Was the Driver a Member? [⚠️ Admin Warning: NO POLITICS]

[ShadowsPapa]

Fortunately I live downtown, but just 30 minutes away the wait times can get very long. That's the nature of cities. Resources are placed where they are most needed.

First example - town of 7,000. Takes 10 minutes to drive from edge to edge following all speed limits and stopping at signs.
There was another time I called (when the garage had been broken into) and the Perry police arrived in 5 minutes. The guy said he was only blocks away finishing up another call.

The other - we live in unincorporated Polk County - the cuts to their staffing have been huge, and there's not a lot of reason for the sheriff to hang out in our area most of the time. But 45 minutes for an ambulance? Runnells is 4 miles away, Pleasant Hill - maybe 6 or 7. Both have "first responders".

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[WestwallNF104A]

First example - town of 7,000. Takes 10 minutes to drive from edge to edge following all speed limits and stopping at signs.
There was another time I called (when the garage had been broken into) and the Perry police arrived in 5 minutes. The guy said he was only blocks away finishing up another call.

The other - we live in unincorporated Polk County - the cuts to their staffing have been huge, and there's not a lot of reason for the sheriff to hang out in our area most of the time. But 45 minutes for an ambulance? Runnells is 4 miles away, Pleasant Hill - maybe 6 or 7. Both have "first responders".

Be thankful you don't live in the UK. I read recently that while the goal is for a response in 10 minutes is the goal, 40 minutes is the average. 120 minutes in worse case scenarios.

In Wales I saw that a couple of times the response time was 96 HOURS!

 

[Zachanadandy]

Yeah, but those came about from very different circumstances. Due process, rights of all, it all comes into play. Those were more "inside private homes" sorts of things. Restraining orders, child beating and so on. Police can only do so much there, or they risk stepping on constitutionally protected rights of all people.
If you look at the cases that were involved, pretty different from what's talked about here.

That's not at all how I read those decisions. "not to ensure the state protects them from each other, so the county was not liable."
They basically said the constitution doesn't require the police to protect you, enforce restraining orders, or in general do their job at all. The constitution only limits the states ability to violate your rights. The state isn't obligated to protect you or your rights at all.

 

[Crane]

Again, not anti-gun. I'm just saying seems like there's a lot of people getting ants in there pants wanting to go out and "put someone in their place" by showing off their hardware. I'd rather just glide on down the road and make sure I'm not near these crazies when they decide they've been wronged.

I will concede (in the snarkiest troll way possible) that state to state this likely varies greatly when it comes to police. I realize many of you I'm debating with are in some of the far west states I'm unfamiliar with. In NJ, police have a duty to act and are usually held accountable by courts if they don't.

Again, thats why I don't feel the need to carry. Even though I like guns and shooting them. Our taxes pay for a pretty comprehensive level of police help. And I think they're good at it so I don't get involved with playing cops and robbers.

But when the world ends I'll try to ham radio àll of you guys toting to protect me from the raiders. Until then, I'll make sure you don't follow me if I forget to use a blinker.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

That's not at all how I read those decisions. "not to ensure the state protects them from each other, so the county was not liable."
They basically said the constitution doesn't require the police to protect you, enforce restraining orders, or in general do their job at all. The constitution only limits the states ability to violate your rights. The state isn't obligated to protect you or your rights at all.

While true, and our constitution says zip about guaranteed protection, protection and security of citizens is the sole purpose of government. But courts aren't allowed to even address that - they are constrained by the constitution and written laws, not concepts.

 

[GeneralMaximus]

While true, and our constitution says zip about guaranteed protection, protection and security of citizens is the sole purpose of government. But courts aren't allowed to even address that - they are constrained by the constitution and written laws, not concepts.

Exactly. The supreme court ruled that the police are there to protect the public, not the individual. We have the 2A for that

 

[Zachanadandy]

Again, not anti-gun. I'm just saying seems like there's a lot of people getting ants in there pants wanting to go out and "put someone in their place" by showing off their hardware. I'd rather just glide on down the road and make sure I'm not near these crazies when they decide they've been wronged.

I will concede (in the snarkiest troll way possible) that state to state this likely varies greatly when it comes to police. I realize many of you I'm debating with are in some of the far west states I'm unfamiliar with. In NJ, police have a duty to act and are usually held accountable by courts if they don't.

Again, thats why I don't feel the need to carry. Even though I like guns and shooting them. Our taxes pay for a pretty comprehensive level of police help. And I think they're good at it so I don't get involved with playing cops and robbers.

But when the world ends I'll try to ham radio àll of you guys toting to protect me from the raiders. Until then, I'll make sure you don't follow me if I forget to use a blinker.

