Recall: Manual Transmission / Clutch Recall for 2020-2021 Jeep Gladiator (Notice: 21V-028)

[MoparDave]

I think I am going to skip this neutering.....No clutch issues after 11K miles.

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[AKDrifter]

Is this legit? I know I'm being paranoid but just want to make sure before I put my information.

Bursor and Fisher appears to be a real lawyers office. I sent them my contact info. Hopefully I hear back.

 

[tjbrown23]

Everyone please be vigilant when signing anything from a lawyer over the internet or phone/email. They may be legit lawyers and not a scam but some of the contracts out there are bait and switch. They promise things and then in the fine details you are left with hefty fees if you don't accept an offer they negotiate or win the case. Just make sure you read the documents.

I almost got stuck with a 1,500 fee regardless of outcome or if I decided not to accept a deal. This was with a lemon law firm who was legit and I talked with numerous people and researched the firm and everything. Caught 1 sentence in the middle of a 5 page contract, and called them out on it as they said repeatedly I would owe nothing regardless of outcome.

 

[DanW]

From @JeepCares on the JL Wrangler side.....

JeepCares said:
Hi everyone, there has been a lot of questions and different threads so I am going to post this and you may see the same info posted on other threads:

Towing capacity or performance will not be affected by this flash update.

There is no difference in the 3.6L engine's power output under "normal circumstances" with the Y01 flash. The torque reduction only happens if the engine controller calculates the clutch pressure plate temperature is above a certain temperature threshold.

The PCM monitors the engine RPM and the wheel speed sensors to determine if clutch slippage is occurring, how often, and at what intensity. Based on that information, the PCM calculates the clutch pressure plate temperature. The temperature threshold that reduces the engine torque is lower than the temperature needed to do permanent pressure plate damage. The vehicle cannot reach or exceed the temperature threshold under normal operating conditions, including towing and off-roading, and only occurs if the driver repeatedly slips the clutch, performs multiple, consecutive 2nd or 3rd gear launches, or if air is present in the hydraulic clutch system.

Kaitlin
Jeep Cares

So while you guys go make some lawyers' boat payments, I'm going to continue to enjoy my Jeep, and hope this resolves the issue that mine has never appeared to have or exhibit.

I'll report back when I get the flash. And keep those lawyer's numbers handy. If they neuter my Jeep, I may want to pitch in on those boat payments, too. Lol!

 

[DanW]

Everyone please be vigilant when signing anything from a lawyer over the internet or phone/email. They may be legit lawyers and not a scam but some of the contracts out there are bait and switch. They promise things and then in the fine details you are left with hefty fees if you don't accept an offer they negotiate or win the case. Just make sure you read the documents.

I almost got stuck with a 1,500 fee regardless of outcome or if I decided not to accept a deal. This was with a lemon law firm who was legit and I talked with numerous people and researched the firm and everything. Caught 1 sentence in the middle of a 5 page contract, and called them out on it as they said repeatedly I would owe nothing regardless of outcome.

Good tip! Those fargin bastages get you coming and going. They will NOT let you make them miss a boat payment.

 

[SelfmodJT]

From @JeepCares on the JL Wrangler side.....

JeepCares said:
Hi everyone, there has been a lot of questions and different threads so I am going to post this and you may see the same info posted on other threads:

Towing capacity or performance will not be affected by this flash update.

There is no difference in the 3.6L engine's power output under "normal circumstances" with the Y01 flash. The torque reduction only happens if the engine controller calculates the clutch pressure plate temperature is above a certain temperature threshold.

The PCM monitors the engine RPM and the wheel speed sensors to determine if clutch slippage is occurring, how often, and at what intensity. Based on that information, the PCM calculates the clutch pressure plate temperature. The temperature threshold that reduces the engine torque is lower than the temperature needed to do permanent pressure plate damage. The vehicle cannot reach or exceed the temperature threshold under normal operating conditions, including towing and off-roading, and only occurs if the driver repeatedly slips the clutch, performs multiple, consecutive 2nd or 3rd gear launches, or if air is present in the hydraulic clutch system.

Kaitlin
Jeep Cares

So while you guys go make some lawyers' boat payments, I'm going to continue to enjoy my Jeep, and hope this resolves the issue that mine has never appeared to have or exhibit.

I'll report back when I get the flash. And keep those lawyer's numbers handy. If they neuter my Jeep, I may want to pitch in on those boat payments, too. Lol!

