⚡️ 2024 Jeep Recon EV Revealed! [ADMIN WARNING: NO POLITICS]

[AustinL911]

So all we need to mitigate global warming is another volcanic event or better an impact event like the one ~65 Ma. Of course that would solve all issues since most life on earth would die.

We need more than EVs to mitigate GW.

Also, I've been patiently waiting for this asteroid to come along, but it's annoyingly late.

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[amoyer_01]

Yup. Additional considerations no one seems to talk about.

1. Battery degradation. I'm positive it does not maintain 100% capacity it's entire 100k mile life, and then abruptly stop working. So your cost/mile will increase with degradation.

2. What's your time worth? I see people mentioning that they can get a "quick boost" from 20-80% over 40 minutes while they do other things, like make phone calls or whatever. I can also do those things, but while continuing to drive wherever I'm going. Also, not everyone's productivity is s tied to their phones. What about the blue collar guy who isn't making any money unless he's actually on the job.

3. The whole concept of eventually moving everyone towards a BEV is condescending AF. There are a multitude of situations where these things just aren't going to work for someone.

4. This whole push towards EV is for a whopping 2% of carbon emissions. That's how much vehicles contribute to the whole situation.

Yep, I kept it as short as I could but it requires a lot to explain why it doesn't work yet. I couldn't add those in to keep it short so I added the "many many reasons" and there are more then those too. Thanks for adding. Look at what Tesla does with an over the air update, adding mileage and features as they want to add them. Now imagine if for some reason they want to do something to restrict you. Baam a mandatory update before your car will move. There are so many things that can go wrong with a "connected" car, it will never be about the freedom to get up and go anywhere anymore.

I have talked to BEV owners that say when you charge at public charging stations the cost can be similar to filling up a gas car. Imagine you are almost empty on your EV and need a charge. You go there and the last spot just got taken up. You are what now waiting 30 mins to multiple hours for someone to allow you to charge up and you need to do the same 30 mins to an hour to get back on the road. This is not like a gas car where you know every 5 mins or less a spot is going to open up at a gas station. And for longer road trips I am not changing my whole trip so I have to stop for multiple hours to keep driving. If I go see my Dad he lives 350 away that would mean even a full battery wouldn't get me there and I would need to stop for a short time. Where he lives there is not a charging station I am aware of in the area. So what do I do once there and my battery is empty or very low?

 

[Lunentucker]

So all we need to mitigate global warming is another volcanic event or better an impact event like the one ~65 Ma. Of course that would solve all issues since most life on earth would die.

We haven't all died from the previous events, but being fully reliant on sun and wind after one such eruption would certainly put millions of humans at risk.

 

[CMac]

Sure I can give you this as a comparison between my Gladiator and a Rivian R1T.

$66.5 to drive 300 miles is 22 cents per mile. My Gladiator averages 18.0 miles per gallon, @ $3.50 per gallon (my cost today) that’s 22 cents per mile.

Fuel cost for my Gladiator to drive 100,000 miles = $22,166@ $3.50


Fuel cost to drive Rivian R1T 135 kWh 100,000 miles =
1 kWh @ 0.15 (my true cost based on my bills)
Charging from 20% to 100% will take 10 hours 55 mins @ 11kW and costs $18
$18.0 to drive 300 miles is 06 cents per mile.
Cost for a R1T to drive 100,000 miles = $6,000@ $0.06

According to many articles the average ev battery life is 100,000 miles, with a replacement cost of $25,000 that’s $4.00/mile.

$6,000 in charging
$25,000 in battery replacement
Thats $31,000 in cost to drive a BEV 100k miles

Then you have the cost of the truck. The Rivian will cost $98,500 (based on the website configuration) to buy, (no taxes or fees) we can omit these as I didn’t pay them on my Gladiator. My Willys cost me $35,873 out the door I attached the proof). You have a delta of $62,627 to deal with out the gate.

For driving 100,000 miles the Rivian will cost me $8,834 more if just looking at the charging and battery replacement cost versus my fueling costs. I will not be spending that much in maintenance costs for 100,000 miles. Oil changes will only cost me $1,400 @ $70. This is based on 5,000 miles, I am closer to 10,000 miles an oil change. Now add in the cost of the difference in truck costs; that is now $71,461 to drive a R1T more then it does for me to drive my Gladiator.


Sure if you want to only look at charging cost versus gas cost to drive 100k miles, yes an BEV is less. That cost has my Gladiator in the hole by $16,166 but that is extremely short sided for many many reason.

