Diesel cooling options and ideas

[biodiesel]

bottom line, I want this jeep to last and do what it’s built for without slowly dying every time I use it.

I think you'll notice a dramatic difference once you drop your towing speeds. The oil-bypass filter is a smart idea. I also recommend a water wetter. I run Amsoil Coolant Boost.

Deleting is illegal, so that becomes a moral and ethical decision. I personally own three EcoDiesel trucks (2015 Ram, 2020 Ram, and 2023 Jeep Gladiator) and all three are bone stock. The downside is that I'll have to spend money on EGR coolers, DPFs, SCRs, DEF Pumps, DEF injectors, NOx Sensors, etc. that others who fully delete won't have to worry about. With that said, most of these parts will last 100,000 - 150,000 miles before they need to be replaced.

But I understand the hot ambient temperature situation. It was 117*F when we were towing through the Mojave Desert (Needles, California) two years ago. Three weeks ago, it was 92*F when we were towing through the Chihuahuan Desert (southern New Mexico). Then it was 29*F with 4" inches of snow on the ground last week when towing through northern New Mexico. We've logged approximately 1,160 miles of towing in the last month.

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[Ericshere03]

I think you'll notice a dramatic difference once you drop your towing speeds. The oil-bypass filter is a smart idea. I also recommend a water wetter. I run Amsoil Coolant Boost.

Deleting is illegal, so that becomes a moral and ethical decision. I personally own three EcoDiesel trucks (2015 Ram, 2020 Ram, and 2023 Jeep Gladiator) and all three are bone stock. The downside is that I'll have to spend money on EGR coolers, DPFs, SCRs, DEF Pumps, DEF injectors, NOx Sensors, etc. that others who fully delete won't have to worry about. With that said, most of these parts will last 100,000 - 150,000 miles before they need to be replaced.

But I understand the hot ambient temperature situation. It was 117*F when we were towing through the Mojave Desert (Needles, California) two years ago. Three weeks ago, it was 92*F when we were towing through the Chihuahuan Desert (southern New Mexico). Then it was 29*F with 4" inches of snow on the ground last week when towing through northern New Mexico. We've logged approximately 1,160 miles of towing in the last month.

Awe da pup

awe yea, dropped down to 35mph and temps were only 235/255 down from a peak of 244/264 … I just can’t see those spikes being good for us.

I go back and fourth with the emissions thing, GDE seems to be good, but these emissions literally makes emissions worse so they can make emissions better all while destroying the engine. Not 100% sure on that. But regear and aux cooler are a must. Unfortunately I have a steel bumper, so I gotta get creative or remove the bottom skid pan … AEV makes a Nice bumper with holes .

I appreciate your love for the southwest deserts. Took my wife from SoCal to my hometown in Phoenix, and shocked how well she acclimated. So cal is great to visit, but input in my 10 years, I’m glad to be home. I’m a desert rat.

how often, between the 3 vehicles are you dinking with the emissions equipment? part of me is entertaining buying a super long Mopar warranty and GDE tune (I already have the cloned PCM).

Oh! BTW: I have a DEF leak which parts are back ordered, and was left stranded, no start refill DEF message. Luckily my jeep was in my garage when the code popped up, and also lucky I was traveling back from Mexico (Rocky point) and took a case of DEF juice with me. But I hate the whole idea of all this control.

 

[biodiesel]

Awe da pup

Yeah, his name is Diesel. He is spoiled beyond belief.

awe yea, dropped down to 35mph and temps were only 235/255 down from a peak of 244/264 … I just can’t see those spikes being good for us.

Perfect! So, you can see where managing speed is crucial. You will want to taper off the throttle before you get into the climb. That gives you more time to manage oil temps before reaching the crest. I've seen my oil temps really drop when I'm towing in 4th gear at 20 - 25 mph, especially on those long steep mountain passes.

According to those with knowledge, Pennzoil Platinum can handle 270*F all day long, so keep that in mind. Personally, I try to keep my peak oil temps under 250*F, which is fairly easy to do in the 2020 Ram EcoDiesel, but takes a little more effort on my part when towing with the 2015 Ram EcoDiesel.

I appreciate your love for the southwest deserts. Took my wife from SoCal to my hometown in Phoenix, and shocked how well she acclimated. So cal is great to visit, but input in my 10 years, I’m glad to be home. I’m a desert rat.