Just out of curiosity, if this resolves the issue, why wasnt this done the first recall? By far cheaper then doing any kind of clutch replacement. Makes you wonder, no? Thats my issue.

 

[DanW]

Just out of curiosity, if this resolves the issue, why wasnt this done the first recall? By far cheaper then doing any kind of clutch replacement. Makes you wonder, no? Thats my issue.

I believe because they thought they had it nailed and also were forced to move on a recall quickly. The first recall was to correct the basic problem, which remains air in the hydraulic system. I've said that over and over and but everyone else kept talking about the clutch itself. ANY clutch will wear out with air in the hydraulics causing it to not completely disengage when the pedal is depressed. And I seriously doubt any pressure plate can withstand 1100 degrees without being severely damaged.

The second is insurance because not all may have been corrected properly, and a few more probobably showed up with signs of major overheating and worn clutches. Why? Because some dealer techs did the same thing as the factory folks. They didn't bleed the hydraulic system properly. So this recall appears to be an insurance policy to cover exactly that.

But you'd probably have to ask the engineers to be sure. But this statement from FCA proves I was right about the basics of the original problem and I was also right about the second recall and how it should work. Reducing power on the engine would only work if done drastically, wich is the limp home mode I surmised. I was also right with one of my guesses about how they might determine a temp increase in the clutch assembly. I'm not sure I posted all of that here. Some was on the Wrangler side of the forum. (Wow, I don't think I've ever been right or guessed right on 3 things in a row in my life! Certainly it would surprise my wife!)

And We were also told, by FCA, not the NHTSA bureacrats, that there will not only be a limp mode, but some kind of indication on the dash that it has been triggered, for those who can't tell their power was cut by probably at least 50% or more.

I may have more information coming from a friend who is a former FCA engineer. He is talking to his buddies at Stalantis who are close to the issue and will get back with me hopefully soon. I'll share any further info, if he is able to get it.

 

[Happiator]

From @JeepCares on the JL Wrangler side.....

JeepCares said:
Hi everyone, there has been a lot of questions and different threads so I am going to post this and you may see the same info posted on other threads:

Towing capacity or performance will not be affected by this flash update.

There is no difference in the 3.6L engine's power output under "normal circumstances" with the Y01 flash. The torque reduction only happens if the engine controller calculates the clutch pressure plate temperature is above a certain temperature threshold.

The PCM monitors the engine RPM and the wheel speed sensors to determine if clutch slippage is occurring, how often, and at what intensity. Based on that information, the PCM calculates the clutch pressure plate temperature. The temperature threshold that reduces the engine torque is lower than the temperature needed to do permanent pressure plate damage. The vehicle cannot reach or exceed the temperature threshold under normal operating conditions, including towing and off-roading, and only occurs if the driver repeatedly slips the clutch, performs multiple, consecutive 2nd or 3rd gear launches, or if air is present in the hydraulic clutch system.

Kaitlin
Jeep Cares

So while you guys go make some lawyers' boat payments, I'm going to continue to enjoy my Jeep, and hope this resolves the issue that mine has never appeared to have or exhibit.

I'll report back when I get the flash. And keep those lawyer's numbers handy. If they neuter my Jeep, I may want to pitch in on those boat payments, too. Lol!

In one breath she states that it won’t reduce power or towing capacity, and in the next she says the complete opposite, subject to the occurrence of some totally undefined circumstances. The bottoms line, power will decrease if there is a trigger. What is the trigger? WTF knows. Do you have confidence that the trigger will be engineered properly?

 

[Dew.J]

“When the driver repeatedly slips the clutch” So.. if I’m driving in traffic we’re gonna go into limo mode?

 

[jimbom]

“When the driver repeatedly slips the clutch” So.. if I’m driving in traffic we’re gonna go into limo mode?

Using the clutch ≠ slipping the clutch

 

[Gvsskier]

I’m up here in the great white north (BC) and have had the JT 6spd for 10 months and ~18,000 miles. I run 35” in summer and 33.5” studded in winter with a 2” Mopar lift and 4:56 final gears (tossed the 3:73s). A Magnuson SC was installed last October without a dyno test because I was worried about the clutch. I’ve had the OEM clutch inspection and update. I tow a ski boat, motorcycle trailer, max payload and drive up and down mountain roads every day. My driving style is Canadian (passive aggressive). So far no issues with the clutch. I ordered and paid for Center Force dual friction but they held back delivery for further development and I’m expecting to receive it in March. I’m looking forward to a heavier duty clutch for the feel and for longevity and reliability without the dark clutch cloud following me around.