The vast majority of those who carry have the same mindset I do. The last thing I want to do is have to shoot someone. I avoid conflict and crazies far more when I am armed. Nobody is showing off their hardware (unless you want to see the gun collection but that's a different topic for a different forum). Our CA home is in a small town that doesn't even have our own police force. County sheriff's are around, but the only time I've ever called them (non-emergency situation fortunately) they came by to take the report the next day. Our AZ property is 45 minutes from town and 20 miles out a dirt road. There are no address markers or road signs out on the dirt section. I don't know if they'd find the property in days if I called. And there's no cell service or phone lines out there so I couldn't call anyway. So yes, completely different life styles. I 100% need to be able to protect, defend, triage, and even transport my own family by any means necessary. From defense tools to first aid kits to water our vehicles never go anywhere unprepared. I've used the fire extinguisher once, the first aid kits several times including to help random people involved in an accident, even the winch on the freeway once to right a rolled over truck and trailer that were blocking both lanes before the police or tow companies ever showed up. I've used my cordless impact numerous times to help random motorists with flat tires. I've yet to need to use one of the firearms fortunately.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Exactly. The supreme court ruled that the police are there to protect the public, not the individual. We have the 2A for that

No need for locks, keys, fences or anything else if we all had individual protection like some hire for themselves.

I get a real kick out of some of the 911 calls that actual real people make demanding police "do something".
There's a neighborhood site that I've used in the past to give things away (firewood and so on) and I really love it when "why aren't the police doing something about this guy" posts come up. The guy is wandering around "looking suspicious". Seriously? What are they do to? Stop staring out your window!
I have at times responded to such stupidity by asking exactly what the police are supposed to do, harass the guy for looking suspicious? Lock your doors, get a dog, whatever.

 

[GeneralMaximus]

No need for locks, keys, fences or anything else if we all had individual protection like some hire for themselves.

I get a real kick out of some of the 911 calls that actual real people make demanding police "do something".
There's a neighborhood site that I've used in the past to give things away (firewood and so on) and I really love it when "why aren't the police doing something about this guy" posts come up. The guy is wandering around "looking suspicious". Seriously? What are they do to? Stop staring out your window!
I have at times responded to such stupidity by asking exactly what the police are supposed to do, harass the guy for looking suspicious? Lock your doors, get a dog, whatever.

It’s the bored neighbors with nothing else to do, making those calls. I used to have one like that, except she would just look out the window all day and text the neighborhood when something looked out of place. And you know what? I actually started to appreciate the one woman Neighborhood Watch!

 

[ShadowsPapa]

It’s the bored neighbors with nothing else to do, making those calls. I used to have one like that, except she would just look out the window all day and text the neighborhood when something looked out of place. And you know what? I actually started to appreciate the one woman Neighborhood Watch!

years ago, before our neighbor lady got dementia, she knew everything in the neighborhood - knew most of the vehicles that drove by and so on. And yes, we appreciated that. Not so sure my brother did, though. One weekend while we were gone, my brother pulled into our driveway - not knowing we were gone. Neighbor came running out of their house toward our driveway and started asking him who he was, why he was there, and some way to prove it. Some say my younger brother looks like me....... apparently she didn't see it. She scared the crap out of him. I don't know if she told him "my husband has guns" or what, but my brother left pretty quickly.

 

[GeneralMaximus]

years ago, before our neighbor lady got dementia, she knew everything in the neighborhood - knew most of the vehicles that drove by and so on. And yes, we appreciated that. Not so sure my brother did, though. One weekend while we were gone, my brother pulled into our driveway - not knowing we were gone. Neighbor came running out of their house toward our driveway and started asking him who he was, why he was there, and some way to prove it. Some say my younger brother looks like me....... apparently she didn't see it. She scared the crap out of him. I don't know if she told him "my husband has guns" or what, but my brother left pretty quickly.

well that’s a little bit on you then, for not giving her a heads up that your brother would be coming by!

 

[ShadowsPapa]

well that’s a little bit on you then, for not giving her a heads up that your brother would be coming by!

I had no clue he would be coming by - or I'd have told him I wouldn't be there, don't bother.
It was a surprise thing - he so very rarely ever came out this way, let alone to my place.

It's on my brother - for not calling "hey, are you going to be home?"

 

[Hootbro]

 

[Zachanadandy]

And they are hard to conceal.

 

[LouisvEarlleJT]

Bad people are bad people all of the time.

By this logic, bad people are bad before they commit their first bad act. Therefore all people are bad (or about to be bad).

Kind of sounds like the logic a certain uses to deploy the national guard.

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