AEV Gladiators are aftermarket conversions. They certainly aren't factory Jeeps. To portray it as anything close to 'factory' is a disservice to the conversation and to AEV.

 

[mike921921]

I've been running the Livernois tune on my 20 JT for almost 3 years now. A decent enough compromise as I was thinking about a blower. A few start up issues, but their guys got it sorted?.

Never had it on the dyno, so I guess I'm one of those 'feels better by the seat of my pants' guys ?.

I did buy another PCM (keeping the original as a spare) but have never needed to swap it back in.

 

[TheDerb]

OK, point of order here. I did not buy a vehicle and added a bunch of AEV parts. This is a factory AEV vehicle. It came with the 37" tires. To the point about cost, my JT probably cost more at delivery than one that was purchased and then modified piecemeal.

I was gonna respond, and then I read the above.

AEV doesn't have "factory" vehicles. Neither does Black Widow. Or Shelby. Or Saleen. Or Roush. Not worth the effort to type out why this is because I'm thinking you must just be bored on a Saturday, but if your VIN shows up on the Stellantis Build sheet website, and if your insurance card says "2022 Jeep Gladiator", it means you know what you're saying is bunk.

 

[Hootbro]

In my opinion, you are at the intersection point of where money and sense cross into negative territory for both. I agree with @Mr._Bill that if the market was there and viable, it would be available.

 

[Volt0]

get the aftermarket to respond to our need for more poser.

I know this is a typo and not what the OP intended to say, but I saw it, laughed, and then realized that it’s actually true for some. ;-)

 

[texanjeeper]

I'm shocked that nobody has suggested that you convert your JT to EV. Shocked, I say !!

 

[Volt0]

If you crack the security and try to sell it, are you now a hacker that is hounded by the FBI, or a terrorist that is hunted by Homeland Security?

Security algorithms and ciphers are treated as munitions; meaning that if someone generates a new one in the US, they must ensure that it isn’t sent out of the US ( w/out registering possibly, with the NSA ). Cracking and hacking something that you own might be treated differently. Cracking and hacking for a foreign entity would be bad. As far as the manufacturer, it’s more than just IP ( intellectual property ), but also about the security of their customers.

Edit: as a special reminder, think back to headlines where remote hackers were able to control a vehicles’ driving experience, armed with nothing more than an IP address.

 

[Flyin6]

Well, I suppose it is impossible to keep this discussion focused on increasing power or generating aftermarket interest.

I like how some people are set to the "Nick pick" mode. I'll bet they have loads of friends. Target a comment or twist it just a bit and there you go, I suppose you "Caught" someone or something like that. Perhaps that adds credibility to some egos, dunno.

It is difficult to carry on a conversation when you know people are only looking to try and catch you on something. Take the AEV commentary. Does anybody actually think the AEV conversion is a Jeep factory modification? Of course not, so my bad, I said factory when I should have said dealership. Dealerships do order these things from Jeep, then sell them and that's where mine comes from. So I'm a bad man for saying it that way.

Oh and I liked this comment as well, " it means you know what you're saying is bunk." Why of course! If someone says something out of order or not quite right, then it must be true, that everything that person says is false, incorrect or as was stated, "bunk." I seriously tire of people like this.

But for those who weren't looking to nick-pick and just generally remain a part of a friendly conversation, thank you.

 

[DanW]

Just my 2 cents....I like the Pentastar for exactly what it is...an extremely reliable and dependable engine that puts out power that is just fine for this application. I like that when I go out off the beaten path out into the middle of nowhere, I know this engine is bulletproof and will get me back.

One thing I'm particularly thrilled about is that it is not direct injected. That lone makes it a better engine than the GM 3.6 and some others.

I've seen many of these things well past 200k miles running like new, and some even at over 300k.

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