 

[dakota.morgan91]

In one breath she states that it won’t reduce power or towing capacity, and in the next she says the complete opposite, subject to the occurrence of some totally undefined circumstances. The bottoms line, power will decrease if there is a trigger. What is the trigger? WTF knows. Do you have confidence that the trigger will be engineered properly?

“When the driver repeatedly slips the clutch” So.. if I’m driving in traffic we’re gonna go into limo mode?

She also states that those temperatures cannot be reached under normal circumstances and driving including offroading and towing. I mean the temps they are referencing are incredibly high and I would assume incredibly difficult to obtain. I know I have abused my fair share of vehicles in my youth and have never even heard of a clutch failure! Made one chatter from hot spots though! hahaha

A good question in my mind is how the computer is calculating the temp, which Happiator eluded to. I was preaching this since I saw this recall that there is no way that the truck has a clutch temp sensor and now that has been proven. Again being with how much slip would be necessary to reach those temps, I would have to assume they have that trigger's event set pretty high. Meaning it would need either a long duration of light slip to trigger or VERY heavy load/speed slip. Far above and beyond what we would put the truck through in any normal scenario.
The engineers must know the thermal rate of these materials since that has been studied heavily with the R&D of any friction material. With the knowledge at their fingertips, and the assumed dislike of lawsuits I am sure this will be reliably solved. After much pondering on the subject, I am going to continue with my order and stop worrying about this. Although I feel bad for those who lost their trucks and confidence in FCA, this could happen to any brand. We all need to chill a bit and just wait. I know I dont need more gray hairs! lmao

 

[dakota.morgan91]

I’m up here in the great white north (BC) and have had the JT 6spd for 10 months and ~18,000 miles. I run 35” in summer and 33.5” studded in winter with a 2” Mopar lift and 4:56 final gears (tossed the 3:73s). A Magnuson SC was installed last October without a dyno test because I was worried about the clutch. I’ve had the OEM clutch inspection and update. I tow a ski boat, motorcycle trailer, max payload and drive up and down mountain roads every day. My driving style is Canadian (passive aggressive). So far no issues with the clutch. I ordered and paid for Center Force dual friction but they held back delivery for further development and I’m expecting to receive it in March. I’m looking forward to a heavier duty clutch for the feel and for longevity and reliability without the dark clutch cloud following me around.

That's good to hear that things are holding up well with the charger! I have every intention to do this after the bumper to bumper warranty is up! How many miles have you put on with the charger? Man 4.56 gears AND the charger?! I bet that truck feels like a sports car!

 

[WXman]

The bitter irony here is that most people who bought a manual transmission in their JL or JT did so specifically because they wanted to avoid overly sophisticated electronic controls. For their trouble they ended up with a Jeep that will be programmed to kill power via electronic nannies to protect itself. Ahhh....the irony.

It's enough to make a guy cry. Price goes up, quality and engineering goes down.

 

[tjbrown23]

She also states that those temperatures cannot be reached under normal circumstances and driving including offroading and towing. I mean the temps they are referencing are incredibly high and I would assume incredibly difficult to obtain. I know I have abused my fair share of vehicles in my youth and have never even heard of a clutch failure! Made one chatter from hot spots though! hahaha

A good question in my mind is how the computer is calculating the temp, which Happiator eluded to. I was preaching this since I saw this recall that there is no way that the truck has a clutch temp sensor and now that has been proven. Again being with how much slip would be necessary to reach those temps, I would have to assume they have that trigger's event set pretty high. Meaning it would need either a long duration of light slip to trigger or VERY heavy load/speed slip. Far above and beyond what we would put the truck through in any normal scenario.
The engineers must know the thermal rate of these materials since that has been studied heavily with the R&D of any friction material. With the knowledge at their fingertips, and the assumed dislike of lawsuits I am sure this will be reliably solved. After much pondering on the subject, I am going to continue with my order and stop worrying about this. Although I feel bad for those who lost their trucks and confidence in FCA, this could happen to any brand. We all need to chill a bit and just wait. I know I dont need more gray hairs! lmao

Your spot on, I hope you follow through with the manual you'll love it! I have said the same things before and got trashed about it. These engineers know what they are doing and can program an algorithm to calculate the temps based on various sensors before and after the clutch assembly. This won't impact anyone during normal driving, including offroading and towing and only prevent catastrophic failure at extreme temp levels. In the meantime I will continue to drive my lifted brick on 37s like it was a hellcat and with a big smile on my face!

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