I'm a mountain man, but I do enjoy the American Southwest including the deserts. We own mountain property at 7,100' feet, but we've considered a second home either in southern New Mexico or southern Arizona.

how often, between the 3 vehicles are you dinking with the emissions equipment?

We bought the 2023 Jeep Gladiator in April. It has 1,200 miles. So far, it's been flawless.

The 2020 Ram 1500 is used almost exclusively for towing. It now has 45,000 miles on the odometer. It's also been flawless. We've towed through New Mexico, Arizona, California, Nevada, Utah, Colorado, Texas, Kansas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Missouri, and Illinois.

The 2015 Ram 1500 is a daily driver, but it has towed through New Mexico, Arizona, California, Nevada, Utah, Colorado, Texas, Kansas, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Missouri, Illinois, Louisiana, Mississippi, Tennessee, Alamba, Georgia, and Florida. We also have a side business doing fire mitigation and landscaping, so it's got a dump trailer and or equipment trailer behind it often. Here's the repair log so far:

Date	Mileage	Part Description	Part #	Cost
02/11/21	92,313	Water Pump	68211202AB	Powertrain Warranty
08/10/21	96,304	Front Shocks Rear Shocks	Bilstein 24-187343 4600 series Bilstein 24-187350 4600 series Labor	$204.00 per pair $152.00 per pair $280.00
09/01/21	97,036	Lower Ball Joints	N/A Labor Wheel Alignment	$199.90 $211.46 $119.95
07/20/22	105,715	Driver side CV Axle	Mopar 68028398AC Labor	$381.89 $211.80
08/27/22	106,964	Rear Cab Exhausters	Mopar 68323649AB	$12.44 per pair
10/28/22	109,119	Battery	Odyssey AGM49H8L5	$312.46
09/15/23	113,732	NOx Sensor - upstream NOx Sensor - downstream	Mopar 68250217AB Mopar 68250214AB	AEM Warranty AEM Warranty
09/27/23	114,118	DEF Injector DEF Pump	Mopar 68438682AA Mopar 68232842AD	AEM Warranty AEM Warranty
11/21/23	115,542	EGR Valve Cooler Bushing x 2 EGR Tube Gasket x 2 O-ring x 2	Mopar 68483334AA Mopar 68490221AA Mopar 68211320AA Mopar 68150060AA	AEM Warranty AEM Warranty AEM Warranty AEM Warranty
02/05/24	118,626	Taillight Blinker Bulb	Sylvania 3157	$16.26 per pair

 

[biodiesel]

Oh! BTW: I have a DEF leak which parts are back ordered, and was left stranded, no start refill DEF message. Luckily my jeep was in my garage when the code popped up, and also lucky I was traveling back from Mexico (Rocky point) and took a case of DEF juice with me. But I hate the whole idea of all this control.

Where is it leaking DEF? That's pretty rare if it's leaking. If there's a leak in the system (e.g., cracked line), then you might get a P20E8 code. That's what I got when my DEF pump failed at 113,732 miles.

 

[Escape.idiocracy]

how often, between the 3 vehicles are you dinking with the emissions equipment? part of me is entertaining buying a super long Mopar warranty and GDE tune (I already have the cloned PCM).

Longer warranty? Powertrain is covered for 5y/100k. They sell a longer one?

Though I’d argue most of the long term issues will arise from maintaining/keeping the parts that when removed void it….

 

[biodiesel]

Longer warranty? Powertrain is covered for 5y/100k. They sell a longer one?

You can pay for an extended Powertrain Warranty, but you have to read the fine print. Ram offered me an 8 year/125,000-mile Mopar Max Care Powertrain Warranty but it doesn't cover some diesel parts such as the EGR Cooler and DPF.

I have a 7 year/100,000-mile bumper to bumper warranty on the 2023 Jeep Gladiator. I'll hit 7 years before I hit 100,000 miles, but at least I've got some protection for 7 years.

 

[MaximusTX]

part of me is entertaining buying a super long Mopar warranty and GDE tune (I already have the cloned PCM).

You can pay for an extended Powertrain Warranty, but you have to read the fine print. Ram offered me an 8 year or 125,000-mile Mopar Max Care Powertrain Warranty but it doesn't cover some diesel parts such as the EGR Cooler and DPF.

