Which Lift Kit to Pick From

[ShadowsPapa]

People don't run Clayton because they are a sponsor, that's an Evo apologists view.

People run Clayton because they're great and overdeliver.

He was saying because they are a sponsor many people DO run them......... (and I personally took that as meaning "one reason people here run them")
His quote -
>>I like Evo... But you’ll get a lot of bias on here because Clayton is a sponsor on the site, so lots of guys run them on here. <<

He didn't say they 'don't run Clayton because they are a sponsor' as you stated.

Personally, I look at sponsors first, see how happy I am with what I see, and if I am, then I start comparing them to other folks....... Being a sponsor only makes me look at a sponsor first because there is a presence that's easy to contact, if there's a problem they want it corrected faster because they are right here - bad publicity for a sponsor isn't good, it's more quickly resolved in my experience. IT doesn't mean that's what I'd do if I found better for MY needs elsewhere, but it means I'd look first and strongly until or unless I found otherwise.

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[chickenbill77]

One thing I will offer to you and any other "noob" based on my experiences and those of my friends. Jeeps. Jeeping, overlanding. Whatever is very much subject to incrementalism or scope creep. What you envision today as your endpoint may be nowhere close to where you are in a year, 3 years etc. I was delighted in my cj5 bone stock in 1974, but maybe some chrome reverse or "mags" would be nice...but then tires got bigger maybe some 11x15s, yeah... point is that not long ago 35s were huge and the limit for a street able rig....you get my point I'm sure

So, unless you're like me and circling the drain you might consider whether you go EVO or Clayton or Bob's lifts are us as stage 1 and just the beginning of your adventure. Your system will evolve and change over time, or YOU will and you'll move on to dirt bikes or muscle cars etc. So if 37s are your current desire, get the best stuff you can to support running 37s, dont scrimp! But try to get parts that can grow with you, control arms etc.

I'd not start with a 4.5" kit if youv e not driven lifted 4x4s before but that's me, bottom line is you wont likely notice the difference between any of the kits until you use it and see how yours compares with others then you modify, adapt, and overcome.

Sorry for the verbosity and if I sound preachy.

thank you so much! this is super useful and exactly what I'm looking for, great to hear. knowing that I won't feel the difference is probably one of the most useful things I've heard. I have had absolutely no experience driving 4x4's or really anything for that matter. I think that I'm pretty set on the 37"s and 4.5" but this is a great perspective. I'm working on a budget but don't want to cheap out on a lift because I think that as soon as I have the capability I will want to push it off-road. thank you for this opinion!

 

[j.o.y.ride]

He was saying because they are a sponsor many people DO run them......... (and I personally took that as meaning "one reason people here run them")
His quote -
>>I like Evo... But you’ll get a lot of bias on here because Clayton is a sponsor on the site, so lots of guys run them on here. <<

He didn't say they 'don't run Clayton because they are a sponsor' as you stated.

Personally, I look at sponsors first, see how happy I am with what I see, and if I am, then I start comparing them to other folks....... Being a sponsor only makes me look at a sponsor first because there is a presence that's easy to contact, if there's a problem they want it corrected faster because they are right here - bad publicity for a sponsor isn't good, it's more quickly resolved in my experience. IT doesn't mean that's what I'd do if I found better for MY needs elsewhere, but it means I'd look first and strongly until or unless I found otherwise.

I understand what he was saying. "They don't run Clayton because they are a sponsor" i.e. they run them for other reasons. They run them because they are great and over-deliver.

 

[ttn333]

I've been making the comparison between Clayton 2.5" overland plus ($2200) vs Evo 2.5" enforcer overland stage 3 plus. ($2250). The Evo is about $50 more and lacks the front upper control arm and rear lower control arm. It's pretty hard to ignore the cost difference between the two. A comparable setup for Evo is about $2800. If the quality is similar, and I think it is, I'm leaning toward the Clayton setup.