I dont need an article (another persons opinion) to tell me its not worth it yet. Just look at the charging time to go from 20% to 100% that is just a sliver shy of 11 hours. It takes me 5 minutes to fill up from empty to full (call it 5% to 100%). I will always trust facts over an article written to sway me one way or the other. I can also provide insight from people who have owned BEVs and they dont say it saves any money, they just thought they were "cool".

Sorry for the lengthy post.

I also think about the intrinsic value of doors off, top off, wind in your face, the “customizability” of the truck…plus the Rivian looks like RoboCop’s mask coming down the road…the Gladiator just looks better.

I know the battery duration is gonna change for the better—someday—but the simple idea of having that battery die on the side of the road just one time would be enough to poopoo the whole BEV concept.

Yeah, for my money, I’ll take the Gladiator any day, regardless of cost.

 

[amoyer_01]

I also think about the intrinsic value of doors off, top off, wind in your face, the “customizability” of the truck…plus the Rivian looks like RoboCop’s mask coming down the road…the Gladiator just looks better.

I know the battery duration is gonna change for the better—someday—but the simple idea of having that battery die on the side of the road just one time would be enough to poopoo the whole BEV concept.

Yeah, for my money, I’ll take the Gladiator any day, regardless of cost.

Rivian has been the only company that I would truly buy into if I was forced toward a BEV. It gives me my Gladiator essentially in size. I do not need a full size truck and I love the size of the Gladiator and R1T. I have their service station about 2 mins from my house and get to see them almost every day as they drive them around to get stuff (gas stations/restaurants in the area) and get deliveries. I got to see a R1S in person that was getting delivered with a bunch of R1Ts. It is not as long as the R1T. I love everything about them just not the cost and the issue with the batteries (as mentioned before). They fit my life and I love they went the adventure route, I just wish they went the Hydrogen route.

 

[Gvsukids]

Now imagine if for some reason they want to do something to restrict you. Baam a mandatory update before your car will move.

Yep. But at least we won't be sending money overseas for Arab oil.

 

[AmosMoses]

I could see myself driving an EV like a rivian or something cool but not for the crazy cost increase.

 

[redriderjf87]

Yep. But at least we won't be sending money overseas for Arab oil.

We could largely avoid that regardless.

And money would be going overseas for battery mining dependence.

 

[Gvsukids]

We could largely avoid that regardless.

And money would be going overseas for battery mining dependence.

And for chips. Imagine the catastrophe of having a chip shortage with an electric vehicle?

 

[redriderjf87]

And for chips. Imagine the catastrophe of having a chip shortage with an electric vehicle?

Yeah fair points for sure.

Although I'm a knuckle dragger, all of my non JT vehicle's are carb'd ha

 

[Dark_Iron_Mojave]

Sure I can give you this as a comparison between my Gladiator and a Rivian R1T.

$66.5 to drive 300 miles is 22 cents per mile. My Gladiator averages 18.0 miles per gallon, @ $3.50 per gallon (my cost today) that’s 22 cents per mile.

Fuel cost for my Gladiator to drive 100,000 miles = $22,166@ $3.50


Fuel cost to drive Rivian R1T 135 kWh 100,000 miles =
1 kWh @ 0.15 (my true cost based on my bills)
Charging from 20% to 100% will take 10 hours 55 mins @ 11kW and costs $18
$18.0 to drive 300 miles is 06 cents per mile.
Cost for a R1T to drive 100,000 miles = $6,000@ $0.06

According to many articles the average ev battery life is 100,000 miles, with a replacement cost of $25,000 that’s $4.00/mile.

$6,000 in charging
$25,000 in battery replacement
Thats $31,000 in cost to drive a BEV 100k miles

Then you have the cost of the truck. The Rivian will cost $98,500 (based on the website configuration) to buy, (no taxes or fees) we can omit these as I didn’t pay them on my Gladiator. My Willys cost me $35,873 out the door I attached the proof). You have a delta of $62,627 to deal with out the gate.

For driving 100,000 miles the Rivian will cost me $8,834 more if just looking at the charging and battery replacement cost versus my fueling costs. I will not be spending that much in maintenance costs for 100,000 miles. Oil changes will only cost me $1,400 @ $70. This is based on 5,000 miles, I am closer to 10,000 miles an oil change. Now add in the cost of the difference in truck costs; that is now $71,461 to drive a R1T more then it does for me to drive my Gladiator.