I have a 7 year/100,000-mile bumper to bumper warranty on the 2023 Jeep Gladiator. I'll hit 7 years before I hit 100,000 miles, but at least I've got some protection for 7 years.

I was looking at the extended warranty just for the emissions coverage but found that it does not cover any of the EGR or DPF equipment and is specifically excluded from it and from the oem powertrain warranty. I tried finding the actual PDF for Maxcare but couldn't locate it but actually list all exclusions.

 

[Ericshere03]

I was looking at the extended warranty just for the emissions coverage but found that it does not cover any of the EGR or DPF equipment and is specifically excluded from it and from the oem powertrain warranty. I tried finding the actual PDF for Maxcare but couldn't locate it but actually list all exclusions.

That’s great info for myself and the rest of the readers here … pretty cheesy they exclude it from the maximum care, in my mind maximum care was bumper to bumper. GUESS NOT!

I’d argue that value still, DPF is just one part of this whole emissions stack.

 

[MaximusTX]

That’s great info for myself and the rest of the readers here … pretty cheesy they exclude it from the maximum care, in my mind maximum care was bumper to bumper. GUESS NOT!

I’d argue that value still, DPF is just one part of this whole emissions stack.

Yeah, I am sure it does still have value for certain people. Mine is highly modified and the only thing stock on it is the Engine and Trans and even then the engine has modifications but those can be easily reversed if needed. My local dealer has no issues doing warranty work on mine even though it has a permanent AUX Battery delete on it and even replaced the main battery under warranty but told me the extended warranty would be waste of money as most of the claims would be denied because of the modifications to the vehicle. On the cooling issues I just recently took a 3,000 mile trip from TX up to Idaho and back. Didn't tow anything but I did notice that on some of the larger passes I had to slow way down as the temps started to go up pretty fast if I kept going 75mph. If I slowed to around 50mph the temps went back to normal. I never got a derating but I watched the gauges going up all hills and if they started creeping up I would just slow down. I also have a 6.5inch lift, 1ton axles, 4..88 gears and 42inch tires.

 

[biodiesel]

I was looking at the extended warranty just for the emissions coverage but found that it does not cover any of the EGR or DPF equipment

That's correct and what I said in the post you quoted.

and is specifically excluded from it and from the oem powertrain warranty.

The EGR Cooler is covered under the standard 3 year/36,000-mile bumper to bumper warranty, however, the DPF is covered under the 5 year/100,000 mile powertrain warranty.

 

[biodiesel]

That’s great info for myself and the rest of the readers here … pretty cheesy they exclude it from the maximum care, in my mind maximum care was bumper to bumper. GUESS NOT!

If you buy the extended bumper-to-bumper warranty, then the EGR Cooler is covered, but only up to 100,000 miles. My 7 year/100,000-mile bumper-to-bumper warranty covers the EGR and DPF for that length of time. It's when you extend your warranty to 115,000 miles or 125,000 miles is when they do not cover the EGR Cooler and DPF.

It gets confusing because there are different types of Max Care warranties.

 

[MaximusTX]

If you buy the extended bumper-to-bumper warranty, then the EGR Cooler is covered, but only up to 100,000 miles. My 7 year/100,000-mile bumper-to-bumper warranty covers the EGR and DPF for that length of time. It's when you extend your warranty to 115,000 miles or 125,000 miles is when they do not cover the EGR Cooler and DPF.

It gets confusing because there are different types of Max Care warranties.

I could be wrong but I don't think they offer the Bumper to Bumper warranty anymore. They may call it bumper to bumper warranty but it definitely is not as their is always that fine print. We looked at it for my wife's 392 and got it but opted out for my Gladiator as their were a lot of exclusions on what it would not cover on the Diesel's.

 

[biodiesel]

I could be wrong but I don't think they offer the Bumper to Bumper warranty anymore. They may call it bumper to bumper warranty but it definitely is not as their is always that fine print. We looked at it for my wife's 392 and got it but opted out for my Gladiator as their were a lot of exclusions on what it would not cover on the Diesel's.

There are different types of Max Care, which is where much of the confusion comes in. There's the standard Maximum Care, Added Care Plus, Powertrain Care and Powertrain Care Plus. My dealer uses the bumper-to-bumper language so that I can better understand what he's talking about, but that's not what it's called in the system.