 

[j.o.y.ride]

I've been making the comparison between Clayton 2.5" overland plus ($2200) vs Evo 2.5" enforcer overland stage 3 plus. ($2250). The Evo is about $50 more and lacks the front upper control arm and rear lower control arm. It's pretty hard to ignore the cost difference between the two. A comparable setup for Evo is about $2800. If the quality is similar, and I think it is, I'm leaning toward the Clayton setup.

Don't overlook the fact the Clayton springs are progressive rate. Looks like Evo are not.

 

[bastage]

I've been making the comparison between Clayton 2.5" overland plus ($2200) vs Evo 2.5" enforcer overland stage 3 plus. ($2250). The Evo is about $50 more and lacks the front upper control arm and rear lower control arm. It's pretty hard to ignore the cost difference between the two. A comparable setup for Evo is about $2800. If the quality is similar, and I think it is, I'm leaning toward the Clayton setup.

Somewhere here I have a spreadsheet posted with this info. I also have it priced with the Evo stage 1 Plus & then adding the Clayton arms which is cheaper then the full Evo if you really want their springs.

Quality is very subjective. But I figured it based on the front lower control arms & specifically the materials used.

MetalCloak - 1.5" round 3/16" thick
Evo - 1.75" round 5/16" thick
Clayton - 2" square 1/4" thick (4/16" for anyone not used to working with fractions)

So the Evo Arms are thicker material then clayton, but the Clayton is bigger diameter & square.

Material weight per foot (using https://www.twmetals.com/resources/calculators.html)
MetalCloak - 2.62 lb
Evo - 4.8 lb
Clayton - 5.95 lb

I am including metal cloak as they are very popular & this weight goes to show, just how overkill both Evo & Clayton are

 

[Alabama Mud Machine]

Don't overlook the fact the Clayton springs are progressive rate. Looks like Evo are not.

"Looks like", or they are... Are two different things...

 

[j.o.y.ride]

This is 2.5" Clayton lift (more like 3.5+) and 35s next to a 6'2" person. Running boards at my knee now.

 

[Aberk]

This is 2.5" Clayton lift (more like 3.5+) and 35s next to a 6'2" person. Running boards at my knee now.

I felt this way when I dropped my truck off the jack stands after installing the 3.5". I stood next to it and thought.Whoa, glad I installed the Rock Slide Engineering steps already.

Request for anyone with a stock Rubicon... Can you measure the height of the top of the bed rail? I was too giddy and excited to get the install started that I forgot to take before measurements.

 

[PyrPatriot]

A wise man once said, "never eliminate the possibility for a Clayton Overland Plus Kit". We're always available to talk if anybody ever has any questions! Shop number is (203) 691 8593 or shoot us a PM!

Are your guys' lifts maintaining payload rates? My biggest hesitation (after price) for a lift on my JT is losing the 1550lbs payload and accompanying tow rating from the rear progressive springs that are a big reason for Jeep's payload rating with the Sport Max Tow package

Also, Metalcloak seems to recommend a driveshaft for a 3.5" lift due to the degree of changed geometry (pun intended), what are your thoughts?

Don't overlook the fact the Clayton springs are progressive rate. Looks like Evo are not.

Is progressive the same as "triple rate"?

 

[Clayton Off Road]

Are your guys' lifts maintaining payload rates? My biggest hesitation (after price) for a lift on my JT is losing the 1550lbs payload and accompanying tow rating from the rear progressive springs that are a big reason for Jeep's payload rating with the Sport Max Tow package

Also, Metalcloak seems to recommend a driveshaft for a 3.5" lift due to the degree of changed geometry (pun intended), what are your thoughts?




Is progressive the same as "triple rate"?

Yes Progressive rate springs are just any multi rate spring, so could mean dual rate or triple rate. In the case of our JT rear coil springs they are a triple rate design

 

[PyrPatriot]

Yes Progressive rate springs are just any multi rate spring, so could mean dual rate or triple rate. In the case of our JT rear coil springs they are a triple rate design

First I am hearing of "Progressive rate springs are just any multi rate spring". I seem to recall Jeep specifically distinguishing their Rubicon dual-rate springs from the Sport Max Tow Progressive rate springs. Both have different product numbers and different looks.