Sure if you want to only look at charging cost versus gas cost to drive 100k miles, yes an BEV is less. That cost has my Gladiator in the hole by $16,166 but that is extremely short sided for many many reason.

I dont need an article (another persons opinion) to tell me its not worth it yet. Just look at the charging time to go from 20% to 100% that is just a sliver shy of 11 hours. It takes me 5 minutes to fill up from empty to full (call it 5% to 100%). I will always trust facts over an article written to sway me one way or the other. I can also provide insight from people who have owned BEVs and they dont say it saves any money, they just thought they were "cool".

Sorry for the lengthy post.

The problem is you're applying the math wrong. That's not the cost of driving 100,000 miles. The 100,000 mile cost doesn't include a new battery because you already have the 100,000 miles driven. If you want to go 200,000, then you need to buy the battery (in this theoretical scenario, actual mileage will vary). If you need mandatory service at 100,000 for the item to work longer, you don't factor that service cost into the initial 100,000. You amoratize that into the next service interval to determine the cost for the total. So in this scenario, you say it costs you $6,000 per 100,000 miles of driving, so the cost would be:

100,000 miles: $6000
200,000 miles: $6000 + $6000 + $25000 = $37000

Compared to $44,000 for fuel costs.

And none of this factors in maintenance, gas or electric rates varying which would make the gap larger or smaller. But it makes the example fair. You added a 2nd interval cost into the first interval average.

 

[amoyer_01]

The problem is you're applying the math wrong. That's not the cost of driving 100,000 miles. The 100,000 mile cost doesn't include a new battery because you already have the 100,000 miles driven. If you want to go 200,000, then you need to buy the battery (in this theoretical scenario, actual mileage will vary). If you need mandatory service at 100,000 for the item to work longer, you don't factor that service cost into the initial 100,000. You amoratize that into the next service interval to determine the cost for the total. So in this scenario, you say it costs you $6,000 per 100,000 miles of driving, so the cost would be:

100,000 miles: $6000
200,000 miles: $6000 + $6000 + $25000 = $37000

Compared to $44,000 for fuel costs.

And none of this factors in maintenance, gas or electric rates varying which would make the gap larger or smaller. But it makes the example fair. You added a 2nd interval cost into the first interval average.

Either way you want to apply the battery cost doesn’t help an EV to make it with it.

 

[N8Marsh]

I don't understand where this alleged 100k life from a battery pack is coming from. Most manufactures are warrantying the battery to 100k miles. This protects the consumer if the battery capacity is less than 70% of the capacity when new.

The vehicle in question, the Rivian, is warrantied to 8 years or 175k miles. (Source)

Plus the battery isn't dead as a doornail, it has reduced capacity and range. Reports for battery degradation mostly come from Tesla's, being they've been around the longest. Many owners are reporting ~10% battery capacity loss in 100k miles, meaning there is still plenty of life in the pack at 100k. No need to replace immediately at 100k.

These prices of $25k being thrown around are supposedly for replacing an entire pack?

As for full battery replacement, I see it working opposite how current ICE vehicles are serviced.

Nowadays, if you chew a cam lobe or crack a piston, the entire engine or shortblock is replaced. Many years ago, before remanufactured shortblocks were so common and inexpensive, engines were cleaned up, machined, and rebuilt with new parts.

I can see this being an option in the future - rather than chuck an entire battery pack into the scrap heap, the faulty cells or connectors or whatever will be replaced to fix the battery pack. It won't be done by the OEM dealers but by the aftermarket.

If 1 of the 8 D batteries in your stereo corrodes and stops working, do you throw out every single battery and replace all of them to keep your tunes going? No, you replace the faulty individual battery. Electric car batteries are just hundreds of individual cells. While it's a lot more work to replace faulty cells than just pulling the tab and dumping them on the floor, it is still doable.

I can imagine, that just as junkyard engines and reman engines are viable products AND businesses today, battery recycling and rebuilding will be an option in the future. There is big $$$ in those battery packs, and salvage yards and savvy business-minded individuals will find ways to rebuild and re-sell batteries. It will take an extra level of service beyond current salvage yard tech (which is already pretty impressive), but if there is money to be made they WILL find a way.

 

[Jteakus]

Happy I got my diesel while it is still available.

 

[west_bymidwest]

Not a fan of the name, but will definitely be getting a Recon as a second car alongside our Gladiator. The Gladiator is great for towing our travel trailer and for our seasonal trips to the western states, but an EV would be fantastic for eastern city travel.

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