When we bought our Jeep in April, they had a 'bumper-to-bumper' for up to 8 years/100,000 miles. I paid for the 7 year/100,000 mile since it was a fairly hefty jump to add the additional year, or at least I thought so at the time. But I was told that the bumper-to-bumper coverage in the extended warranty stops at 100,000 miles. The diesels can be warrantied up to 125,000 miles, but that's when even more parts are excluded.

I know that Mopar changed some of their warranties back in the summer, but I don't know what those changes are. So perhaps the bumper-to-bumper has been further restricted.

I also have a 5 year/100,000-mile bumper-to-bumper warranty on my 2020 Ram EcoDiesel. The dealer called it a 'wrap'. That's where they take the factory 3 year/36,000-mile bumper-to-bumper and wrap it into the 5 year/100,000-mile warranty.

I also had the same 5 year/100,000-mile bumper-to-bumper on my 2015 EcoDiesel. I had the EGR Cooler replaced at around 40,000 miles, but since I had the extended bumper-to-bumper warranty, it was covered.

Also worth noting, the bumper-to-bumper also covers a rental. And according to my dealer, they are supposed to give me a rental that matches what I'm driving. So, if you can believe this, the first time they got me a 2500 Hemi from Enterprise. The second time, Enterprise didn't have any trucks, so they let me loan out a new 2500 Cummins.

 

[Primer Gray]

Generally speaking, I encourage people who plan to do a lot of towing to stay within 70% of the maximum rated capacity to ensure a positive towing experience. The 3rd gen EcoDiesel in the Jeep is unique in that the maximum tow rating is limited by cooling rather than the axle, suspension, chassis, etc. It was the same way in the 2014 - 2019 Ram trucks. The Hemi had a higher tow rating than the EcoDiesel simply due to cooling restrictions.

Staying within that 70% capacity is more of a guideline than a rule, but it does give truck buyers a good starting point when choosing trucks and trim levels. For example, my 2023 Rubicon EcoDiesel is rated for 6,000 lbs of towing capacity. If I were to follow the 70% guideline, then I would want to keep my towing loads at 4,200 lbs or under.

I don't want to pick on @steelponycowboy too much, but he claims to only be towing 2,600 lbs. But if you look at his Rubicon, he's running a lift kit with taller (heavier) tires. Both of those deviations from the factory specification are not ideal for towing and running cooler temperatures. He also has some type of camper shell/rooftop apparatus in his profile picture that will further add additional strain to the engine. It would be interesting to know what his payload is when towing.

Just a follow up with our direct experience two weeks ago…

We pulled our fully loaded 6300lb travel trailer, about 900lb of cargo in the bed, and 4 passengers in the cab over the I70 eastbound Eisenhower pass in Colorado (aka IKE gauntlet, just under 12,000 feet elevation).

The whole experience was velvety smooth.. there were a few grades that had the truck maxed out at 45mph, but those were short..

Average speed was comfortably in the 50’s for the majority of the climb from Denver to the summit.

Coolant maxed out at 243, oil maxed out at 276.. so it definitely got really hot but we did not experience an extreme derate or any mil lights which exceeded my expectations before hitting the grades.

Super happy with results from upgrading to the 24’ grill/Mishimoto radiator/BPD auxiliary cooling unit/Yukon 4.56 gears w/35” Wildpeak tires/4.5” Metalcloak lift w/evo 4.5” HD springs and inner spring airbags in the rear.

I am swapping out the BPB aux cooler for a slightly larger unit to see if it is possible to get even better control over the temps when towing…

I monitored EGT via a Banks Supergauge during the trip, and the computer seemed to be more concerned with the exhaust temp passing 1.5k degrees than the oil or coolant temps.. I could watch the fuel rail pressure reduce as soon as 1.5-1.6k EGT were reached..

Interesting how different everyone is experiencing this issue..

 

[rubicon4wheeler]

I monitored EGT via a Banks Supergauge during the trip, and the computer seemed to be more concerned with the exhaust temp passing 1.5k degrees than the oil or coolant temps.. I could watch the fuel rail pressure reduce as soon as 1.5-1.6k EGT were reached..

I'm curious what specifically you've set your Banks gauge to monitor.

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