What about the driveshaft? Do you offer one to go with your kits? I'm leaning towards you guys given the extra weight/thickness of your parts. Did you test your kits with payloads? Metalcloak said they put 1600lbs in the bed and drove it, though it was riding on the bumpstops. Will look through emails to post screencap shortly

 

[Clayton Off Road]

First I am hearing of "Progressive rate springs are just any multi rate spring". I seem to recall Jeep specifically distinguishing their Rubicon dual-rate springs from the Sport Max Tow Progressive rate springs. Both have different product numbers and different looks.


What about the driveshaft? Do you offer one to go with your kits? I'm leaning towards you guys given the extra weight/thickness of your parts. Did you test your kits with payloads? Metalcloak said they put 1600lbs in the bed and drove it, though it was riding on the bumpstops. Will look through emails to post screencap shortly

As for the spring rate question, it gets confusing, generally multi rate coil springs are referred to as progressive rate coil springs, but really a true progressive rate coil spring gradually changes the rate through the spring, and a dual or triple rate coil spring actually just suddenly has the rates change on the coil. I know that this sounds confusing, but that's why generally they are referred to as progressive or multi rate springs because its one of those things that sort of lost its meaning over time. True progressive rate springs are not very common either.

We do utilize a much higher spring rate than most other manufacturers, and therefor our kits are able to handle a really good amount of weight. We have some guys who have 4 to 500 lbs of weight on or in the bed and the truck sits level loaded up, while some others in the 7 to 900 lbs range throw in a small spacer in order keep some rake in their overlanding builds.

Replacing the front driveshaft is always recommended, but is only absolutely necessary if you plan on wheeling and flexing the vehicle out a lot. Other than that you would be able to get away with the factory unit for a while without issue.

Hope this helps.

 

[PyrPatriot]

As for the spring rate question, it gets confusing, generally multi rate coil springs are referred to as progressive rate coil springs, but really a true progressive rate coil spring gradually changes the rate through the spring, and a dual or triple rate coil spring actually just suddenly has the rates change on the coil. I know that this sounds confusing, but that's why generally they are referred to as progressive or multi rate springs because its one of those things that sort of lost its meaning over time. True progressive rate springs are not very common either.

We do utilize a much higher spring rate than most other manufacturers, and therefor our kits are able to handle a really good amount of weight. We have some guys who have 4 to 500 lbs of weight on or in the bed and the truck sits level loaded up, while some others in the 7 to 900 lbs range throw in a small spacer in order keep some rake in their overlanding builds.

Replacing the front driveshaft is always recommended, but is only absolutely necessary if you plan on wheeling and flexing the vehicle out a lot. Other than that you would be able to get away with the factory unit for a while without issue.

Hope this helps.

It does, thank you. Do you offer a driveshaft, as I wheel fairly regularly

 

[bastage]

First I am hearing of "Progressive rate springs are just any multi rate spring". I seem to recall Jeep specifically distinguishing their Rubicon dual-rate springs from the Sport Max Tow Progressive rate springs. Both have different product numbers and different looks.


What about the driveshaft? Do you offer one to go with your kits? I'm leaning towards you guys given the extra weight/thickness of your parts. Did you test your kits with payloads? Metalcloak said they put 1600lbs in the bed and drove it, though it was riding on the bumpstops. Will look through emails to post screencap shortly

This is not the best picture, but the Gray JT on the left has MetalCloak 3.5" rear coils and 37's. The Red JT on the right has the Clayton 2.5" rear coils & 35's. Look at how much higher the tail lights on the red one are. The Clayton coils are taller & stiffer. I haven't had mine (the red one) squat yet. I haven't had a ton of weight in the back yet, but the factory coils (Max Tow) I had showing some sag with just tires/wheels in the back. To do over again the only thing I would of done different with my lift is I would of probably gotten the 3.5" (the gray one has had its rear coils changed out to the Clayton 3.5" since this picture was taken & it looks really good).

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